By Ted Belman
PM Netanyahu made the case by saying despite the heavy price,
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“not entering the (peace) process will also exact a price. Entering the process will advance Israel’s strategic interests. Any provocation on the part of the Palestinians will stop the release (of prisoners).”
The last sentence can be ignored. Are not the daily incitement and treating the terrorists as heroes, provocations?
So what are our “strategic interests”?
I believe that the US and the EU demanded that Israel not only release the prisoner’s but also accept ’67 lines with swaps as the basis for negotiations. They threatened to escalate the pressure on Israel until it gives in to their demands. Both the EU and the US are committed to the Arabs to force Israel to return to the ’67 lines and have been since the Rogers Plan in 1970.
No doubt they offered all kinds of incentives to Israel should she agree to such an agreement.
But one incentive I doubt they offered was to take down Iran’s nuclear program.
I wonder if the Cabinet had a frank discussion on Israel’s strategic interests or just took it as a given that such interests required it.
Mladen Andrijasevic Said:
I think they apologised to turkey at the request of Obama wrt the US/NATO/Israel defense/radar network that coordination cooperation was needed in the event of attacks on Iran and in re to the Syrian situation. Also, Obama needed something for his domestic market becuase everything else was turning to crap.
Mladen Andrijasevic Said:
regarding the terrorist release:
http://www.timesofisrael.com/defense-chief-some-day-well-reveal-why-we-freed-prisoners/
@ SHmuel HaLevi 2:
Quisierame a mande Ud, cartelistos?
@ NormanF:
But it is not only Netanyahu, it is also Bogie, who has credibility. Here is what Bogie said last year to Ari Shavit:
The regime of the ayatollahs is apocalyptic-messianic in character. It poses a challenge to Western culture and to the world order. Its scale of values and its religious beliefs are different, and its ambition is to foist them on everyone.Accordingly, it is an obligation to prevent this nonconventional regime from acquiring nonconventional weapons. Neither we nor the West is at liberty to accept an Iranian nuclear bomb. What I am telling you is not rhetoric and it is not propaganda. A nuclearIran is a true threat to world peace.”
http://madisdead.blogspot.co.il/2012/06/moshe-yaalon-they-are-completely-unlike.html
and yet both of them apologized to Turkey which made no sense either.
http://madisdead.blogspot.co.il/2013/03/israels-apology-to-turkey-explanation.html
so I will repeat my closing statement:
After all, Bibi and Bogie are not fools. The probability that both of them have taken leave of their senses to commit such an inexplicable blunder at exactly the same time is just too small.
@ honeybee:
Sure I did and I know. Things are getting thick for the subject.
Does he not know how will he be remembered and as what? I mean, Netanyahu seem detached from any semblance of reality. He is already scum to the majority here.
Does he not know that families of the murdered people, having lost all they had, could lose control and do onto him as well? Is he that arrogant and stupid to miss that? Rumors to that end circulated already.
We have an undeclared war on the tex/mex border,send some peace talers here.
@ bernard ross:
@ oldjerry:
Why peace talks??? There is war in Syria and Egypt!!! Go have your peace talks there,where there is shooting.
The more I follow Netanyahu the more he resembles Obama. They are both pied pipers who will lead their blind followers and their countries off the cliff. But why do others follow them? The cabinet members who voted for the prisoner release are just as traitorous and treacherous as Netanyahu.
CuriousAmerican Said:
agreed
CuriousAmerican Said:
Agreed again 🙂 (that assistance being busrides across the borders)
CuriousAmerican Said:
the negotiation taking place is with obama, not the arabs.
@ CuriousAmerican:
Vayase afuera no hay nada imporante,dice ud
I am NOT in favor of trading land for peace.
But a lot of this is Israel’s fault.
Israel wants Judea and Samaria, but did not have the guts to declare it.
So instead Israel sent in pioneers to possess the land … all the while acting as if the land were not Israeli and treating the people born on the land – some of whom have roots there for centuries – under military law. Then Israel used legal gimmicks to seize some land from these people. For ex: cutting off access to farm land, then saying it is untilled, or seizing it for Military reason, and then returning it not the people it was seized from, but to the pioneers.
Israel should do now, what she should have done in 1967.
Declare the land Israeli, and offer citizenship to the Arabs on it; or make an offer to help those willing to relocate. This is essentially what Dr. Martin Sherman also advocates.
Netanyahu is stalling. He is hoping that 5 million American Jews will wake up tomorrow and make Aliyah.
Maybe they should, but they won’t.
He has to play with the cards dealt him. He is not playing wisely.
If you want the land, then annex it.
Offer the Arabs
1) assistance to relocate
-or-
2) start the process of enfranchisement
What Israel is doing now is dissembling; and that only hurts Israel.
Netanyahu says he will submit any agreement to the Israelis for a referendum, which is what he should do; but he knows they will vote no.
Just be upfront.
Tell them the Land is not for negotiation; but some arrangement will be made with the Arabs
1) Citizenship
2) or relocation
@ SHmuel HaLevi 2:
Carrido, you lived close enough to Texas to know how they deal with prisoners.
@ NormanF:
Regarding Iran’s nuclear program.
Lets reduce the Israeli so called responses and plans to basics.
Netanyahu managed to dupe many and has remained in power for almost as long as Ben Gurion did. That is as much as the two can be compared.
During his tenure Netanyahu saw the Iranian program grow from incipient to formidable and other than idiotic James Bondish stunts, did nothing.
The Netanyahu… could have easily done in that program early but I have to concluded that also on that he intentionally allowed it to develop. There is no logical explanation other than that for the his total failure in that regard. Either that or the political generals have pillaged the funds and there are no military resources at all.
Why would he do that?
For the same “reasons” that made him release thousands of islamic murderers time and time again. Rumors have it that he will release also the Fogel family slaughterers.
I would not doubt it in the least.
He is a liar at a pathological level. Also a coward, a traitor that is doing his best to destroy us all. His selection of political bedfellows is clear enough.
How many times and against how many people he lied about construction?
Remember Bet-EL, Ulpana? 30 families expelled and promised 300 dwellings to replace the 30 destroyed? Nothing at all.
Remember E 1? Not a trace of anything either.
Netanyahu was a key supporter of Sharon’s monstrous “disengagement” as well.
Netanyahu did not get pressured, he conspired to reach this point gladly. He will destroy in Amona soon now.
SOLUTION; Mass harsh protests until the flotsam is gone into jail pending court actions against him and others.
oldjerry Said:
Yamit and Shy Guy take no pleasure in saying this is the quality of the Israeli elite. They’re unprincipled, treacherous and cowardly in the extreme. And these are the people who can be trusted to deal with Iran? They’ve just demonstrated in spades how much they take care of Israelis at home – as in setting the murderers of Jews free for no good reason!
Mladen Andrijasevic Said:
My friend, I understand the stakes very well – to underline it again here, a man incapable of standing up to home grown Arab terrorists is not a man capable of taking care of the existential threat from Iran. Its matter of credibility and Netanyahu has none! He is wet as a noodle precisely when strength is called on from him. Israel cannot survive for long with mendacious and stupid leaders at its helm!
Barry Rubin, widely regarded as Israel’s most intelligent political analyst, has come out against Netanyahu’s Get Out Of Jail free bonanza for the Arabs:
http://rubinreports.blogspot.com/2013/07/why-are-104-palestinian-terrorists.html
Here’s what he says is going to be the result:
“What is the real effect of this policy?
–To undermine Israel credibility.
–To increase the risk from terrorism to Israeli citizens.
–To build confidence in Palestinian intransigence.
–To encourage Palestinians to commit terrorism believing they will be no or a reduced price.
–To convince the PA’s belief that it can get something for nothing.
–To persuade Europeans and Americans that they can endlessly pressure Israelis into concessions. (Would America release al-Qaida terrorists from Guantanamo Bay prison in the belief that this would lead them to make pace?)”
Self-inflicted Jewish stupidity, as Shy Guy would say, is the real problem Jews face – the Arabs are at worst a nuisance. Not for nothing did the Prophet Isaiah warn, “Your destroyers will come from within your midst.” Netanyahu is not to fit to remain Prime Minister Of Israel!
SHmuel HaLevi 2 Said:
Netanyahu and Obama are no different. They will both destroy their respective countries while Obama is giving Bibi a helping hand in the death of Israel. No words can describe the evil of the two.
@ rongrand:
For you: http://youtu.be/Z_s-Qk07KxA
rongrand Said:
I have meet some nuns,tiny little women,made entirely of forged steel. I am in awe of nuns.
The road to Hell is paved with good intensions!
Its time for the Israeli leadership to get some backbone and tell the government leaders of the US and EU to stay out of of their affairs.
Many years ago a nun of our Catholic elementary school told us we would meet during our lifetime those individual with the backbone of jellyfish.
Well sister the Israeli government is full of them.
Israel has the right to secure all of the Holy Land that is rightfully theirs, a G-d given right at that and if the these leaders seek justice as they claim they would be supporting Israel not the Arab world (unless of course your an anti-Semite).
The Israeli leaders need to get some backbone and remember they are Jewish first and the land is theirs contrary to what some Arabs and their so called friends believe.
Lets stop gyrating in neutral.
Netanyahu was intrinsic to the PLANNING of the betrayal, not forced into it. Please internalize it. Even if they select pale photos of him, they are photo shop fabrications. He does not ever appear affected by pressures.
Netanyahu is a cowardly, treacherous liar and will render us all if the PEOPLE do not trash the scum out.
@ NormanF:
If Netanyahu does not tackle Iran, we all here, including he, will be incinerated. Stopping Iran going nuclear is the only goal that must be achieved.
I do not think you understand the magnitude of the Iranian threat:
perhaps you should read what Bernard Lewis, a Princeton University scholar of Islam, says about mutually assured destruction and Iran:
In this context, the deterrent that worked so well during the Cold War, namely M.A.D. (Mutual Assured Destruction) , would have no meaning. At the End of Time, there will be general destruction anyway. What will matter is the final destination of the dead– hell for the infidels, and the delights of heaven for the believers. For people with this mindset, M.A.D. is not a constraint; it is an inducement…
Why are Bernard Lewis’s views on MAD ignored?
http://www.madisdead.blogspot.co.il/2012/05/why-are-bernard-lewiss-views-on-mad.html
or what Raphael Israeli, a Hebrew University scholar of Islam, says about MAD:
According to Shi’ite eschatology, the end of the world will come with the return of the Imam, whose arrival will be announced by violent pangs, unrest, wars, injustice and misery; and all the more, the more imminent his coming. Namely, mad leaders like Ahmadinejad, who are full of hatred and bellicosity, and imbued with messianic zeal and unimpressed by any worldly circumstances or restrictions, might very well, especially when controlling nuclear powers, decide to use them regardless of the costs or the consequences, as long as it will hasten the return of the Imam. For then, even the worst errors made by human leaders would, in their view, be redressed in an instant by the omnipotent Imam in the new post-apocalyptic world.
MAD Deterrence and Mad Leaders
http://www.madisdead.blogspot.co.il/2011/10/mad-deterrence-and-mad-leaders.html
or a German scholar, Mattias Kuntzel:
There are other dictatorships in the world. But only in Iran are the fantasy-worlds of antisemitism and religious mission linked with technological megalomania and the physics of mass destruction. The specific danger presented by the Iranian nuclear option stems from the unique ideological atmosphere surrounding it – a mixture of holy war and high-tec, of antisemitism and weapons-grade uranium, of death-wish and missile research, of Shiite messianism and plutonium
Matthias Küntzel – Antisemitism, Messianism and the Cult of Sacrifice:The Iranian Holy War
http://www.madisdead.blogspot.co.il/2012/09/matthias-kuntzel-antisemitism_8.html
or a former Iranian diplomat
Former Iranian diplomat: ‘Iran would definitely use nuclear weapon on Israel’
http://www.madisdead.blogspot.co.il/2013/01/former-iranian-diplomat-iran-would.html
I said a number of times, friends don’t tell you what to do or suggest, they ask how can they help.
The present US administration should not be pressing Israel for negotiations.
The Israeli leadership needs to stop wavering and bending in the wind of world opinion and the interference of supposedly friendly governments.
Israel should put all the effort it can muster in securing the Holy Land, rightfully theirs and prove to the world the Pals are not interested in peace or they would have achieved long ago.
Peace is not what they are interested in, only the removal of the Jews from the Holy Land.
Ted,
I am tired of trying to understand the Israeli leadership.
How can anyone justify the release of convicted murderers in return for the start of negotiations that will, in all likelihood, fail?.
How can Israel be so susceptible to outside pressure from the US or Europe???
Why are Israeli interests so dependant on subjugation to European and US dictates?, why is it that Mexico, for example, far weaker than Israel, is not so susceptible to American dictates?? why is it that Syria can shit on the world and yet Israel is afraid to shit without US permission??
Is Israel an appendage of the US?? If so, let’s apply to join the union, like Puerto Rico, and stop this charade about an independent and strong Jewish State.
And lastly, why are Israelis in general, so devoid of a thinking brain that they accept a leadership which will constantly do the exact opposite that it was elected to do? why don’t Israelis take to the streets and shout “we won’t take this shit anymore”?
@ Mladen Andrijasevic:
Subverting justice is not going to bring Israel peace. The world cannot exist without it. Israel does not have leaders of character and good courage!
A Prime Minister who meekly succumbs to Arab blackmail is going to be the man to keep Israel safe from a nuclear Iran? Dream on.
What Netanyahu really meant to say in his open letter
http://www.madisdead.blogspot.co.il/2013/07/what-netanyahu-really-meant-to-say-in.html
will only reinforce hamas and other palestinian terrorist groups………..bad decision……….bad………….
will only reinforce hamas and other palestinian terrorist groups,bad,bad,bad,yes,