T. Belman. For years now, I have had a major disagreement with Singer regarding the Jordan Option. He insisted on Jordan being represented by King Abdullah, whereas I insisted that the king had to be replaced by Mudar Zahran. The king is anti Israel and pro Iran, Qatar, MB and Turkey. He is also anti Palestinian. I saw little difference between him and Abbas. For me, Singer’s Jordan Option is a non starter.
Yes, Trump is annointing Jordan, but not Jordan led by the king. If Mudar Zahran comes to power, all things are possible.
Jordan has resurrected claims to ‘West Bank’ sovereignty as the PLO continues to refuse to negotiate with Israel onTrump’s still to be revealed plan.
The three day visit to Israel last week by President Trump’s National Security Advisor – John Bolton – indicates Jordan will replace the Palestine Liberation Organisation (PLO) in concluding negotiations with Israel to resolve territorial sovereignty in Judea and Samaria (‘West Bank’), East Jerusalem and Gaza (”the disputed territories”) under Trump’s peace plan.
Bolton’s visit follows a former Jordanian ambassador – Walid Sadi – last week signalling Jordan is ready to fill the diplomatic void following the breakdown of Israel-PLO negotiations unsuccessfully conducted during the last 25 years. The PLO refuses to negotiate on Trump’s plan.
Trump’s National Security Advisor John Bolton has supported Israel-Jordan negotiations over the ‘West Bank’ since 2009.
Walid resurrected Jordan’s long-dormant claims to sovereignty in the disputed territories that completely undermine those of the PLO:
“First of all, the unity of the West Bank with the East Bank was officially and constitutionally adopted on 24 of April 1950. No one disputes this fact. The Constitution of the country at the time was the 1952 Constitution, which stipulated in no uncertain terms that no part of the Kingdom shall be ceded, period. This provision makes the 1988 decision to cut off all legal and administrative relations between the two banks stopping short of ceding the West Bank to any side whatsoever. Any other interpretation of the 1988 political decision is absolutely untenable constitutionally.”
Bolton himself has supported Israel-Jordan negotiations over the West Bank since 2009.
Bolton told Eric Shawn on 21 January 2018:
“I hope at some point the Administration recognizes and perhaps it is already quietly – that the two-state solution isn’t going anywhere. If anything I would say to King Abdullah of Jordan – “Be prepared to reassert Jordanian sovereignty over part of the West Bank – negotiate with Israel”. I think that’s a far better outcome than the continued pursuit of a mythical – I believe – unattainable viable Palestinian state”
George Will – an outspoken critic of President Trump – has claimed:
“Bolton will soon be the second-most dangerous American.”
Yet Will himself had written in the Washington Post on 17 April 1987:
“May 14 will be the 30th Anniversary of the founding of the State of Israel, June 6 will be the 20th anniversary of the Six Day War. The West Bank has been held by Israel longer than it had been held by Jordan, the 1967 aggressor, which ever since has presented itself as the aggrieved party. Today, as every day since 1948, the key to peace is direct negotiations between Jordan and Israel, not a committee”
Israel’s Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has been seeking direct negotiations with Jordan for decades – telling the United Nations General Assembly on 11 December 1984:
“Clearly, in Eastern and Western Palestine, there are only two peoples, the Arabs and the Jews. Just as clearly, there are only two states in that area, Jordan and Israel. The Arab State of Jordan, containing some three million Arabs, does not allow a single Jew to live there. It also contains 4/5 of the territory originally allocated by this body’s predecessor, the League of Nations, for the Jewish National Home. The other State, Israel, has a population of over four million, of which one sixth is Arab. It contains less than 1/5 of the territory originally allocated to the Jews under the Mandate…. It cannot be said, therefore, that the Arabs of Palestine are lacking a state of their own. The demand for a second Palestinian Arab State in Western Palestine, and a 22nd Arab State in the world, is merely the latest attempt to push Israel back into the hopelessly vulnerable armistice lines of 1949.”
Two peoples – the Arabs and the Jews – need two states – not three – in former Palestine.
Dry Bones 28.8.18 Jordan and Israel
So Abbas has said, that Trumps team asked him if he was interested in a confederation with Jordan. He rejected the idea but said he would be interested if Israel joined the Federation.
@ Ted Belman:
Interesting thought Israeli Muslims running the two Mosques on the Mount. Wonder how that would work? Would they be appointed by the Israeli government?
@ Edgar G.:
As a matter of fact, Mudar is religious. He thinks that Israeli Muslims should form the Wakf and Jordan should stay out of it.
@ Ted Belman:
Very likely Mudar is not religious in any way, having lost whatever he had during his vicissitudes over the years. But he’s not taking into account the Jordanians who ARE religious. I can see no clear way by which Jordan could be allowed by the people to give up the custodianship of their sites. In fact I’d expect a HUGE protest, and possible rebellion against the proposal to give up whatever power they hold now over the whole Mount.
Religions does strange things to people and a crazy religion like Islam does crazy things to an already crazy people.
@ Ted Belman:
Even if Saudia wants to be the Custodian of the Muslim sites, and assuming Mudar is PM, it would take a few years both for him, and the people to become settled in that position, or even if he holds free elections quickly, as he has said, and someone else becomes P.M. or President…..(???)….. I still strongly maintain my belief that that Jordanian People would rise against handing over the custodianship of the Muslim sites to anyone, even the Saudis. This is a “Morton’s Fork” kind of situation, where I think Mudar would be biting off more than he could chew.
@ Ted Belman:
I agree that Muslims should be in charge of the two Mosques on the Mount ONLY. Jews should be able to pray on the Mount.
A Muslim leader who goes along with this thought process openly will be a candidate to become the next Sadat in all aspects.
I asked Mudar during the conference what his position on the TM is and he said that it is not his business and that he woulkd relinquish the custodian role.. Many months later he told me that Saudi Arabia wants to be the Custodian.
In an interview I suggested that al Aqsa Mosque should be limited to a certain area over which the Muslims would be resoponsible but that the rest of the TM would be a Jewish holy site. He thought that equitable.
@ david singer:
You are wedded to your idea it is obvious. It is not happening which is good for Israel. Your intentions were good I believe but highly misguided and completely void of understanding both Israel and Jordan.
Israel does need more than the status quo. Perhaps ( I hope) after the Trump comes to the realization that his plan will not be able to fulfilled, Israel will start unilateral actions to its stability.
@ david singer:
May I remind you, ot actually POINT OUT to you, as you seem not to know, that this is a page where a variety of opinions and speculations are freely aired. I happen to be one of the regular contributors to several discussions on whatever interesting article Ted has selected to present that interests ME. . I suppose the carrier pigeon carrying this news about the blog, is still winging it’s way to far off Australia.,
So fascinating as you might find me, you’ll have to be disappointed as I prefer that my undoubted fascination be projected upon girls-ladies-wimmin…You know what I mean.
The “Washington Declaration” sounds very-very, but all it means is that the treaty was signed in Washington between Hussein and Rabin. And it specified Muslim control ONLY over the Muslim sites. They have since arrogated to themselves control over the whole Mount, because of the slovenly and negligent attitude of the Israeli Govt.
If Jordan passes to Mudar, that treaty likely will either be scrapped or heavily amended. it’s almost certain that he will relinquish the Muslim “managerial” role of the whole Mount,, but even then, I can’t see him NOT wanting Jordan to still be in charge of the Muslim sites. It’s just not logical and the Jordanian people would reject this idea.. That seems to be what you’re worrying at.
You’re in a “hot” conflict with TED who said, amongst other things that Mudar agreed “That Kordan will withdraw as the custodian of all Muslim sites”. on the Mount. It is in his response to you, in which he mentions that you haven’t taken into consideration the |”Strong Sovereignty Movement”.
I feel it must be either a typo, misprint, or unwitting error. So I made my own comment on this one point about giving up control of all Muslim sites, that you are attacking me about.
Bear Klein Said:
You seem to overlook Trump’s yet to be announced “ultimate deal”. I suggest you reserve writing off negotiations between Israel and Jordan until the details of Trump’s plan are made public.
Edgar G. Said:
Jordan’s right to be custodian of the Muslim sites in Jerusalem is guaranteed by the Washington Declaration and article 9.2 of the Jordan Israel peace treaty.
I find it fascinating that you are trying to preempt the outcome of negotiations between Israel and Jordan. Leave those negotiations to the duly elected governments of Jordan and Israel.
Sorry I cannot help with your friends.
The Jordanians have drank the same koolaid the Palestinians have for 70 years believing that the refugees (in this case all their descendants also) will be able to move to Israel under their belief “in the right of return”. First Israel was never going to agree to this whether (left, center or right). Israel was not going to let Arabs in mass enter Israel so it would longer be a Jewish State.
Second, the Jordanians have now realized that USA (Trump Team) is the same page as the Israelis and want to destroy UNRWA and with it the imaginary “right of return” This clarifies the reality that Jordan is permanently a majority “Palestinian” State just as many Israelis claims. The Jordanians are deathly afraid of this because sooner or later a small minority can not keep ruling the larger majority population.
So the Jordanians ruled by the King are not going to negotiate new borders with Israel because it is the opposite of what they desire. There is nothing in this for Israel either.
Abbas is old and very ill and has no succession planned after he is either totally incapacitated or dies. Those who view themselves as possible successors are gathering guns or aligning themselves with various Fatah gangs preparing for the day after Abbas. Hamas has also tried to get itself ready to try and take over in Judea/Samaria PA areas.
What will happen is yet to be determined. The PA as it is now is likely to disappear. Bibi likes to maintain the status quo but that will shortly unravel and he will be forced to take action.
@ david singer:
Dovidel, I’m not trying to attack you….although it would be easy to. I’m a Jew, so sometimes I talk like a Yid… I’m just trying to insert a little perspective into your out-of-date and sure -to-fail-ideas. There have been a plethora of all kinds of opinions and articles on the same subject. Yours is just another of many. I am also very concerned about the delayed advent of Zahran….but………??
Truthfully I was more interested in what you might reply to my query about old friends with whom I grew up, and who emigrated to Sydney, as per my recounting. @ Ted Belman:
I find it hard to believe that Jordan, no matter who the ruler is, would withdraw as custodian of the MUSLIM sites. I don’t see that they need to. They just need to redraw the boundaries of their sites to what they should be, just the ground they’re built on. The major part of the Mount therefore would be in the possession of Israel, who would also have full sovereignty over the whole site, Muslim areas included. For the Muslims to attend to their sites, they would be indebted, and beholden to Israel.
It then becomes obvious that Muslim attendance on the Mount would be strictly curtailed t normal dimensions, at times that Israel decrees. Metal detectors and other detection instruments would also be installed, as well a a closer inspection as to how the Arabs get all their rocks and iron bars to the Mount without detection.
@ david singer:
Dovidel, I’m not trying to attack you….although it would be easy to. I’m a Jew, so sometimes I talk like a Yid… I’m just trying to insert a little perspective into your out-of-date and sure -to-fail-ideas. There have been a plethora of all kinds of opinions and articles on the same subject. Yours is just another of many. I am also very concerned about the delayed advent of Zahran….but………??
Truthfully I was more interested in what you might reply to my query about old friends with whom I grew up, and who emigrated to Sydney, as per my recounting.
Ted Belman Said:
The PA was disbanded on 3 January 2013. Pretending it wasn’t is one of the most amazing perversions in this whole sorry saga. I am surprised that you seem unaware of this.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/john-v-whitbeck/the-state-of-palestine-ex_b_2431690.html
As for King Abdullah – I suggest we reserve judgement until Trump’s “ultimate deal” is released. Trump’s plan will have to be negotiated by Israel with someone.
Who do you think that someone could be? The PLO wants no part of Trump. So who will be the Arab party that Trump calls on to negotiate with Israel to make his plan a reality? It certainly won’t be Zahran. Could be Jordan or a combination of Jordan, Egypt and Saudi Arabia and even other Arab states.
Pure speculation at the present moment but Jordan must be there or Trump’s plan will be dead in the water if he doesn’t have an Arab negotiating partner ready to sit down with Israel and try to finalise the allocation of sovereignty in Judea and Samaria.
Bear Klein Said:
You may be right and those negotiations between Israel and Jordan could well fail.
However Israel would then be the recipient of a “Get out of Jail” card on the Monopoly Board – far in advance of square one – after attempts by Israel to resolve the allocation of sovereignty in Judea and Samaria have been rejected by both:
1. the PLO spanning the last 25 years and then
2. Jordan
and end up going nowhere.
If those circumstances were to occur, unilateral action by Israel to do as it thought fit in its best national interest would be totally justified.
You can wait at the altar for so long before deciding the wedding won’t happen. 100 years is a long time to wait and see if an Arab partner emerges who is finally prepared to say to Israel – “I do”.
Negotiations between Jordan and Israel represent that last opportunity.
@ david singer:
The King is on record of opposing everything that Trump is proposing. Trump has put him under intense pressure but he refused to yield. The train has left the station. His days are numbered as are those of the PA.
@ david singer:
You seem to ignore the Sovereignty Movement in Israel. It is growing by leaps and bounds. I can assure you that it will never accept anything less than extending sovereignty to the Jordan R. Mudar and I have agreed that the Jordan R. will remain the boundary and that Jordan will withdraw as the custodian of the Muslim holy sites. Also we have envisaged and agreed upon many areas for cooperation the will benefit both countries. Finally Zahran will extend citizenship to all Palestinians and invite them to emmigrate to Jordan.
Edgar G. Said:
Edgar G
It was Bear Klein that posted this claim which appeared in an article in Al-Monitor that he quoted [Yesterday at 5.33 pm].
The air is great down under. Much clearer than seems to be your murky desire to try and attack me.
You and Bear can fight out whether the US is Jordan’s closest ally.
I prefer to concentrate on getting Israel and Jordan to start negotiations aimed at resolving their respective territorial claims to Judea and Samaria .
Jordan’s claims would be based on the following facts that I pointed out in my article that Ted was kind enough to publish:
““First of all, the unity of the West Bank with the East Bank was officially and constitutionally adopted on 24 of April 1950. No one disputes this fact. The Constitution of the country at the time was the 1952 Constitution, which stipulated in no uncertain terms that no part of the Kingdom shall be ceded, period. This provision makes the 1988 decision to cut off all legal and administrative relations between the two banks stopping short of ceding the West Bank to any side whatsoever. Any other interpretation of the 1988 political decision is absolutely untenable constitutionally.”
Israel’s claims would be based on article 6 of the League of Nations Mandate for Palestine, article 80 of the United Nations Charter and the 3000 years history of the Jewish people in their biblical, historic and ancient homeland.
Those negotiations might well fail – but at least they need to be pursued if there is to be any hope of resolving a conflict that has raged for the last 100 years.
@ david singer:
The King and the Hashemites supporters do not want to be the Palestinian State. Israel does not want to change the border and bring Jordan into its midst as it is dangerous for Israel’s security and stability.
No deal – not a solution. Go back to square one on the Monopoly Board!
@ david singer:
The US is NOT “It’s closest ally”…where did you get that cockomamy idea from…? The US is one of Jordan’s greatest benefactors, yes, but closest ally…..Mashugga, how’s the air down under….? Abdullah and the “Jordanians hate the US just as they hate all non Muslims, and especially because they have to be beholden to them to keep on their feet and be able to pay their cronies and the other grafters.
You are living too far away from the action, and reading the wrong reports as well as completely misunderstanding what you read. This is all shoved along a certain route by your perceived beliefs. Well…..T.G. not many believe as you do…these days anyhow.
By the way, are you in Sydney…if you are, did you ever know a doctor named Harry Sternberg, originally came over to Dublin with his family because of the War. I was at school with him for years, and after he qualified went out to Sydney. We were very good friends and kept in touch, until his sad ending.
There were several other Dublin people who went out, like close friend Ronnie Sevitt -later a big house builder- and Zally Barnett and his wife.
There is another choice – sit down with Israel and negotiate a new border between their two respective states. Doing so will ensure Trump keeps the aid flowing to Jordan. Trump has a well-established track record of supporting those who support his policies and dumping those who don’t. Just look at what has happened at NATO and the PLO since Trump became President.
@ Edgar G.:
I am also not very confident that the King will leave office because of just USA pressure.
However who knows what set of circumstances could arise in Jordan to make the Hashmite House of Cards fall apart and the King and family move to London. They then could become Chelsea FC fans. My guess is that they prefer Manchester City as that is owned by Muslims and not a Jew!
@ Bear Klein:
I don’t believe that Trump would “kick him out” for such a trumpery (on the world scale of things) matter such as this. It’s against the professed American newly found ethos. Unless it was his #1 priority, which we know it is not, being rather far back on his list. He’ll let diplomacy take it’s course, unless someone, perhaps his Ambassador, can present the great benefits of having Zahran instead of Abdullah.
And even then, it would have to be done with great finesse to avoid been seen internationally as “The great Bully”, and to come from internal Jordan pressure to get rid of this obstructionist Jew hater pygmy king. Trump would have to see him as he is, a huge obstacle to peace, a vicious anti-Semite, hand in glove with the Muslim Brotherhood…and more.
Just my opinion.
david singer Said:
From one day ago: “Jordan PM who signed Israel peace deal: Haifa should be taken by force if we can
‘If we ever have military power, will we let them keep Haifa? We’ll take it,’ Abdelsalam al-Majali says in TV interview, while praising Israel for water supply
By MICHAEL BACHNER
30 August 2018, 9:24 am ”
One question. With all due respect. Are you out of your mind?
@ Bear Klein:
You got that right.
So if one reads the above article I linked or just the snippets I copied from it and pasted above it is clear Jordan under the King will fight Trump diplomatically on helping solve the Palestinian issue and will be a hindrance. Just as he has been for a long time.
So does the USA try and kick him out and replace him (time will tell) with a friendlier leader?
Again as wrote earlier Israel needs to solve its own issues and not be dependent on Arabs.
Snippets of Article by Jordanian ( and Amman based) Writer in left wing blog Al-Monitor.
Jordan can’t afford to lose UNRWA battle
Osama Al Sharif
I can’t be specific and I have no guarantees. I have stated what I believe.
@ Ted Belman:
Ted
How long before Zahran succeeds in replacing Abdullah in your considered opinion? Correct me if I am mistaken – didn’t Zahran predict this would have happened by now?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_eTftUKZzV0
Jordan and the people that reside within it are not friends of Israel and in fact Jew and Israeli haters.
Jordan fought a war against the PLO and revoked the citizenship of the Arabs living in Judea/Samaria for the most part. The ruling class including the King are scared of more “Palestinians” moving to Jordan as they are scared of getting overthrown.
The border is the Jordan River by treaty and in fact. Jordan wants nothing to do with Judea/Samaria and the “Palestinians” living there.
Israel can NOT afford to give up security control of Judea/Samaria. The government of Israel concurs on this. People like Singer do not understand the security reality and it is best to simply tell him and them no it will not work.
Unless one can greatly reduce the amount of Arabs living in Judea/Samaria hopefully financially induced emigration (as opposed to war), Israel will continue to have a problem there.
Yes it would be great if Jordan would allow a Pal city or two to be built and allow emigration from Judea/Samaria which would also help Jordan’s economy. This will not happen if they think they will be overthrown. Zaharan according to Ted would approve of Palestinian emigration from Judea/Samaria to Jordan. So we will wait to see if this happens.
I think Israel should not be dependent on Arabs to solve its problems as they basically hate Israel (with individual exceptions). Israel needs a paradigm (backed by the government) that solves its own problems.
Even if I thought that the abdication is not about to happen, I have no confidence that the King would be a better negotiating partner than Abbas.. He has resisted Israel at every turn.
@ Ted Belman:
Ironic Singer thinks it is dirty work that you working with someone who you believe could benefit Israel is dirty work. Yet I and others based on the vastly negative comments in gets both in Israpundit and Artuz7 think his idea of giving an Arab regime parts of Judea/Samaria is criminal negligence.
The link you wanted from my earlier post about Dr. Eldad’s plan is https://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/107099/jordan-palestine-arieh-eldads-two-state-solution-mark-tapson
david singer Said:
Yes. Wait. It won’t be long now.
@ Ted Belman:
Ted
We have to deal with the here and now.
King Abdullah and Netanyahu are the parties to authorise the beginning of negotiations on drawing the new international border between Israel and Jordan. The sooner those negotiations start, the sooner we might see agreement reached on a new border.
Judea and Samaria has been “no mans land” for the last 70 years where neither Jew nor Arab presently exercises internationally recognised sovereignty. Surely these negotiations cannot come soon enough.
You predicted Zahran would be installed in Jordan by now. Are you seriously suggesting everyone sit back and wait till Zahran takes over because he will make all the difference in the world? What if he fails? How long are you prepared to wait and see if Zahran can overthrow the Hashemite regime which has ruled Jordan for almost 100 years?
@ Bear Klein:
You need to look at article 3.2 of the Jordan-Israel peace treaty which states:
“The boundary, as set out in Annex I (a), is the permanent, secure and recognized international boundary between Jordan and Israel, without prejudice to the status of any territories that came under Israeli military government control in 1967”
Negotiations between Jordan and Israel on the status of those territories is long overdue after almost 25 years of negotiations between Israel and the PLO that have gone nowhere in a vain effort to create a new Arab state between Israel and Jordan.
Yes – I do write lots of articles about it and am glad that you are apparently reading them. It is a pity that so many Jews and Arabs have suffered over the last 40 years because Jordan refused during that time to negotiate with Israel on drawing up a new border between their two respective states.
david singer Said:
Please explain yourself.
Who will run Jordan will make all the difference in the world.
@ Bear Klein:
Do you have a link? As you may know, Eldad spoke at my conference. We are very much in agreement except for one major disagreement. He assumes that King Abdullah can be induced to accept his plan. I have no such dillusions.
Fundamental to the success of my plan is that the king abdicate and that Zahran be installed as leader.
@ david singer:
Dr. Ariyeh Eldad (former Knesset Member & Chief IDF Medical Officer)
has a long running Jordan is Palestine Plan. Mr. Singer please read this and learn what about your plan completely faulty and delusional.
Any alternative plan should be based on the fact that the Palestinians have their own state already in Jordan, a kingdom – in which the Palestinians are at least 75% of the residents – created after the British Mandatory land of Israel was divided into two. The plan should focus on resolving the regional solution by settling the Arab refugees in Jordan and other Arab countries that absorbed Palestinian refugees after the War of Independence in 1948…
Israel would exercise sovereignty over all territory west of the Jordan, receive exclusive authority over security issues in all areas of sovereignty, since Israel could never accept the existence of an army from another country west of the Jordan, with airspace sovereignty and full control of external borders…
The Plan “Jordan is Palestine” is the only approach that can handle conflict without endangering the very existence of the State of Israel.
There are four major elements of his plan: 1) recognition of Jordan as a Palestinian country; 2) the closure of UNRWA and the creation of a plan for the settlement of Arab refugees in Jordan, under the auspices of the UN High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR), which has a track record of successfully resettling tens of millions of refugees around the world; 3) Israeli and international guarantees of a continued Hashemite rule in Jordan, and 4) the application of Israeli law in Judea and Samaria.
If we remember that the main driving force of the Arabs in this conflict is Islam, the Jordan River border will not solve the conflict. But this plan will create a national state for Palestinians, who will be able to fulfill at least some national desires, and it will be a state whose very existence does not endanger Israel. The Jordan border will establish a clearly defensible border.
@ david singer:
What you do NOT understand very obviously your idea is a formula for disaster. You do NOT understand how dangerous your idea is!!!
Your idea you say say is 40 years old. Since then Israel and Jordan signed a peace treaty which has international borders at the Jordan River. No one is renegotiating these borders because you write lots of articles about it!
@ Ted Belman:
Ted
When I call for negotiations between Jordan and Israel to resolve the allocation of sovereignty in Judea and Samaria – I mean that those negotiations will take place between whoever is in government in both Israel and Jordan at the time such negotiations are commenced or who might subsequently replace them.
Throwing in your lot behind Zahran is dirty work indeed.
Unlike you – the Jordan is Palestine movement I started almost 40 years ago has focused on getting negotiations commenced to draw up a new internationally agreed border replacing the currently existing one between Israel and Jordan.
Israel’s Government – not you or King Abdullah or whoever leads Jordan – will make its decision on whether the new border will meet Israel’s security needs.
Two peoples – the Jews and the Arabs – need two States not three in former Palestine.
Perhaps there is now some light at the end of the tunnel that these Israel-Jordan negotiations could soon occur.
@ Bear Klein:
I agree with you Bear, it was “Game Over” as far as Jordan interfering in Israel when they finalised that Treaty. Jordan came very well out of it… got benefits it wasn’t entitled to, and didn’t deserve under any circumstances. Israel slipped up when allowing them to still manage the Temple Mount.
I hope when Zahran gets control, P.G. THAT will be rectified too. Let the Arabs look after their mosque but the Mount must be ALL Israeli, with Israel giving permission to the Arabs to have their Mosque remain there. If they don’t like that,, then it can be taken down, numbered stone by stone and transported over to Jordan, in the same manner that American millionaires buy, break down and transport old Scottish castles to the US.
In other words when and if Trump releases a plan then Israel will make up its mind about it. No rationale Israeli government is going to let the Jordanian government back into its affairs after the nightmare the Temple Mount has been and what a mistake that was. Who would compound this mistake for a worse one. Yes I know David Singer from Mount Sinai in Australia thinks it is good idea but really, why would anyone go from one problem to a likely worse one. It is like bringing Arafat and Company back from Tunis all over again.
@ david singer:
From the peace treaty Annex 1
The borders are final! Jordan by treaty and law has NO say so in Judea/Samaria.
Let me add to my reply. Essentially what you advocate is that the PA be removed and Jordan with whom we have a peace treaty be tasked with negotiating a deal on behalf of the Palestinians living in the territories. That’s not near enough for me. The king is allied with the MB, Qatar, Turkey and Iran. I am not interested in any deal with him. It won’t be near good enough.
In my imagined deal with Zahran, I focus on having Jordan reaffirm Jordanian citizenship on all Palestinians and inviting them to emmigrate to Jordan. This is a non starter with the king. Also Mudar will allign Jordan with Israel, Saudi Arabia and the US. And Mudar wants full peace with Israel. There is just no comparison. And Mudar will get rid of the MB.
I see Jordan as the repository of all Palestinian refugees who wish to emmigrate there. I also see Jordan as replacing UNRWA and the PA. There is just no comparison. Night and day.
@ david singer:
Hi David. Thanks for the nuance but I stand by opinion that negotiating with the King will yield us much less than negotiating with Zahran. Put another way, would you advocate your Jordan Option if Zahran is in power? I believe so. So let me do the dirty work if I can then we will be on the same page maybe.
@ greenrobot:
Jordan does have a say over Judea and Samaria because of Articles 3.1 and 3.2 of the 1994 Peace Treaty between Jordan and Israel. Redrawing the current border between Israel and Jordan would result in finally allocating sovereignty in the last remaining 5% of former Palestine between Jordan and Israel – the two successor States to the Mandate for Palestine.
Ted:
Your following comment misrepresents my position:
– “For years now, I have had a major disagreement with Singer regarding the Jordan Option. He insisted on Jordan being represented by King Abdullah”, whereas I insisted that the king had to be replaced by Mudar Zahran.” –
I was and am still of the view that no organisation advocating any solution based on Jordan being 78% of Palestine should be advocating for the overthrow of Jordan’s political leader – whoever that leader should happen to be.
Interfering in the internal affairs of Jordan by calling for the replacement of its ruler should not be part of any Jordan is Palestine campaign.
“Palestinians” to Jordan or obtain Jordanian citizenship. No Jordanian solider west of the Jordan River. That is Israel.
Why does Jordan have any say over Judea and Samaria. Their constitution doesn’t reflect the war of 67 , which was LOST by Jordan.