[So much for six years of interfaith dialogue]
Major American Jewish organizations said Wednesday they have cancelled talks with liberal Protestant leaders after the churches sought an investigation of US military aid to Israel.
The American Jewish Committee, the Anti-Defamation League (ADL), the Jewish Council for Public Affairs, and Conservative and Reform Jewish movements are among those withdrawing from the national Christian-Jewish Roundtable.
The dialogue group was founded in 2004 to ease tensions over escalating church protests against Israeli policy in the Palestinian territories.
The Jewish groups announced their decision in response to a request by several mainline Protestant leaders for Congress to re-evaluate US military aid to the Jewish state.
The church leaders said in an October 5 letter to Congress that Israel was guilty of widespread human rights violations against Palestinians that violated US legal standards for recipients of military aid.
Rabbi Steven Wernick, chief executive of the United Synagogue of Conservative Judaism called the claims “repugnant, regrettable and morally misguided.” The American Jewish Committee, a co-founder of the dialogue group, has requested a meeting with senior church leaders to “determine a more positive path forward.”
ADL National Director Abraham H. Foxman said, “In light of the failure of any of the church leaders to reach out to us, we have decided not to attend this interfaith meeting. The blatant lack of sensitivity by the Protestant dialogue partners we had been planning to meet with has seriously damaged the foundation for mutual respect, which is essential for meaningful interfaith dialogue.”
The church leaders seeking the congressional hearings represent some of the largest mainline Protestant groups in the United States. They include Presiding Bishop Mark Hanson, head of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America; Gradye Parsons, a top executive of the Presbyterian Church (USA); Rosemarie Wenner, president of the United Methodist Council of Bishops; and Peg Birk, leader of the National Council of Churches.
In the letter to Congress, the Christian leaders said both Israelis and Palestinians share responsibility for the conflict in the region, and church leaders acknowledged the suffering of both groups. But the leaders said, “we have also witnessed widespread Israeli human rights violations committed against Palestinians.”
Arguing that US military aid to Israel was “sustaining the conflict and undermining the long-term security interests of both Israelis and Palestinians,” church leaders said Congress should investigate whether Israel has violated the human rights standards set by the Foreign Assistance Act and the Arms Export Control Act.
The Christian-Jewish Roundtable was scheduled to meet next Monday. Tony Kireopoulos, an interfaith leader for the New York-based National Council of Churches, said Wednesday that the organizations were “disappointed that the meeting wasn’t going forward” and they hoped to restart the dialogue.
The US Episcopal Church, also a member of the interreligious dialogue, didn’t endorse the Protestant statement to Congress. Alexander Baumgarten, the Episcopal public policy director, said the request for congressional hearings was not in line with Episcopal policy.
Maybe I’m wrong but I feel those churches who are condemning Israel for oppressing those poor innocent child-murdering Muslims have found a new “politically correct” way stating their old and, by the Catholic and other Protestant churhces, discredited belief that the Jews are supposed to suffer eternal homelessness as a punishment for the crucifixion. They are theologically traumatized by the re-establishment of the State of Israel becaue it proves that HaShem still loves the Jewish People and hasn’t broken His ancient covenant with Jewish People. Why don’t they just admit it.
All liberals are not the same!!! Curious!
How many of these Protestants have put a foot in IL?
@ Mohammed:
I was told that there are as many interpretation as there are mullahs.
Mohammed Said:
yo!
musloid!
we read your book you magnificent bastard!
“All who worship Allah(SWTA) are on the right road.”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fsDpznl8eIs
“christianity, with its three gods, man-god, ritual human sacrifice, and ritual human cannibalism,”
I’m quite fond of my cannibalism. You do need a good green peppercorn sauce though to go with it.
There was a text — I read it years ago — Rabbi Soloveitchik. There were many pages devoted to how modern orthodoxy should deal with the secular world. There was also a chapter on “interfaith” meetings — what should and should not be discussed — he wasn’t entirely opposed, nor was he an “enthusiast.” (Or at least, that’s what I recall).
Samual Fistel,
Yuur understanding of Islam is incorrect. We don’t claim Judaism is not valid. True, in Al Quran Al Kareem you will find Jews being condemned, but only when they are not being Jews, when they are disobedient. Muslims too who do not obey Allah (SWTA) are condemned. Christians who believe Allah is 3, and Jesus (PBUH) is son are condemned as mushrikeen (idol worshipers). Christians who do not call Jesus man God too are on the right path too, and because most Christians call Jesus God there are more Jews who know Allah (SWTA) than Christians. Unitarian and Ebionite Christians are a tiny minority. All who worship Allah(SWTA) are on the right road.
@ Samuel Fistel:
spot on sam!
excellent comment!
Rabbi Strangelove: or How I learned to cherish interfaith dialogue
As Jews, we believe that both christanity and islam are man-made frauds. Since both christianity and islam claim that Judaism is no longer valid, and that christianity and/or islam have totally replaced Judaism, then if Jews acknowledged christianity or islam as being true in any way, then we would no longer be Jews. For Jews, christianity, with its three gods, man-god, ritual human sacrifice, and ritual human cannibalism, is a variant of paganism with delusions of being “the real Judaism”. And similarly, for Jews, islam is some violent, savage, sex-obsessed, man-made arabic parody of real Judaism.
Accordingly, any “rabbi” who sucks up to christians or muslims at an “interfaith dialogue”, is either a naive useful idiot, or some kind of beaten dhimmi dog who is begging the christians and muslims for mercy.
A christian who wants an interfaith dialogue with a Jew is either a naive useful idiot, or a lying missionary seeking to convert the Jews through stealthy means.
A muslim attending an interfaith dialogue is simply a liar who is seeking to appease the christians, and buy a little time until the muslims get stronger and can finally beat the christians once and for all.
@ Bill Narvey:
“For on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there will be those that shall escape.”
Yoel 3:5 and Ovadia 1:17.
@ Samuel Fistel:
I feel like a participant in a Greek Tragedy. I know the ending of the play, all the rest is theater or as we say in Judaism (Commentary) that must be played out. While weknow in advance how the play ends we do have control in the way we get there. As we used to say in the Army: There is the hard way and the easy way. So far Jews seem to love the hard way.
“Over 2000 years of pogroms, inquisitions and Holocaust make it clear, Judaism says it unequivocally: “It is an eternal law, Esau (the non-Jew) hates Jacob (the Jew).” This is the eternal law – it is immutable. America is no different, nor Australia, nor Russia, nor Latin America, nor Europe, nor South Africa”.
Israel is already at the center of the world stage. Logically no one should care what goes on there. It is an extremely tiny country on the other side of the world, yet the government of the United States as well as the major European powers seem to feel that world peace depends upon Israel giving up her homeland to her enemies. That ridiculous fact alone should be proof that there is something supernatural about this country.
Today Jews can come home with their heads held high and most if not all of their material assets. Tomorrow they may be forced out of the Exile. It’s the choice of the Jews today, tomorrow there may not be a choice.
“You shall dwell in safety in your land” In your own land, you may dwell in safety, outside your land, there is no safety for you.” The Yalkut on Leviticus 25:18.
Jews, christians, muslims: So why can’t we all just get along?
Christians believe that Jews killed their man-god. For this, the man-god has rejected the Jews, and the christians have become “the real Jews”. The Torah then became invalid. And Jews must be humiliated and punished in this world, until the man-god eventually burns them in hell for eternity. For as the man-god said, “If you are not with me, then you are against me.” And he also said, “You know the tree by the fruit it bears.” From the Jewish standpoint, the truest and most representative christian who ever lived was the german catholic Hitler.
Muslims believe that Moses was a true prophet of their savage war-god allah. But somewhere along the way, the Jews became tainted, altered the Torah so that it no longer followed the koran, “killed their own prophets” and came to worship “Uzair” (?Ezra the Scribe) as the “son of god” (like christians worship jesus). For this, allah has rejected them, and the muslims have become “the real Jews”. And because the Jews refuse to accept the murderous, sex-obsessed, pedophiliac psychopath muhammad as “the greatest human being who ever lived, whose every thought and action was perfectly in tune with allah”, they must be humiliated and punished in this world (they learned that from the christians), and in the end of days, they will all be killed and sent to burn in hell forever (again a christian teaching). Every single Jew living in muslim lands, for over 2500 years, was expelled when the Jews recently returned to Israel. Many went (penniless, of course) to the restored Jewish State of Israel. So now, the muslims say that, in order to be true to allah, they can never rest until Jewish Israel is destroyed once and for all, is re-incorporated into the muslim ummah, and the Jews are killed or enslaved.
Muslims believe that jesus was a true prophet of their savage war-god allah. Allah gave jesus a book to correct the errors in the Torah. This book was called the “injil”. Injil is a garbled arabic transliteration of the Greek name for their “new testament”, evangelion. But apparently, the real “injil” was lost almost immediately, and jesus’ followers created the false “new testament”, with completely false teachings. These false teachings included that “jesus was the son of god”. Muslims reject that jesus was crucified, died, and was resurrected. Instead, they say that allah put a “substitute” false jesus on the cross, and whisked the living “real muslim jesus” into heaven, like Elijah the Prophet. In the end of days, the living muslim human jesus will return to earth along with the muslim messiah. The muslim messiah will give a final world-wide victory to the muslims, and jesus will convert any remaining christians to islam. Then they will all join together to kill the Jews.
Now, although what I have said perfectly describes the acknowledged theological beliefs of these religions, the atheistic liberals will say I have no “right” to state these truths out loud, or put them in writing, because they constitute “hate speech”, which is an Orwellian concept which liberals have developed in order to criminalize something they don’t like, no matter how true it is. Similarly, guilt ridden christians will say that “Hitler and the hundreds of millions of european christians who savagely murdered six million Jews don’t count, because they were not “real” christians.” And the muslims, who are authorized by allah to tell any lie to infidels in order to further islam, will say that “Muslims respect the Jewish and christian prophets, islam is a “religion of peace”, and those muslims who slowly saw off your infidel head while screaming “allahu akbar” over and over again, are a “minor nuisance” who do not represent the majority of muslims, and so don’t count.
So go forth and learn: In accordance with HaShem’s promise, after two thousand years, He has at last authorized the Jews to return to Israel, to serve as a refuge and a fortress to protect us from the savage christians and muslims (Edomites and Ishmaelites). May it be His will, that Jewish Israel soon becomes a true Torah-state, and we attain the merit to rebuild Our Holy Temple.
Again, the quote box is in the wrong place.
But the leaders said, “we have also witnessed widespread Israeli human rights violations committed against Palestinians.”
Well intentioned Jews got it wrong.
Interfaith dialogue assumes mutual respect between the participating faith groups.
The Jewish organizations that were the founding members of the interfaith dialogue group with liberal Christian church organizations and which continued to participate in this dialogue groupover the past 8 years, had to know that their liberal Christian church counterpart dialogue members did not respect Jews and Israel.
Perhaps these Jewish groups knew, but did not want to believe that the liberal Christian church members of the interfaith dialogue group did not respect them. Perhaps they knew, but figured through the dialogue group liberal Christian Church members would come to respect Jews and Israel.
Whatever the participating Jewish organizations believed or made themselves believe that there was mutual equal respect for them coming from their liberal Christian church interfaith dialogue counterparts were shattered by this anti-Israel initiative of the liberal Christian church organizations.
It must have been a painful realization for these Jewish groups to finally open their eyes to reality.
The American Jewish Committee, one of the founding members of this group requested a meeting with senior church leaders to
Better the AJC along with the other interfaith dialogue participating Jewish organizations should not have reached out yet again. Rather the message to these liberal church leaders should have been along the lines of if you ever manage to rid yourselves of your antisemitism and anti-Israelism, give us a call!