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Menu There is no diplomatic solutionIsrael should declare three nos;
no to nuclear Iran, no to two-state solution, no to bi-national state
no to nuclear Iran, no to two-state solution, no to bi-national state
https://balkaninsight.com/2021/06/03/crossing-borders-in-a-belgrade-cafe-codes-cash-and-a-cut-for-the-state/
Good article on illegal migration from Serbia, but it doesn’t mention the tour buses.
@Peloni Thanks for the detailed financial stuff, I knew some of it but not all of it. But the state of the Serbia/Hungary border for at least two years if not more–most likely it had already been open for some time before I saw what was going on–is the damning detail that PROVES the bad faith of the Serbian and possibly the Hungarian government. And by extension, the entire EU. It’s not credible that only tourists and locals near the Belgrade bus station knew about Cafe Mesopotamia.
@ketzel2
Your frank honesty to the point of describing your own beliefs as being a conspiracy theory is quite refreshing.
A thing or two which I would like to note, though, of which you may well be aware.
Serbia a significant linchpin in China’s Belt and Road Initiative. They have given and loaned billions and billions of dollars into the Serbian nation and multiple sectors of the Serbian nation are wholly controlled by the Chinese as a result of these investments. Of course, some will say that the BRI is a Chinese debt trap, and of course they would be correct, particularly with regards to Serbia. Serbia has little, less than little actually, chance of repaying the massive debt which it took on when accepting the Chinese investments, over 7 billion euros last I read just on infrastructure loans, and this was a year or two ago. Consequently, the Chinese have earned, literally, a significant sway, dare I say domination, over the Serbian govt.
The geographic significance of Serbia lends itself quite well to Chinese efforts with the BRI, and about two thirds of the Chinese $1.7 billion costs on their Budapest-Belgrade rail line is being spent in Serbia, for instance. The Chinese have been scooping up every thing which they are allowed to put their hands on in Serbia, and given their influence over the Serbian govt, that is pretty much whatever the Chinese want. My understanding is that the disputes over any disagreements in these matters are actually handled in China, with the exception of land disputes, giving the Chinese a built in fix on the interpretations on the contracts.
Consequently, the Chinese have a very strong presence and control in Serbia. Anything that China wanted Serbia to do, they would certainly have difficulty in refusing. Consequently, when you shared your thoughts on the Covid export from China, I was curious, though still skeptical.
My own version of the conspiracy theory is less necessitating of Serbian govt involvement, to be honest. The Chinese sent their Covid seedlings far and wide, knowing that their own nation was crippled by the release of the Covid virus from their lab – either accidental or intentional, by them or the West – and knowing that the New Years travelers would effectively spawn similar crises around the world, and that set the stage for what came next. Their export of the virus to the world was anything but accidental and this part at least is, of course, no conspiracy theory. Still, perhaps the CCP employed the Serbian govt in some way to maximize the tragedy in Europe.
Another close associate of the CCP in Europe, of course, is Italy. You may recall the viscious epidemic that took place in Italy. You might also recall the mindlessly stupid measure taken by the Italians to combat Chinese hatred by encouraging people who met a random Chinaman/woman on the street to embrace them to show them there is no Chinese hatred in Italy (right about the time Pelosi took to China Town under the same pretext). Now this is a good bit better basis of claiming govt support of the CCP’s desire to flood the West with Covid. Recall too, the untold numbers of people who paid the ultimate price for the obviously ill advised pro-CCP propaganda stunt directly prescribed by the Italian govt which crippled their nation and the world. As I recall, Covid outbreaks were traced back to Italy from England, western Europe and the eastern US. The level of Chinese investment and control in Italy is, however, nowhere near to the level it is in Serbia, last I read at least. So perhaps there is something in your authored conspiracy theory, after all…perhaps.
@Peloni Of course all this is speculative, but the reason I suspect Serbia and indeed Hungary are complicit in the migration crisis, and therefore were complicit in the spread of Covid, was that when I was there, as I’ve mentioned before, there was a cafe near Belgrade bus and train station, called Cafe Mesopotamia, which was an unofficial bus station taking middle eastern males to the Hungarian border, I assume. This is speculative, too. Migration, tourism and Covid spread are related. This is only my opinion, from being there for 3 months. I’m not a journalist, and yet, it’s so in your face when you see it, and the official news sources don’t say a word.
Here is my conspiracy theory, based on my own observations. First, at that time, winter 2019-20, the luxury tour buses were departing from this cafe’s parking lot, a few blocks from the actual bus station. As I’ve mentioned before, these tour buses were big, new and luxurious, much nicer than the regular bus station. The parking lot was mobbed with middle eastern young men with backpacks. There were a few hostels catering to this group, not nice tourist hostels, more like flophouses. They also slept in parks. Local Serbian people told me not to talk to the migrants, they were dangerous in their opinion. Once a couple migrants came into a little grocery store and everyone stared at them with open hostility. A little detail that let me know, the government is doing this, not the people, who obviously disapproved of the foreign invasion.
So I knew these buses were going into the EU, how I don’t know. Did they drop them off at the border or were they able to drive to Hungary, I don’t know, only that that the supposed Hungarian patriot Victor Orban didn’t do anything about the border until about 2 years after I witnessed this scene in Belgrade.
Later on, I spent some time in Subotica, the last big town on the Hungarian border. The migrants hung around the bus station and slept in parks, obviously they were in transit to the border. The local people again warned me to avoid them.
I had many conversations with English speaking Serbians who told me about China, the EU, the NATO bombing, etc. They were ambivalent about China and remarkably open towards American tourists.
So in a nutshell, here is my conspiracy theory, based on spending quality time there and elsewhere in the Balkans and Eastern Europe. Serbia had to have been an important vector of migration and spread of designer viruses, because of the way the Hungarian border was not policed as well as it is now. Orban looked the other way for two years. Hungary is in the EU and is a gateway to the Schengen district. When I was there, and I assume this has changed, there was no border enforcement between Hungary and Austria. I took a bus from Austria to Hungary on a different trip, and the bus did not stop at the border. This may be different now.
You have to be in Serbia to appreciate the extent of Chinese influence. When I was there, I saw groups of Chinese wheeling luggage every time I went out. It was a benign invasion. Not so benign, if you suspect they were there for more than tourism. Call me paranoid, but I just don’t think the Chinese tourists were as innocent as I was. Some were, some weren’t. I don’t know all the details, but I saw enough. No one writes legit stories for the Daily Mail or big blogs, it’s left to tourists to tell you what they saw. It’s up to you to think what you like.
I wonder, after the world closed down, what did Serbia do with their Chinese tourists, business people, Chinese military training there, and other things I never saw but can imagine…labs, weapons. I’m talking about the CCP, surely there’s more to it than just flooding Serbia with tourists and consumer goods.
As for the Serbian people, they’re not even responsible for this, they were so nice to me and don’t hate Americans. They like our culture and want to practice English. It’s the government, corrupt people everywhere. That’s my story. I have a lot of other stories. One thing I’ve learned from travel is that no one knows anything, what you read in the paper and blogs is 99% b.s.
Nowadays with this Ukraine thing, Serbia and Belarus, which are very close, have been siding with Russia, and why not, they have a lot in common with Russia. This is why I say that Russia is hypocritical in whining about Ukraine wanting to join NATO, when Russia has their enclaves and allies all over Europe. People only discuss the threat of NATO, they conveniently forget the assets Russia has in Europe, which they are using, I read Belarus is arming up and there was talk of nuclear weapons there.
You can say, but ketzel, I asked you about Covid and the CCP, and you’re going on about the Hungarian border and middle eastern guys. Well, that’s because I know more about it. I’m using it as an analogy. If Serbia is doing those things to Hungary and the EU with the migrants, what would they not do for their patrons the CCP? That’s all I have, but in my opinion it’s a lot. Your mileage may vary.
@ketzel2
Whereas I don’t doubt your belief that you caught Covid from some Chinese tourists in Serbia, or even that your belief is likely valid, I don’t know how you assess that Serbia was complicit in this scheme. That is worded a little awkwardly, so let me rephrase. What makes you believe that Serbia was complicit in the Chinese exportation of the virus. The Chinese tourists literally went everywhere and they took the WuFlu with them on their journeys. It is, of course, certainly true that Serbia is very sensitive to their financial dependence on China and this is a fair argument to suggest that they would likely do whatever the Chinese demand, but is that all you are referencing here, or are you aware of something more than this. I am sincerely interested if you would care to share.
@Reader So what? I could care less about Communism versus Capitalism. Russia is still allied with Israel’s worst enemies and the friend of my enemy is my enemy.
Reader, your last sentence is bad faith, I never said those things, I merely pointed out facts. As I keep insisting, I do not take sides, I am neither pro Russian or pro Ukrainian. However, I will say that, as much as I enjoyed my 3 months in Serbia, as much as I like Serbian people, as much as I appreciate their being on our side in WWII, as much as I am horrified by NATO’s bombing of them for b.s. reasons, that still does not change the current fact that they are a very important staging area for middle eastern migration to the EU and also most likely a staging area for the release of Covid and other pathogens into the EU. I was there at the right time and saw it, I caught Covid from Chinese tourists before Covid was even in the news, because Serbia was most likely in on it. Life is complex. I knew at the time, that Serbia had no choice but to work with China, because that’s where their prosperity comes from. Without Chinese investment, which comes at a very high price, Serbia would be as poor. Now it’s better off.
Reader, please read. I am tempted to skip your future comments, your reply to me shows poor comprehension and black and white thinking, as well as a bad faith interpretation which is not even possible if you read what I wrote. Go stand in the corner.
@ketzel2
You must be kidding, right?
When was the last time you looked at the map?
Belarus has a common border with Russia as does Ukraine, Kaliningrad (former Koenigsberg) Russia got as a result of WWII, Transnistria is a part of Moldova that refused to be turned into a Romanian vassal together with Moldova, and Serbia was nearly bombed into oblivion, illegally, BTW, by the Western powers in the 1990s.
The US has 900 military based around the world and has subdivided the whole surface of the Earth into its military “commands” – are you aware of this, or it merely makes you feel comfy, unlike the Russian “stealth”?
Have you ever noticed that the favorites of the “Western world” are the worst Nazi collaborators, and those countries who really fought the Nazis are treated like they don’t deserve to exist (i.e., Russia and Serbia)?
Please recall that if the USSR didn’t defeat the Nazi Germany, we wouldn’t be discussing anything here because we wouldn’t be born.
Why do you think that everything which is good for Russia or Serbia is bad for the US and everything which is bad for these countries is good for the US?
@Reader
This is a common sentiment, and it’s somewhat true that Ukraine wanting to join NATO and all is a threat to Russia. However, that´s not the whole story. It leaves out so much. What about the presence of Russia aligned enclaves in the heart of Europe, like Serbia, Belarus, Kaliningrad and Transnistria? Most people aren’t even aware of those places and their purpose in relation to Europe, but they are openly being used as staging areas for all kinds of projects that are detrimental to the rest of Europe, including nuclear weapons. One could say that those enclaves are a type of stealth Russian mirror image of NATO.
As always, I must state that I´m neutral on Ukraine v. Russia. It’s obvious that the war is fake and benefits elite scum on both pretend sides. It could have been resolved early on by a team of McDonald’s trainees. Okay, you want those shitholes no one has ever heard of, here they are, but you must compensate the refugees. USA out of NATO and Europe, let the kaffiyeh wearing eurotrash defend themselves. Peace and justice served fast and cheap, with extra pickles.
@Reader @Reader Yes, well Europe was stupid to think they could have their cake and eat it, too. In a world of empires – and there’s never been any other kind, it;s utopian to think there ever will be – you can’t bite the hand that feeds you and still expect to get fed but that’s what they did.
@Sebastien Zorn
I am saying that Russia is the only country that can fully supply the European requirements for gas at a reasonable price, and it had been doing just that before getting provoked by the US and Europe into defending itself from an existential threat compared to which the Cuban missile crisis is nothing, and before being hit by 11,000 sanctions (the latest count, I hope it was a typo where I saw it) which caused it to stop the Nord Stream 1.
Russia hasn’t been Communist for 30 years, BTW.
America is nowhere near being on her knees, she has $30 trillion of free cash (other countries’ money) which everyone, for some reason, calls “debt” (if you lend someone’s money and they know they will never pay you back, it is not debt, it is stolen cash).
You also have to distinguish between the American elite which serves the huge corporations and the regular people (who are getting closer and closer to being on their knees unlike the elite) who are being fleeced by them.
@Reader So are you saying they should be dependent on Russia? America is on her knees, too, as a result of Biden’s policies.
@Reader So are you saying they should be dependent on Russia?
@tsalam
Some food for thought [comments are mine]:
The latest:
The initial capacity of the EastMed pipelene will be 10bcm to increase to the maximum of 20bcm.
https://tinyurl.com/4n25f56p
@Sebastien Zorn
I am speechless…
Well, not quite.
The only thing what you said proves is that Trump’s foreign policy was the same as Biden’s but in a cruder, more populist fashion.
@Sebastien Zorn
I don’t understand your argument.
Nord Stream 2 is standing idle just like Biden promised in front of Scholz who stood there stonefaced, Nord Stream 1 is standing idle now also because the turbines cannot be repaired due to sanctions, and the US is shipping loads of its liquefied gas to Europe at a much higher price than the Russian gas ever was before the sanctions.
The European economy is getting destroyed making Europe even more dependent on the US.
So where is the failure of imperialism?
I think this is a major win for the US.
@Reader “U.S. Efforts To Derail Russian Pipelines To Europe Have Failed Since The 1960s. Will Nord Stream 2 Be Any Different?” Aug 13, 2019.
https://www.rferl.org/a/us-efforts-stop-russia-pipelines-will-nord-stream-2-be-different/30107938.html
If that’s imperialism, the emperor hasn’t been doing a very good job getting his way. 😀
“Trump pitches US natural gas to European leaders, suggests Russian gas holds them hostage”
PUBLISHED THU, JUL 6 20178:49 AM EDTUPDATED THU, JUL 6 20179:07 AM EDT
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/06/trump-natural-gas-europe-leaders.html
@Reader Yes and no. They wouldn’t have depended on Russia in the first place if they hadn’t laughed at Trump and chosen to buy gas from Russia instead of America.
Can’t beat the optics:
https://ussanews.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/BAAFFF44-3468-4F9E-95C8-D0DBC96B1D0A-300×199-1.jpeg
@Sebastien Zorn
It wasn’t self-inflicted, it was American inflicted – Europe followed the US in placing sanctions on Russia, the US wanted to prevent Nord Stream 2 from operating to sell its LG to Europe – the US got its wish, except the US LG cannot cover all the requirements for gas in Europe.
Either the European politicians are irredeemably dumb or they see some long term profit in it.
“Europe Sinking Cash Into Surging Energy Costs
https://www.newsmax.com/newsmax-tv/europe-russia-exports/2022/09/07/id/1086391/
“Europe’s energy crisis has unleashed a global battle over natural-gas tankers, leading to a shortage of ships and further boosting the fuel’s record prices”
https://twitter.com/WSJ/status/1561650674739322880
“Germany’s self-inflicted manufacturing disaster is America’s opportunity”
By James Rogan July 29, 2022 06:00 AM
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/restoring-america/courage-strength-optimism/germanys-self-inflicted-manufacturing-disaster-is-americas-opportunity
RE: the Western politicians’ insane decisions.
I think that their plan is to break up (and break down) Russia and take it over, even if this results in a real (possibly world) war (this is why they are trying to create a block completely independent from Russia).
So far, it doesn’t look like the plan is working but they are thinking long term.
If they DO succeed, then all the Russian resources, including oil and gas, will be theirs for the taking with the gas pumped by the Nord Stream pipelines that were built at Russian expense.
This is an enormous gamble but they seem to be willing to risk it.
@Adam
This site along with Redacted and TFIGlobal all say essentially the same thing. Yet you dismiss them all by a smear. At le3ast point out where they are all wrong and make the case for them offering BS.
I* will grant you that Gravitas has no such stories.
What sources do you rely on and why?
Adam, Europe hasn’t begun to fall, it’s already on its ass.
Europe isn’t falling! This site is 100% bullshit. It is fake news site, Ted, I think you should not ever republish articles from this TLS site, whatever it is. Why not get more articles from Newsmax, the Wall Street Journal, the Washington Exaniner?