[NOTE: About 18 months ago Nathan Pearlstein, Robert Peter North and Felix Quigley began educating Israpundit readers as to the truth about the fighting in Serbia. As a result we came to understand that the US was at fault and the Serbs were innocent.]
Introduction by Nathan Pearlstein
Why are the mainstream Western media, the US administrations under George W. Bush and Bill Clinton as well as the governments of NATO and the EU covering up this monumental crime against humanity?
Why are the Serbs – whom apart from the Jews were the major victims of the Holocaust during World War 2 – being cast as the perpetrators of genocide while the real perpetrators of genocide – the Islamofascists loyal to Alija Izetbegovic – are being cast by the corporate media, the US, NATO and EU governments as “the victims”?
Why was Naser Oric – the Islamofascist commander of Srebrenica and perpetrator of a massive genocide against Serbian men, women and children in Srebrenica from 1992 to 1995 – given only a 2 year sentence for this monumental crime against humanity and allowed to walk free from NATO’s Scheveningen ICTY prison: the former Nazi SS dungeon for patriotic Dutch resistance fighters against the Germans during World War 2 in The Hague, Holland?
Our dear friend and colleague at 4International, Peter Robert North, has graciously allowed us to reproduce in full his outstanding work here on what really happened in Srebrenica and Gorazde from 1992 to 1995. A revelation of truth which is of enormous historical significance and importance to all good people across the globe but especially for all patriotic Jewish people in Israel and the diaspora.
We all remember the Western media hoaxes and fakery concerning the events in Jenin and Qana recently and how these media frauds were used to demonize Israel and the Jewish people. So it is absolutely crucial that we also expose the Western media fraud concerning the events in Srebrenica, Bosnia in July, 1995, in order to reveal just how corrupt and dishonest the Western media, the US, NATO and EU Imperialist governments are when they turn the world upside down by demonizing the victims of a massacre in order to prop up the Islamofascist perpetrators, thereby creating new independent Islamist states for the Islamofascists (as the US, NATO and EU are doing right now in Kosovo on behalf of the Islamofascist terrorist group: the KLA).
The following article, my dear readers, is the horrific truth about what happened to the Serb civilians of Srebrenica and Gorazde – a shocking truth which the Fascist Left supporters of Hamas and PLO/Fatah, as well as the pro-NATO Imperialist cowards on British website “Harry’s Place” – especially Oliver Kamm and Marko Attila Hoare – are so desperate to hide from the people of the world.
The following is a dire warning to us all! We ignore this at our own peril.
By Peter Robert North
The real Srebrenica Genocide not reported by the corrupt, racist pro-Islamist-Nazi Western corporate-controlled media, was the brutal mass murder – using axes, knives, daggers, sledgehammers, iron bars, flamethrowers and explosives – of 3,870 Serbian elderly men, women and young children in and around the town of Srebrenica and its adjoining towns and villages(Bratunac,Skelani,Milici, et al) as well as the town of Gorazde.
Bosnian Muslim military forces from Srebrenica killed Bosnian Serb Milan Vujicic, mutilated his body, and then roasted his corpse.
The body of Bosnian Serb civilian Kostadinka Grcic, executed by Bosnian Muslim forces by stabbing her in the chest.
The body of Milica Saric, who was murdered by Bosnian Muslim forces in Kalinovik with 30 other Bosnian Serb civilians.
On right, the body of 15 year-old Bosnian Serb Slobodan Mastilo, who was murdered by Bosnian Muslim forces in the Foca region.
The bodies of Ranko Sekulovic, left, and his wife, Radenka, 30, executed and mutilated by Bosnian Muslim Territorial Defense forces on September 13, 1992 in Foca. Bosnian Muslim troops murdered the entire Sekulovic family.
These little Serbs, Predrag and Danka Sekulovic, were slain with their parents on Sep. 13, 1992 by Bosnian Muslims in the village of Bakic on the road to Foca. He was 7, she was 4.
A Bosnian Serb mother grieves over her child – brutally murdered by Izetbegovic’s and Oric’s Islamist troops.
A Bosnian Serb mother grieves over her loved ones – brutally murdered by Izetbegovic’s/Oric’s Islamist troops.
Bosnian Serb family members grieve over their dead loved ones – brutally murdered by Izetbegovic’s/Oric’s Islamist troops.
The Milici Massacre, south of Srebrenica. Bosnian Muslim troops executed Bosnian Serbs and mutilated their bodies. On left, Ljubomir Jurosevic had his right eye cut out by Bosnian Muslim soldiers and his neck and chest showed signs of knife wounds.On right, the mutilated body of Bosnian Serb Dimitrije Alempic from Rogosije, who was executed by Bosnian Muslim soldiers. His body was mutilated and burned.
The bodies of two Bosnian Serbs in eastern Bosnia. On the right, a charred body of Zdravo Eric, who was killed and his body burned. Before burning him, Muslims took out the heart of this Christian as a sign of Islamic piety.
The body of a Bosnian Serb from Sarajevo, who was killed, mutilated, and burned. His body was thrown in the Miljacka river by Bosnian Muslim forces.
The corpse of Bosnian Serb civilian Radivoje Lukic, 59. The Bosnian Muslim paramilitaries “The Mosque Doves” or “Dzamijski Golubovi”, murdered him with an axe to the head on October 8, 1992 in Klisa.
The Bosnian Muslim paramilitaries “The Mosque Doves” or “Islamski Golubovi”, murdered two elderly Bosnian Serb women near Zvornik north of Srebrenica.
Top, bodies of elderly Bosnian Serbs executed by the Bosnian Muslim paramilitary group The Mosque Doves, or Djamijski Golubovi near Zvornik in eastern Bosnia. The Mosque Doves executed 25 Bosnian Serb civilians. Left bottom, Bosnian Muslim forces crushed his skull with an axe, exposing his brain. Right bottom, the body of an elderly Bosnian Serb woman who was murdered by Bosnian Muslim forces.
Bosnian Serb civilian Zdravko Eric executed, burned and mutilated by the Bosnian Muslim paramilitary group Mosque Doves, Djamijski Golubovi, under Midhat Grahic fron Zvornik.
Srebrenica/Zvornik region: The body of a Bosnian Serb boy murdered by Naser Oric’s forces in the Srebrenica pocket in eastern Bosnia.
The body of Bosnian Serb Milovan Kovacevic whose body was mutilated and burned by Bosnian Muslim forces in Rogosije.
The decapitated head of Bosnian Serb farmer Pero Makic, who was executed by Bosnian Muslim/Croat forces in the northeastern Bosnian city of Brcko on June 22, 1992. His head was placed on a pitch-fork and a cigarette was placed in his mouth. One of the forks of the pitch-fork was stabbed in his eye. This is a photo that was censored and suppressed in the West and the US.
The decapitated head and torso of Bosnian Serb Miladin Asceric, who was executed and decapitated by Bosnian Muslim forces north of Srebrenica, in the town of Kamenica.
Sarajevo: The body of Bosnian Serb Nenad Beribaka. The Bosnian Muslim forces mutilated his body after killing him by extracting his brain.
Sarajevo: The body of a Bosnian Serb. Bosnian Muslim forces murdered and mutilated him by smashing his skull open.
A Serb soldier who was captured by the Muslims, skewered on a spear and exhibited in front of a hotel. “He stayed alive for a few days,” said a Serbian journalist. That set off wild rumors throughout Bosnian Serb-held territories.
Burned remains of Milomir Prodanovic, a Serb from Podravnje near Milici, Bosnia.
(From: “The Suppressed Serbian Voice And The Free Press In America” By William Dorich, 1994 – pp 20, 22.)
The mutilated body of Velo Majstorovic, who was tortured, killed, circumcized, and burned alive by Bosnian Muslim forces in Milici in eastern Bosnia, southwest of Srebrenica.
First massacre in Bosnia: March 26, 1992, Croat and Bosnian Muslim forces executed, mutilated, and beheaded 20 Bosnian Serb civilians in Sijekovac near Bosanski Brod. An 85 year Bosnian Serb was executed and then burned inside his house. The decapitated and mutilated corpses of Bosnian Serbs murdered in northern Bosnia near Brod.
As above, Bosnian Serbs brutally tortured, mutilated and murdered by Izetbegovic’s/Oric’s Islamist troops in Sijekovac near Bosanski Brod.
Photo 1) Saudi/Afghan-Arab mujahedeen with decapitated heads of Bosnian Serb POWs in 1992. Al-Qaeda funded and organized these early terrorist attacks against Bosnian Serbs.
Photo 2)Saudi/Afghan-Arab mujahedeen with decapitated heads of Bosnian Serb POWs in 1992. Al-Qaeda funded and organized these early terrorist attacks against Bosnian Serbs.
Saudi/Afghan-Arab mujahedeen holding the decapitated head of a Bosnian Serb POW who was executed and decapitated in central Bosnia in 1992.
Previous photo enlarged. The head of a Serb, Blagoje Blagojevic, held by an Arab Saudi/Afghan ‘Jihad’ fighter in Crni Vrh, Bosnia, 1992.
Previous 3 photos above) Alija Izetbegovic’s 10,000 strong Islamist fundamentalist “El Mujahedeen Unit” in Zenica, Bosnia on parade with green banners on their heads which read: “Our path is the Jihad” written in Arabic script.
See related articles,“Moderate Democrat or Radical Islamist? Who is Alija Izetbegovic, the man the US sponsored in Bosnia?”
http://www.hirhome.com/yugo/ihralija1.htm
“What really happened in Bosnia? Were the Serbs the criminal aggressors, as the official story claims, or were they the victims?”
http://emperors-clothes.com/analysis/deja.htm
What is this monument inscribed in Arabic script doing in Srebrenica (Potocari village), Bosnia? What is ex-president of the United States, Bill Clinton, doing here at the unveiling of this Arabic-inscribed monument dedicated to fallen al Qaeda Mujahedeen fighters in Srebrenica-Potocari, Bosnia? Why is Clinton bowing to this monument?
For the answers to these disturbing questions, see the articles
“Clinton opens a monument dedicated to Al Qaeda fighters and bows to it!”
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It appeared that the OHR wanted the statement issued before the opening of a Muslim monument — essentially a shrine which was being promoted as a site for annual Muslim pilgrimages from around the world — memorializing the radical Islamist allegations about events in Srebrenica to occur on September 19, 2003. The unveiling of the monument would be attended by former US Pres. William Clinton, and “finalizing” the Srebrenica case would help stop the ongoing wave of allegations of illegal Clinton Administration activity in supporting radical Islamist activities in Bosnia during the 1990s. This is particularly critical given the fact that a significant number of the Islamist terrorists involved in the September 11, 2001, terrorist attacks on the United States had strong links into the Bosnian Muslims whom Clinton had supported.
The US Embassy in Sarajevo donated $1-million to the construction of the “shrine”, even though all proper investigations of the Srebrenica affair in fact showed the Islamists’ claims to be unsubstantiated and, in many respects, without foundation at all.
Recent information emerging from Bosnia-Herzegovina, and particularly from the RS investigations into the Srebrenica affair and other aspects of terrorism in the region, have highlighted the fact that the Clinton Administration had, during the war, facilitated the Islamist terrorist activities because of the Clinton Administration’s need to demonize the Serbs in order to provide a casus belli for US-led military actions in the area to distract from domestic US political problems. Significantly, when the Muslim representatives involved in building the “shrine” in Srebrenica approached New York Mayor Michael Blumberg to establish a sister-city relationship with New York, the Mayor refused, based on intelligence showing the link between the Bosnian Islamists and the al-Qaida attacks on his city.
Amb. Hays’ two-page document was expected to lead to a statement, possibly as early as September 8, 2003, by RS officials, which would not only serve to protect the Clinton Administration officials, including the former US President, but would also serve as an admission of guilt of Serbs for killing thousands of Muslims who, in fact, were not known to have been killed. Several hundred bodies have been found as a result of the fighting in and around Srebrenica, but the Islamists and their supporters have claimed figures which grow higher with each telling, with figures now claiming some 15,000 alleged deaths. At the same time, there is no acknowledgement of the Muslim killing of thousands of Serbs at Srebrenica earlier in the war, when the city was supposed to have been a demilitarized zone.
http://128.121.186.47/ISSA/reports/Balkan/Sep0803.htm
Self-confessed mass murderer of Serbian civilians, Naser Oric, at the NATO owned ICTY in The Hague, Netherlands just prior to him being given a 2 year sentence by NATO for mass murder in Srebrenica.
Thousands of Bosnian Muslims (“Bosniaks”) gather at Sarajevo airport to welcome their “hero”, Alija Izetbegovic’s Islamist Nazi self-confessed mass murderer of Serbs in Srebrenica, Naser Oric.
Below quotes excerpted from the Canadian Toronto Star newspaper article: “A Reporter’s Account of an Evening Spent with Nasir Oric, the Muslim Commander in Srebrenica”Original title:
“Fearsome Muslim warlord eludes Bosnian Serb forces”
Toronto Star, July 16, 1995 By Bill Schiller
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On a cold and snowy night, I sat in his living room watching a shocking video version of what might have been called Nasir Oric’s Greatest Hits. There were burning houses, dead bodies, severed heads, and people fleeing.
Oric grinned throughout, admiring his handiwork.“We ambushed them,” he said when a number of dead Serbs appeared on the screen. The next sequence of dead bodies had been done in by explosives:“We launched those guys to the moon,” he boasted.
When footage of a bullet-marked ghost town appeared without any visible bodies, Oric hastened to announce: “We killed 114 Serbs there.”
Later there were celebrations, with singers with wobbly voices chanting his praises.
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Visit 4International for the balance of this important article.
What a strange world. Jo.S is calling for a new world order based on honesty and fighting for what is right. He is also suggesting the idea that Israel and other western nations be “a light unto other nations”. How strange. Oddly enough, it is because they try to follow those principles that I am a diehard Canadian Conservative.
The West as you call it is not a monolithic entity and should never be used in this context as such. For years the EU stood by and did nothing with regard to the fighting in the Balkans. It was the US who Pushed them into any unified action and then it was peripheral in nature with America Taking the lead in all areas. Here the Brave(sic) Europeans who couldn’t fight their way out of a diaper signed on really against their National wills, because Nato was at stake without that mission Nato would have closed up shop.
You are a biggy along with Ted and others on International Law! well in another world all the NATO countries and their leaders should have been tried for war crimes . They attacked with no provocation to themselves a sovereign nation, a legal member of the UN and in opposition to at least half the world bodies constituent member states. Even in this it was almost an all American show as the Europeans mainly played fig leaf for American aggression. In this Clinton and America are essentially if not in fact War criminals under the very laws and norms they accused Serbia of violating. Here was a classic case of might makes right.
That A. Sharon recognized this potential for its application in Israels conflict with the Palis was to his credit. He may have been shut up by the exigencies of our relationship with America but that does not lessen the potential in our conflict for similar American and Nato reaction in the future. It will never happen though as Either our leaders will cave under pressure or if we stand fast against America they will back down.
Sunday’s unilateral declaration of independence from Serbia by Kosovo is likely to have serious consequences, not only in the Balkans, but around the world.
Serbia called the declaration illegal and Russia denounced it. The United States, however, was among the first to recognize Kosovo as an independent nation, complicating a growing breach with Russia, China and some EU members, who are vehemently opposed to letting Kosovo break away from Serbia.
Minimally, this event threatens to touch off a new conflict in the Balkans. Riots have already broken out in Belgrade. According to our source in Belgrade, “Serbia is about to go up in flames” as thousands of ethnic Albanians, Muslims who represent 90% of Kosovo’s two million people, have stated their claim on the new state. According to our source, a systematic ethnic cleansing of Kosovo’s remaining Christian inhabitants has been going on for several years and will now likely escalate.
Since we have been supporting ‘democracy’ in Kosovo, and have ignored the strong Albanian Islamic influence in political affairs there, we have opened the gates to a new Islamic state, complete with terrorist training camps on the ground and a global network through which to funnel their graduates.
This begins a trail that leads to (but does not end in) New York City, where the ‘Albanian Mafia’ has taken over much of the drug and organized crime trade. The combination of the legitimization of their terrorist activities in Kosovo, their links to the US, and the fall of Serbia (partly self-inflicted) may spell a new era of unrest and confusion that will mean danger for US interests everywhere.
To illustrate the ripple effect that has already begun to appear, Yasser Abed Rabbo, a senior aide to Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas, said today, “Kosovo is not better than us. We deserve independence even before Kosovo, and we ask for the backing of the United States and the European Union for our independence.” He supported the position that Palestinians should unilaterally declare their own independence.
Kosovo’s move has opened a Pandora’s Box that is likely to release forces that will spin out of control very rapidly. Separatist movements in many parts of the world can take heart from Kosovo’s move and sow the seeds of chaos in a world that is already reeling from the effects of Islamic terror.
http://www.serbianna.com/news/2008/01406.shtml“The Islamic umma (nation) wishes the people of Kosovo and its government success in their new struggle to build a strong and prosperous country,” the Islamic bloc said in a statement issued from its headquarters in the Saudi city of Jeddah.”
The US and the Brits have recognised Kosova. But in the UK the majority were against the Balkan war with a clear majority supporting the Serbs, their WW II allies. The lies/propaganda used to sell that war is coming unstuck at the seems, similar questions related to Iraq are being demanded about the war against the Serbs. The Brit’s want to know why they are being used to fight Christians in the Balkans, whilst Muslim terrorists were being trained and armed to kill those same Christian Serbs? Lots of related names are coming up, same guys who lied (dodgy dossier) regarding Iraq. More Americans than ever openly questioning Jewish elites and loyalties. Neo Conservatism is Jew-centric, these guys are responsible for both wars. That isn’t opinion, that’s fact. things are starting to get bumpy and heads are getting buried in the sand. We need to do the right and honourable thing and be seen to be doing it, We need conservative voices, strong voices, honest voices – where the hell are they?
Precipice to WW III: http://www.serbianna.com/news/2008/01444.shtmlChina's U.N. Ambassador Wang Guangya said Monday that Beijing was “gravely concerned” over Kosovo’s declaration of independence, saying it “opposes unilateral action and objects to imposed solutions by pressure.”
Israel is more vulnerable today than she ever has been in 60 years, more Americans than ever are lashing out at US support. This is NOT because of the Palestinians so called suffering, it’s because of their own and the contempt shown to them by government. You can’t fool all of the people all of the time, all I’m hearing is “wars for Israel” and “Neo Con destabilizing of Western interest” This is not sideline stuff anymore. We need to get out there, standing by the Armenians, not lobbying against them “in our own interests” that is not in our interests. We need to stand with the Serbs, they stood by us for heavens sake and now we betray them? Are we a people or not? We have to pick a side, fight with them because when the tide turns, and it’s turning, if we decide then we’re on side, the nations against Islam will see us as no more than the other problamatic untrustworthy semites. The ones who start wars, don’t want to fight them.
I am for fighting, I am with the Serbs. I am for Israel, no more land, no more surrender to terror. This weakkneed bullshit has to stop right here or we are finished, and we’ll deserve it!
Oh, and the massacre that never was, but hey it’s on wikipedia – So is Jenin! Grow up, smell the coffee. It’s called propaganda. They found 2000 bodies (not 8000) this was after the fighting, most of the bodies were fighters/soldiers. It is called war! they suppressed reports of massacres of the Serbians, the rapes, the beheadings, the Serbs burned alive. It’s coming out, all over Europe they are challenging the “official version” so I suggest those who put their name to this terrible injustice, back track and do it real fast.
March for the Serbs!
– White House protest, February 24, 1:00 PM
– Toronto February 23
– Vancouver February 24
– Phoenix: February 23, 5:30pm, Wesley Bolin Plaza, details
– KosovoIsSerbia.org
– Petition to Senate: Keep Serbia United! Sign
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/petition/905791187
Yamit, I saved yours for last because your comment was the longest.
First off, I know the phrase radical Islam rankles you, but as I have told you before, I use it only as a convenient shorthand label. It is more complex then that I know and I may even agree with all that you have in mind, but then again I am not sure of all you have in mind in that regard.
Secondly, the points you make as regards the Serbs and the Albanians of Kosovo lead to your concluding point:
I would disagree with you to this extent.
The West need not consider whether it should take Serbia’s side or not.
The West should be taking its own side. The West should be asking itself, why should it support an independent Muslim state of Kosovo, when the Muslims there will not have a democratic and pro-Western state, but rather a state that is anti-West and where a number of its citizens have in past and will continue to join Jihadists in terrorist attacks either directly or indirectly on Westerners and Western interests?
To put it more simply, why is the West supporting and rewarding a society that acts towards it like an enemy rather then a friend?
The answers lie I am quite certain, not in morality and justice, but in how the West defines its self interest and how it sees its interests can best be served.
There are as we both have noted, some cracks forming in the American and EU support for an independent Kosovo. We will have to wait and see whether those cracks are smoothed over or are widened into a gap too wide to bridge.
Infidel Warrior,
In calling for me to support my contrary views, you still are ignoring my point with Enigmax which was not to argue the merits of his points, but that he made those points against things I did not say or imply, but which he nonetheless attributed to me.
If you want to debate some specific statement I made, please let me know what it is, what your position is in that regard and I will provide you with an answer that is responsive to your point.
Due to timing, we talked a lot about Kosovo here. But it seems like a better idea to continue this discussion on the Kosovo article that Ted published here
As I said on the other post, I know that it sounds crazy but I do believe that the Nazis are back, but they have morphed into ME Jihadists and EU Socialists. If that’s the case then this isn’t just about “appeasing the Arab world”, it’s bigger than that.
Bakababe,
Contrary to what you thought, I do see some parallels, between the Israel-Palestinian conflict/war and Serbia and the Muslims of Kosovo. I have previously in other posts in other contexts, made the same point myself.
I generally agree with your take on things in your comment #69.
There are a number of significant differences between the history leading up to and surrounding the Israel-Palestinian conflict/war and the Serb/Muslim-Kosovo conflict, but I will leave those differences for another post.
One parallel in particular that is as troubling to Israel as it is to Serbia, is the grave concern that the big Western powers have the ability to dictate solutions to both that is not nearly as much in their interests, as those solutions are in the interests of the Western powers.
What is worth noting however is that while there is prevailing support amongst Western nations for recognizing an independent state of Kosovo, there are some nations, such as Greece and Turkey who are against such recognition. Their reasons, like the reasons the Russians advance have nothing to do with recognizing any parallel between Israel and Serbia.
Further, whether one believes the Serbs are the innocents or the villains in the Balkan wars of the 1990’s, as I earlier pointed out, that was then and this is now.
Now and over the last 5 – 10 years, it has become increasingly clear that the Muslims of the Kosovo region and not just the KLA have become more radicalized. As such, they have engaged in Jihadist terrorist activities in and outside their area which have been directed against the West. They thus pose a real threat to the West.
Add to that, it is clear from reports that an independent state of Kosovo will be anything but democratic, but will be more likely then not, trampling or denying human rights, especially those of non-Muslims. The destruction by the Muslims of the area of 100’s of Serbian churches is something that should not have gone unnoticed by America and the EU, but it apparently has.
As I mentioned earlier, given what has transpired over just the recent last number of years, even if the Muslims were the innocents and the Serbs the villains in the Balkan war of the 1990’s, the Muslims in Kosovo are no longer the innocents.
So why does the West persist in supporting the Muslims of Kosovo to realize their self determination in their own break away state from Serbia against Serbian protests? Why does the West persist in pushing Israel towards an independent Palestinian state solution, even though almost every effort to that end is being frustrated by the Palestinians?
The answer most give has to do with Western appeasement of the wishes of the Arab oil powers that have no love of Jews and Israel and thus to protect their own interests, the West courts Muslim favor by pushing Israel towards what many have characterized as the peace of the grave. Some offer the same reason for why the West pushes for an independent state of Kosovo, knowing that they are rewarding a society that has engaged in various acts that should be of great concern to the West and a society that bears the West no good will.
Incidentally, it was reported about a year or so ago that Pres. Sharon did make a statement the nature of which I don’t recall, that did come out in favor of the Serbs, but he was quickly muzzled by America.
The point I earlier made that I could not see Israel coming out against an independent state of Kosovo, if only because it did not want to take a position against America in that regard, still seems to be a fair conclusion from what we all are witnessing.
Unholy Alliance: The CIA & KLA
Central to the manufacturing of the war against Yugoslavia was the role of the Kosovo Liberation Army, a gang of fascist terrorists that collaborated with the imperialist nations. But the KLA-imperialist connection is much deeper: the imperialist armies and intelligence agencies funded, trained, armed, advised, and even commanded the KLA, transforming it into a significant military force. The nature of the KLA is still of great importance because it reveals much about the nature of the imperialist powers and because the KLA remains a major force in Kosovo and does not have and never did have any intention of disbanding or relinquishing power.
Perhaps confusion about the Kosovo Liberation Army originates with the organization’s deceptive name. The army is not from Kosovo.
According to The New York Times, the original terrorists were joined by “foreign mercenaries” who “speak German better than they do Albanian” and put on German army uniforms after quitting jobs in Europe, primarily Germany and Switzerland, to fly to Kosovo in planes full of recruits.
The Washington Post added that all of the KLA’s funding comes from abroad, primarily the United States, and that the US KLA support group has raised over $4 million, helped greatly by its US public relations firm, Ruder Finn, which has a long history as a propagandist for CIA dirty wars.
Liberation was not the KLA’s goal; the leadership made no secret of its desire for ethnic purification, finishing what the Nazi invasion began during World War II.
And finally, the title of Army seems a bit of a self-glorifying exaggeration for a group that assassinated civilians, ran away when another army came to fight in favor of letting its NATO air force handle the war, and only returned when the Yugoslav army had left.
The KLA’s official beginning came in 1996, when the group proudly announced responsibility for a massacre of refugees. But the real roots of the KLA, and the war in Kosovo, are the macroeconomic policies and institutions of imperialism. An article in Polyconomics, run by a former Wall Street Journal editor, found in a report that “ordinary people turned into ethnic monsters only after all their options for a normal economic life were destroyed. “Ethnic cleansing” arrived only after “shock therapy” had done its work.” Canadian author Michel Chussodovsky explained in greater detail:
“The break-up of the Yugoslav federation bears a direct relationship to the program of macro-economic restructuring imposed on the Belgrade government by its external creditors. This program, adopted in several stages since 1980, contributed to triggering the collapse of the national economy, leading to the disintegration of the industrial sector and the piecemeal dismantling of the welfare state. Secessionist tendencies, feeding on social and ethnic divisions, gained impetus precisely during a period of brutal impoverishment of the Yugoslav population.”
It would be absurd to credit the KLA with any positive political leanings; KLA leader Jakup Krasniqi conceded, “I do not think we have an ideology. We do not have time for such things.” Nevertheless, both the leadership and the rank and file have an agenda that they sought to promote through war and to which they remain committed. The ultimate goal was to create an ethnically pure state where all other ethnicities would be driven out or killed, to finish the effort that began a half-century before through the collaboration of the Nazis and the KLA soldiers’ “fathers and grandfathers [who] fought with fascist Italy against the Serbs during World War II.” (NYT) An article in Foreign Affairs described the current movement:
“[It is] led by sons and grandsons of the rightist Albanian fighters either the heirs of those who fought in the World War II fascist militias and the Skanderbeg volunteer SS division raised by the Nazis, or the descendents of the rightist Albanian kacak rebels who rose up against the Serbs 80 years ago.
The decision by the KLA commanders to dress their police in black fatigues and order their fighters to salute with a clenched fist to the forehead has led many to worry about these fascist antecedents. Following such criticism, the salute has been changed to the traditional open-palm salute common in the U.S. Army.”
It should be noted that the US worried not that the KLA was a fascist organization, but that it would become evident that it was a fascist organization. With the clothing and salute abandoned, the KLA no longer appeared fascist on the outside; it is, however, still very much a fascist force on the inside.
Another cause for concern in the imperialist network was the connection between the KLA and criminal syndicates in Albania, Turkey and the EU, particularly with respect to the KLA’s heavy involvement in the heroin trade.</a>
However, this raised alarm primarily in Europe, where the issue was widely publicized, and did not disturb the CIA, which has long encouraged the drug trade as a source of revenue for its dirty wars.
Hashim Thaci, the head of the KLA, is a favorite of Madeleine Albright, James Rubin, and the rest of the imperialist establishment.
It is easy to see why: he murdered rival leaders in the KLA and Albanian nationalist movements and killed, arrested, or purged anyone who appeared hostile, according to The New York Times. As an Albanian nationalist aligned with Ibrahim Rugova noted, “cadavers have never been an obstacle to Thaci’s career.”
Very similar to many other past and present agents of imperialism, he is a ruthless military leader who made the KLA powerful by “threaten[ing] to kill villagers and burn their homes if they did not join the KLA,” according to the US State Department, which encouraged Americans to send him money.
To accomplish their goals, Thaci and the KLA began with assassinations and bombings that were intended to increase repression by Belgrade. “Any armed action we undertook would bring retaliation against civilians,” Thaci explained. “We knew we were endangering a great number of civilian lives.” But, as Dug Gorani, a non-KLA Kosovo Albanian negotiator said, “The more civilians were killed, the chances of international intervention became bigger, and the KLA of course realized that. There was this foreign diplomat who once told me, ‘Look, unless you pass the quota of five thousand deaths you’ll never have anybody permanently present in Kosovo from foreign diplomacy.'”
When attempts to create real carnage failed, the US ambassador announced a massacre in the village of Racak that served as the pretext for the war. Later, reports in two of France’s largest newspapers and video from Associated Press TV journalists found major holes in the story, leading to the conclusion that the KLA faked the massacre by redressing and accumulating its own dead.
Working closely with the KLA throughout this entire period were the imperialist powers, notably the United States. Immediately before the war began, Robert Gelbard, the senior US envoy to the Balkans, called the KLA a terrorist organization.
The State Department naturally labeled the KLA a terrorist organization, too, but then suddenly changed its mind so that people could send money to the group. It was still a terrorist organization, only now it was a US-supported terrorist organization.
A long list of agencies from the US and Europe aided the KLA. Jane’s Defense Weekly, reporting “special forces involvement confirmed,” said that units from Britain, France, the US, and other NATO countries were working undercover in Kosovo. The London Telegraph reported that the KLA was working with the US paramilitary mercenary company, MPRI, and that the British special forces unit, SAS, ran KLA training camps in Albania, from which KLA soldiers entered Kosovo.
The French press agency, AFP, reported that three French army officers died while commanding the KLA. PBS “Newshour” reported that US veterans were training KLA soldiers. The Sunday Times wrote that the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe gave the KLA equipment to communicate with NATO. The paper also interviewed multiple sources working for the CIA who admitted to training KLA soldiers and “giving covert assistance to the KLA.”
Most important of all in supporting the KLA was probably the collaborative effort of the CIA and the German Bundes Nachrichten Dienst, which together supplied funding, German uniforms, East German weapons, other equipment, and training to the KLA. The entire imperialist network was thus at war with Yugoslavia long before the official fighting began.
It has been shown, using exclusively pro-US sources, that the imperialist countries played a central role in creating, training, and arming the KLA, a band of proudly fascist terrorists.
The more interesting and significantly more important question of why imperialism allied itself with the fascist terrorists and concocted the war against Yugoslavia is a subject for another essay, but an uncharacteristically insightful explanation was provided by President Clinton:
“If we’re going to have a strong economic relationship that includes our ability to sell around the world, Europe has got to be a key …That’s what this Kosovo thing is all about.”
Mr. Narvey,
I’ve seen some emotional outbursts on the pages of various discussion forums in my time but your hysterical attack on everyone here who disagrees with your views really takes the proverbial cake.You really need to take a chill-out pill, Bill.
Contrary to what you claim, I am not a “fanatical pro-Serb extremist”. I am someone who cares for exposing the irrefutable facts presented here proving Islamofascist genocide actually occurred in the former Yugoslavia.
You claim that
Nathan Pearlstein’s use of the word “patriotism” was not in that context at all and that was clearly explained to you by enigmax.But you choose not to acceept that.That’s your prerogative.
Bill,how about providing some factual hard evidence and documentation in support of your contrary views and opinions regarding the points made by people whom you disagree with instead of just name-calling, ad hominem labelling and insults?
Bill: Stop using terms like radicalized Islam etc. That is the mental trap you can’t seem to escape!
Among major world powers, both Russia and China are opposed to an independent Kosovo. Even within Europe there are nations that oppose this independence — Spain — and others where many are uneasy. It would have been politically possible for the American government to have thought a bit more about the implications, the consequences, of having another Muslim state — the product of centuries of Ottoman rule — within Europe, and to have thought a bit more about the historical treatment of the Serbs under that same Ottoman rule, and their understandable bitterness.
There is an independent Albania. Those Albanians who might wish to be in a state that politically embodies their desires could move. The notion that when Muslim populations exist, they must never be asked to endure minority status, and that only the non-Muslim populations are to be asked to do so, is wrong.
There are problems with mere head-counting. One are the tricks one can play with the region whose heads are being counted. If you rip Kosovo out of Serbia, then you will indeed have an area, “Kosovo,” where the Albanians constitute most of the population. Is that the end of the matter? I can find, and so can you, all kinds of places, now part of larger countries, where this or that minority constitute, in a particular area or city, the majority — even if they are the minority elsewhere. So what?
Surely there were other things to consider. What has happened to Serbian monasteries and churches in places now under full Albanian control — that is, those Albanians who are Muslim? Is there a tradition of treating non-Muslims, in this case Serbs, well or ill?
In alerting people to the attacks on Serbs, to the destruction of ancient monasteries, on the infiltration into the area of Arabs with a brand of Islam quite different from the relaxed, syncretistic, version — not exactly full-bodied Islam in practice, because that local practice was affected by the centuries of proximity to non-Muslims, and to the effect of Communism, one is not endorsing any massacres by some Serbs. One can distance oneself — most Serbs do, unfeignedly — from Milosevich and those atrocities that were committed by some Serb forces. And one can also keep in mind both the exaggerations of those atrocities, and the minimizing or even ignoring not only of the atrocities committed by the Muslims, as well as the entire history of the area, the centuries of Muslim rule, the devshirme, and the deep fears evoked when Izetbegovic wrote that he intended to create a Muslim state and impose the Shari’a. Had the Western world shown the slightest intelligent sympathy or understanding of what that set off in the imagination of many Serbs, there might never have been such a reaction, and someone like Milosevic might never have obtained power.
Why wasn’t there? Why didn’t those in the West study what Izetbegovic said? Why didn’t they read what Serb historians, and writers, including Ivo Andric (in his doctoral dissertation, recently-reprinted, “The Development of Spiritual Life in Bosnia under the Influence of Turkish Rule”) were aware of, and that had never been forgotten? When Clinton ordered the bombing of the Serbs, had he heard, ever, about the devshirme? Did he know that Izetbegovic had written about imposing the shari’a? No, of course not. But had he, and had others, they might have reassured the Serbs long before, and helped to make them less panicky, less prone to give power to someone like Milosevic. The West entirely mishandled Serbia.
And right now, despite the dribs and drabs that begin to come out about the exaggerations on which criticism and bombing of Serbians was based, despite the new evidence, or the evidence no longer hidden, of past Muslim atrocities, the Western world still seems ready to overlook what is now happening. And what is now happening are attacks on Serbian villagers, and the destruction of Serbian churches, in Kosovo. Is one supposed to permanently blame Serbia, and never take its side, because of what Milosevic did? Is one to overlook the role of Bosnia as a place of training for those who could tomorrow be conducting Jihad anywhere in the world?
There is no reason not to take Serbia’s side now. There is every reason — of principle and of Infidel self-interest — to take it.
Perhaps the rule should be, all over the Western and larger Infidel world, this: whatever makes the Umma happy, or the O.I.C. happy, is to be opposed for that very reason. That’s a rule of thumb. What, after all, is Man, if not Homo pollex?
Bill,
It really surprises me to hear this from you, because I meant to tell you that I agreed with your earlier statement about “finding it hard to locate Serbs to stand with”.
Serb governments not “completely innocent” in the civil wars that consumed Yugoslavia, any more than the Israeli government is “completely innocent” in every altercation with Palestinians. That does not make it a 50/50 in either case, nor does it make all Serbs or all Israelis all “guilty” of anything. Fighting wars for your survival is never clean & perfect, and both our peoples are struggling with this.
The reason why some Serb activists have “found a home here” as you put it, is that we see not only the parallels of both struggles, but the direct implication of one struggle on another — and some of us saw it years ago already in the making. Politics is a chess game planning many moves ahead, not just checkers with an action & reaction. Some people see the checkmate with a few opening moves and some don’t.
It is no coincidence that only a few days after Kosovo Independence you get articles like this: “Palestinians should follow Kosovo example: negotiator” This is the beginning, Bill, not the end. There is no way that the West would have spent so much time & money on this, breaking every international law if this were just about “Serbia & Kosovo”. This is a chess move to take out Israel, and if you can’t see it then I am sorry. But Ted & many others here, can see it.
BB
felix: T
Felix the Jews are still around and going strong on the world stage . Where are the Nazis today? It is a given that if the Question of Israel were to come up for a vote today it would be overwhelmingly be rejected. Largely due to the holocaust Israel got those few needed votes to have resolution passed. This is what I call God directed history. Even an ex Catholic can surely see something out of the ordinary taking place before our eyes.I should not exist according to your realism nor should any Jew. we defy your realism past theory , present theory and future! Your belief and trust is in man and his Brain but as no two philosophers have ever agreed one with another you must surely see the fault on relying only on the Brain and good will of Man? In the Purim story I tried not so successfully to point out that antisemitism and state fascism have ancient roots .. BEEN THERE DONE THAT!! There is nothing new under Heaven, The Hebrew Year is 5768, There is nothing today that is happening to the Jew that we have not experienced before during our long history. History defines winners and losers by who is the last man standing. It will always be the Jew!! Even if we are greatly depleted!!
Thanks Ted!
BB
Infidel Warrior and all pro-Serb fanatical extremists who have found a home on Israpundit,
Infidel Warrior, you are dead wrong to say:
At least you managed to notice that the points I did raise had nothing to do with Nathan Pearlstein’s introduction. That was because I did not raise those points and facts to take issue with him or the article. I simply raised some additional facts that I thought were of some relevance and worth noting.
The only point I did raise to question Nathan Pearlstein’s view, was on the very narrow point of just one of his statements, which was:
I assumed Nathan was very deliberate in his using reference to the word patriotism, especially when it comes to his calling on diaspora Jews and Israelis to speak out in favor of the Serbs. I questioned the basis for that statement as regards the use of the word patriotism. That was it.
Notwithstanding that, you zealous pro-Serb contingent of commenters on Israpundit, including it appears yourself, are not capable of countenancing anyone daring to disagree with you, in even the slightest way on any of your views which you claim your perfect logic brings you to after accepting as absolute truth, that the Serbs were the innocents and the Muslims the villains in the Balkan wars of the 1990’s.
Nor it appears, will pro-Serb fanatics tolerate anyone mentioning a fact that does not seem to fit into the way they want to see things.
The reaction I have received to my single question as to the basis for Nathan Pearlstein saying this was an issue of patriotism for diaspora Jews and Israelis, is the same kind of angry irrational reaction I received last year, when I dared to ask some questions or take issue with the logic of pro-Serb zealots that flowed from their facts.
Last year, I dared to ask some question or challenge some views, always premised on my accepting the position of these pro-Serb fanatics, that it was the Serbs who were the innocents and the Muslims the villains.
The reaction I got from these pro-Serb extremists was blind, irrational raging diatribes and accusations premised first on accusing me of rejecting their conclusion that the Serbs were innocent in spite of my clearly saying otherwise, badly mis-stating what I did say or attributing to me implications that were utter nonsense and then their proceeding to launch into disingenuous and dishonest argumentative tirades as well as accusing me of supporting Oliver Kamm, Tom Lantos, and Joe Lieberman on the issue of the Serb-Muslim 1990’s wars.
In fact, I hardly knew what these people were saying on the issue, beyond knowing that these pro-Serb fanatical extremists were enraged by them. I guess since pro-Serb fanatics revile these aforementioned people, accusing me of being in league with them was their ultimate insult.
Now again, I come up against pro-Serb fanatical extremists, whose fanaticism deprives them of all logic and reason and leaves them only with hate towards anyone whose views do not precisely correspond with their’s or who dares to ask a question or raise other facts that are or may be relevant to the discussion, but which may not fit into the way they want things to look.
To all you pro-Serb fanatical extremists who have found a home on Israpundit, as far as I can see, you are a disgrace to the whole idea of civil, reasoned and honest discussion and debate with anyone who might disagree, even slightly with the way you think or express yourselves or who might mention some point or fact you have not thought of or observed and which does not fit within your perception of how things look or should look.
You only appear to have the capacity for civility when it comes to discussing and debating amongst yourselves as you applaud your brother fanatics for agreeing with you or in your trying to outdo one another in the way you seek to express views that you are all in agreement with.
I know what you pro-Serb fanatical extremists think of me.
I just did not want to leave any room for doubt in your minds as to exactly what I think of you.
Thanks BB
I reposted Daniels article.
And the comparisons have already begun between Kosovo & Palestine. “Palestinians should follow Kosovo example: negotiator”
Ted & All,
Daniel Greenfield on IsraeleNews did a really good article on the subject today: Kosovo and Islam`s Balkanization of the World It’s a classic on the subject.
BB
Nigel I checked out your video. Good work. Could you set up a Power Point presentation of these pictures and some comments.
Enigmax and Nathan are working on an article which gives the background to the conflict starting with the Muslim provocations.
I am going to ask them to write an article which illustrates the commonalities between that conflict between Serbs and Muslims and the one between the Jews and the Arabs.
The parallels are astounding. They include, the propagation of hate among the Muslims, the fabrication of “atrocities by the Muslims, the complicity of the western media and leftist organizations, the help by the US and the EU, the terrorism, the involvement of Saudi Arabia and Iran, the complicity of the UN, the attempt to create another Muslim State even if it is terrorist, the violation of sovereignty of Serbs by taking their land of of Jews by denying the Palestine Mandate which held the land on trust for the Jews.
Unholy Alliance: The CIA & KLA
Central to the manufacturing of the war against Yugoslavia was the role of the Kosovo Liberation Army, a gang of fascist terrorists that collaborated with the imperialist nations. But the KLA-imperialist connection is much deeper: the imperialist armies and intelligence agencies funded, trained, armed, advised, and even commanded the KLA, transforming it into a significant military force. The nature of the KLA is still of great importance because it reveals much about the nature of the imperialist powers and because the KLA remains a major force in Kosovo and does not have and never did have any intention of disbanding or relinquishing power.
Perhaps confusion about the Kosovo Liberation Army originates with the organization’s deceptive name. The army is not from Kosovo.
According to The New York Times, the original terrorists were joined by “foreign mercenaries” who “speak German better than they do Albanian” and put on German army uniforms after quitting jobs in Europe, primarily Germany and Switzerland, to fly to Kosovo in planes full of recruits.
The Washington Post added that all of the KLA’s funding comes from abroad, primarily the United States, and that the US KLA support group has raised over $4 million, helped greatly by its US public relations firm, Ruder Finn, which has a long history as a propagandist for CIA dirty wars.
Liberation was not the KLA’s goal; the leadership made no secret of its desire for ethnic purification, finishing what the Nazi invasion began during World War II.
And finally, the title of Army seems a bit of a self-glorifying exaggeration for a group that assassinated civilians, ran away when another army came to fight in favor of letting its NATO air force handle the war, and only returned when the Yugoslav army had left.
The KLA’s official beginning came in 1996, when the group proudly announced responsibility for a massacre of refugees. But the real roots of the KLA, and the war in Kosovo, are the macroeconomic policies and institutions of imperialism. An article in Polyconomics, run by a former Wall Street Journal editor, found in a report that “ordinary people turned into ethnic monsters only after all their options for a normal economic life were destroyed. “Ethnic cleansing” arrived only after “shock therapy” had done its work.” Canadian author Michel Chussodovsky explained in greater detail:
“The break-up of the Yugoslav federation bears a direct relationship to the program of macro-economic restructuring imposed on the Belgrade government by its external creditors. This program, adopted in several stages since 1980, contributed to triggering the collapse of the national economy, leading to the disintegration of the industrial sector and the piecemeal dismantling of the welfare state. Secessionist tendencies, feeding on social and ethnic divisions, gained impetus precisely during a period of brutal impoverishment of the Yugoslav population.”
It would be absurd to credit the KLA with any positive political leanings; KLA leader Jakup Krasniqi conceded, “I do not think we have an ideology. We do not have time for such things.” Nevertheless, both the leadership and the rank and file have an agenda that they sought to promote through war and to which they remain committed. The ultimate goal was to create an ethnically pure state where all other ethnicities would be driven out or killed, to finish the effort that began a half-century before through the collaboration of the Nazis and the KLA soldiers’ “fathers and grandfathers [who] fought with fascist Italy against the Serbs during World War II.” (NYT) An article in Foreign Affairs described the current movement:
“[It is] led by sons and grandsons of the rightist Albanian fighters either the heirs of those who fought in the World War II fascist militias and the Skanderbeg volunteer SS division raised by the Nazis, or the descendents of the rightist Albanian kacak rebels who rose up against the Serbs 80 years ago.
The decision by the KLA commanders to dress their police in black fatigues and order their fighters to salute with a clenched fist to the forehead has led many to worry about these fascist antecedents. Following such criticism, the salute has been changed to the traditional open-palm salute common in the U.S. Army.”
It should be noted that the US worried not that the KLA was a fascist organization, but that it would become evident that it was a fascist organization. With the clothing and salute abandoned, the KLA no longer appeared fascist on the outside; it is, however, still very much a fascist force on the inside.
Another cause for concern in the imperialist network was the connection between the KLA and criminal syndicates in Albania, Turkey and the EU, particularly with respect to the KLA’s heavy involvement in the heroin trade.</a>
However, this raised alarm primarily in Europe, where the issue was widely publicized, and did not disturb the CIA, which has long encouraged the drug trade as a source of revenue for its dirty wars.
Hashim Thaci, the head of the KLA, is a favorite of Madeleine Albright, James Rubin, and the rest of the imperialist establishment.
It is easy to see why: he murdered rival leaders in the KLA and Albanian nationalist movements and killed, arrested, or purged anyone who appeared hostile, according to The New York Times. As an Albanian nationalist aligned with Ibrahim Rugova noted, “cadavers have never been an obstacle to Thaci’s career.”
Very similar to many other past and present agents of imperialism, he is a ruthless military leader who made the KLA powerful by “threaten[ing] to kill villagers and burn their homes if they did not join the KLA,” according to the US State Department, which encouraged Americans to send him money.
To accomplish their goals, Thaci and the KLA began with assassinations and bombings that were intended to increase repression by Belgrade. “Any armed action we undertook would bring retaliation against civilians,” Thaci explained. “We knew we were endangering a great number of civilian lives.” But, as Dug Gorani, a non-KLA Kosovo Albanian negotiator said, “The more civilians were killed, the chances of international intervention became bigger, and the KLA of course realized that. There was this foreign diplomat who once told me, ‘Look, unless you pass the quota of five thousand deaths you’ll never have anybody permanently present in Kosovo from foreign diplomacy.'”
When attempts to create real carnage failed, the US ambassador announced a massacre in the village of Racak that served as the pretext for the war. Later, reports in two of France’s largest newspapers and video from Associated Press TV journalists found major holes in the story, leading to the conclusion that the KLA faked the massacre by redressing and accumulating its own dead.
Working closely with the KLA throughout this entire period were the imperialist powers, notably the United States. Immediately before the war began, Robert Gelbard, the senior US envoy to the Balkans, called the KLA a terrorist organization.
The State Department naturally labeled the KLA a terrorist organization, too, but then suddenly changed its mind so that people could send money to the group. It was still a terrorist organization, only now it was a US-supported terrorist organization.
A long list of agencies from the US and Europe aided the KLA. Jane’s Defense Weekly, reporting “special forces involvement confirmed,” said that units from Britain, France, the US, and other NATO countries were working undercover in Kosovo. The London Telegraph reported that the KLA was working with the US paramilitary mercenary company, MPRI, and that the British special forces unit, SAS, ran KLA training camps in Albania, from which KLA soldiers entered Kosovo.
The French press agency, AFP, reported that three French army officers died while commanding the KLA. PBS “Newshour” reported that US veterans were training KLA soldiers. The Sunday Times wrote that the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe gave the KLA equipment to communicate with NATO. The paper also interviewed multiple sources working for the CIA who admitted to training KLA soldiers and “giving covert assistance to the KLA.”
Most important of all in supporting the KLA was probably the collaborative effort of the CIA and the German Bundes Nachrichten Dienst, which together supplied funding, German uniforms, East German weapons, other equipment, and training to the KLA. The entire imperialist network was thus at war with Yugoslavia long before the official fighting began.
It has been shown, using exclusively pro-US sources, that the imperialist countries played a central role in creating, training, and arming the KLA, a band of proudly fascist terrorists.
The more interesting and significantly more important question of why imperialism allied itself with the fascist terrorists and concocted the war against Yugoslavia is a subject for another essay, but an uncharacteristically insightful explanation was provided by President Clinton:
“If we’re going to have a strong economic relationship that includes our ability to sell around the world, Europe has got to be a key …. That’s what this Kosovo thing is all about.”
I’ve produced a video plugging this very important thread at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2DLa_XM7yQ
The fact that there’s a 10 minute limit on Youtube videos and that I was containing my anger and disgust, means it is not quite what I wanted to produce. However, I think it gets the message out particularly when combined with the links in the description column which I advise viewers to read.
Feel free to embed it in blogs far and wide, if you feel it will help.
Last Month in Croatia :
First: Neo-nazi threats to Serbs and Jews in Croatia
15.1.2008.Today on the 15th of January 2008 in the late afternoon hours, church community in Split has received a letter full of national hatred and with neo-nazi threats in which it is claimed that Serbs and Jews in Croatia will and sholud be slaughtered and butchered.In this appalling letter fascism and ustashi; Ante Pavelic and «holy» concentration camps of Jasenovac and Stara Gradiska are praised; it is also full of awful menaces such as «Serbs to be butchered», «Juden raus» and some such.
Besides, it is said in this petrifying note that Serbs in Croatia should be exterminated; and death threats are even send to the president of Croatia Stjepan Mesic.
The police has been informed about this case and the investigation is ongoing.
———————————————————————————————————-
Then: The Orthodox Cathedral in Split attacked again
Just a couple of days after the letter with neo-nazi threats addressed to the Orthodox church community in Split, another violent attack occured this morning, on the 18th of January 2008, when it has been discovered that the doors and walls of the manse are full of neo-nazi and ustashi grafitti, such as: «Serbs to be butchered!» together with ustashi simbol of capital letter U with a sign of cross above it.
These disturbing events, which lately occur very frequently on the territory of the Dalmatian Diocese augur badly for the ominous time of the Second World War when a lot of people lost their lives only because of their nationality or faith.
However, it is of great concern, if there are such people, who so furiously attack Church, knowing that its mission is to preach Gospel and the values of evangelic love, which it does in the spirit od truth and peace.
If these vandals remain anonymous and unpunished, we are afraid that the whole situation might become more complicated and provoke even more sufferings. Believers of the Serbian Orthodox Church are constantly praying to God to put an end to this present agony; and that our Lord may soften the hearts of those vandals and preclude their hate towards the Serbian Orthodox Christians, as well as towards the Jews – the nation from which Our Lord Jesus Christ, the Most Holy Theotokos and all Holy Apostles originated.
Everyone who blasphems God and His sanctuaries is deprived of His blessings in this world as well as in the world that is to come. As for the matters of this world, Orthodox church community in Split, as well as, the Diocese appeal to state institutions in Croatia to protect their citizens – Orthodox Serbs, and citizens of other nationalities, so they might all live in peace and mutal understanding
Mr. Narvey, you ascribed and attributed to Nathan Pearlstein’s introduction to the main article a plethora of points he did not actually make at all.
I read enimax’s reply to you and I can see that he honestly and in good faith took you to task for doing precisely just that to Nathan’s introductory remarks.
It’s a little like the pot calling the kettle black for you to accuse enigmax of being an “irrational zealot”; of being “venal”, “dishonest”, “disingenuous” and engaging in “pontification” and “sarcasm”, now isn’t it Bill?
“Secretary General of the Organisation of The Islamic Conference, Prof. Ekmeleddin Ihsanoglu says that the organization is rejoicing that Kosovo separatists have declared independence views the new state as an asset to Islam.”
http://www.serbianna.com/news/2008/01430.shtml
Yamit,
According to reports, a great many, if not most of the Muslims of the Kosovo area are radicalized and as such stand firmly against Israel. If Kosovo is recognized as a full fledged voting member of the U.N., they will doubtless join the O.I.C. against Israel.
Credible reports have also surfaced that some of the radical Jihadist terrorist acts in the world have been committed by Albanian Muslims.
Kosovo becoming an independent state however, other then lending an anti-Israel voice at the U.N. and in the court of public opinion, will not in my view increase the number of Muslims in the region of Kosovo, leaving their land to join in Jihad against the West or Israel. That is already happening and will continue to happen whether Kosovo becomes a state or not.
That Europeans are threatened from Jihadist Muslims in Kosovo and knowing the region is becoming increasingly radicalized, it boggles the mind why the EU would for the most part support Kosovo becoming an independent state, even if they are convinced it was the Serbs who were the villains in the Balkan wars of the 1990’s. Since it is now the increasingly radicalized Muslims of Kosovo that pose a real threat to the EU, one would have thought that the EU would stand by the Serbs to prevent that from happening.
As for the nations, such as Greece and Turkey that have come out against the Muslims of Kosovo having their own independent state, that has nothing to do with their believing that the Muslims were the villains in the Balkan wars of the 1990’s and that it is immoral to support the Muslims of Kosovo in their quest.
Rather they are fearful of it establishing not only a precedent, but a motivation for ethnic communities within their nations, to fight for their own national self determination, demand their own break away state and then see that the rest of the EU and the world, siding with these ethnic minorities.
So in a nutshell, I do not disagree with you or with Enigmax to the extent he might make that same point. Nor did I necessarily disagree with what Enigmax was saying.
My disagreement had only to do with the fact that Enigmax was disingenuously seeking to score debating points with me by making arguments against points I did not make.
My disagreement with Enigmax and Ted is as simple as that.
Bill
It is not enough for you to argue “it ain’t necessarily so” you must present facts to support a different conclusion. And such facts must be enough to turn Nathan’s whole thesis on its head and not just poke a hole in it.
So are you saying he is wrong. That’s the only question. Yes or no.
If the answer is “yes” then make your case, one that is more compelling than his.
While his case is not without blemish because nothing is absolute or black or white, but we must take sides none the less. I side with him.
In a presidential election we may see things we like about either contestant but in the end we must decide. Same here.
Bill you seem to be one of those who cannot take criticism or disapproval by anyone especially Ted. Your pique is all the more ringing due to the fact that you are largely wrong or choose the wrong sides in your arguments, that of course is my opinion and I stand on it. that being said without either going into the History of the Serb and Balkans conflicts I suggest a simple formula by which most of us here on Pundit might agree and that is:THE ENEMY OF MY ENEMY IS MY FRIEND AND OR THE ENEMY OF MY FRIEND IS MY ENEMY AS WELL!!!! This puts us on the side of Serbia, Not because I agree with Serbia or think they are the aggrieved party but because I view Muslim Stat in Kosovo as another Mortal enemy of the Jews!!!
Yamit
Re your post above, I think no 41
The issue at stake is that judaism could not defend the Jews against the Nazis, and secondly on my contention that Fascism is a mosern phenomenon which is intimately connected with the death agony of the capitalist system
So you write;
You have indeed helped to make my point.Obviously I have both great respect and greatly support bot Jews and their religion of Judaism, and the two go closely together.
But I look at the question objectively because it was an objective phenomenon in every respect.
The jews and their religion were unable to meet and to destroy the Nazis
That is actually connected with your own confusion on what Fascism is. I insist that Fascism is a modern phenomenon, which grows directly out of capitalism in mortal crisis.
Not only jews could not deal with this, but also reformist social democracy and stalinism. They were proved to be politically bankrupt and led the great defeats at the hands of Fascism.
judaism is a religion and a philosophy of living with many fine qualities, very ancient, but it is not revolutionaruy socialism. Only ther policies of Leon Trotsky if followed could have led to the defeat of Fascism.
That is why Ray who lumps Trotskyism, Stalinism, Social Democracy etc all together and labels the lot as “Leftism” is so pernicious. it prevents any understanding of history.
All this is relevant to an understanding of the pictures above.
Unless we can have agreement on Fascism as a modern phenomenon growing out of the imperialist capitalist system we cannot argue.
Ted,
On the issue of the Serbs and the Muslims, you have become as fanatical as Enigmax and others who will not countenance any statement, even one of a fact that does not accord 100% with their pro-Serb view, the way their views are expressed, that is perceived as something less then 100% support for their views or which questions whether diaspora Jews and Israel do owe a special and higher duty to the Serbs stemming from both being victims of the Nazis then do anyone else and if so why?
I stand by my comments, I stand by what I said of Enigmax’s debating me on points I did not make and I can only conclude from your comments that you have become as much the irrational zealot as Enigmax on this topic.
Bokababe Shalom, I think if ther is one nation who is so dumb in self promotion worse than Israel it is you Serbs. We Israel and Serbia are our own worst enemies. That being said do not look to anyone to help you or support you and till the Serb Nation are willing to forgo for the foreseeable future entry into EU and mainstream Europe where you have never been and that has been your saving Grace. The farther you sit from the centers of Religion and civil power the longer you can hold onto and keep some degree of National identity and national honor. While no where on the continent of Europe was the Jew ever treated well but under Serbia It must be said we fared better than in most countries. That being said we didn’t do so well under the Serbs either all things being relevant. One might characterize Jewish History in Serbia as mostly of a discriminatory nature and not mass murder. That being said there were never a whole lot of Jews in the Balkans and in Serbia in particular. Jews have fared better in Muslim Countries before Zionism than in Christian Europe.
Ream Item#40. I agree with you and I did take a pro Serbian position even if I qualified it it was pro Serb.
I hope the Serbs get another chance to kick ass a gain and that next time the Serbs will have a more positive outcome ! g
There is an immutable biblical principle of what you sow, you reap and that multiplied. Those in countries desiring the division of the land in other countries are subject to G-d’s judgment to divide their own land. Unfortunately most of the world has no fear of G-d. He does however hold people and nations responsible for their decisions, even if those decisions are made by evil leaders.
Ted,
That letter was a masterful stroke of propaganda — artificially putting Serbs on “the Palestinian side”.
But all the facts say just the opposite and there are more concrete similarities between the Albanians and Palestinians, than with anything Serb-related — both the Palestinians and Kosovo Albanians are Muslim, the supposed ethnic identities of “Palestinian”, “Kosovar” and “Bosniak” are artificial political creations designed to fool the public, Palestinians and Kosovars are interlopers who are trying to violate the sovereignty of recognized countries by claiming land that is not their own, both were WWII allies of the Nazis to kill Serbs and Jews. The Kosovo Albanians ARE Serbia’s Palestinians, and sooner or later, this will become all too apparent to Israel.
As for Yamit, every time we get on this subject I allow myself to get dragged into defending Serbia during WWII due to you omitting inconvenient facts.
The Serb Regent of Yugoslavia had an open offer from Germany to allow Yugoslavia as a pass-through to Greece — all Serbia had to do was hand over their Jews and and allow the Nazis to pass. The Regent Paul, backed into a corner, signed it and the Serbian people rose up against the agreement at great cost to themselves. Belgrade was bombed by the German Luftwaffe for weeks in Operation Punishment The Serbs resisted as hard as they could, but eventually a handful of fascists Serbs who had never been elected to anything were used by the Germans. That WWII resistance is why Serbs are where they are today — the grandson of one of those Luftwaffe pilots was one of those who helped design the the NATO plan for the 1999 NATO Bombing of Yugoslavia. If in all this research, you haven’t figured out that in the break-up of Yugoslavia, all of those ethnic groups — the Slovenes, the Croats, the Bosnian Muslims (the WWII Mufti of Jerusalem’s favorites), the Albanians — who once supported Nazi Germany came out on top, and the one ethnic group who resisted Nazi Germany — the Serbs– are the one people getting screwed. Which is why, Leon Kojen (yes, he is Jewish) was the Serbian negotiator for Kosovo until last year.
Open your eyes — dislike Serbs if you like because they aren’t perfect and they don’t have to be your “best friends”– but the same groups who allied with Nazi Germany during WWII are back and that is the reason that anti-Semitism is up all over Europe. Know who your enemies are, before you decide who your friends are. There are no “gray areas” in war — and make no mistake, we are at war for our lives and our souls.
BB
BlandOatmeal: Your comment ascribes a power and influence to the Jewish people/Israel that they don’t have. The opinions, knowledge and interest in what happens in the Balkans varies from person to person and Israel, as a democratic country, does not impose thought control on its population as is done in some Muslim countries.
I am sure that if you go back to the newspapers of the day that you would find a broad cross section of opinions on the ethnic cleansing that was carried out by Muslims in Kosovo (as a result of intolerance and an inability to live in peace with other religions, people and cultures) and the many atrocities that were part of the war at the time.
I am not sure what you are suggesting by holding all “Jews” responsible for the outcome (the self-declaration of independence by Muslims in Kosovo) and for not collectively speaking out, but it looks a lot like the accusations that some make about the exaggerated wealth and power of the Jewish people that always precedes some kind of collective punishment based on this stereotype (as if any one people can agree on anything en masse).
Kosovo independence is a dangerous precedent and now people (such as myself) are waking up. It will impact how other groups such as the French in Quebec conduct their own plans to declare statehood. It also affects the Palestinian situation and many other people and places that are on the brink of separation. It has enormous implications. I now understand the people on this forum who have been protesting in very loud and clear language about the history of this situation and the importance of a balanced understanding of the past and present events in that part of the world.
Shalom oat: glad to know where your loyalties are: and that you are Slovenian come to me as no big surprise, but I do think you have a large degree of Chutzpa(audacity)in your ascertains that the Jews were rooting for nobody but themselves. first of all in light of our History in Europe ( worlds largest Jewish Graveyard) Why should we? Civil wars have always in any event clouded rights and wrongs as ea. side will claim God and rigtt is on their side and History adds little in helping an outsider to determine who to support. Since you say you are Slovenian I would say you least of all have any moral or Historical right in criticizing any Jew!!
History of the Jews in Slovenia
The small Jewish community of Slovenia (Slovenian: Judovska skupnost Slovenije) is estimated at 400 to 600 members[citation needed], with most living in the capital, Ljubljana. The Jewish community was devastated by the Shoah, and has never fully recovered. Until 2003, Ljubljana was the only European capital city without a Jewish place of worship.
History of the community
Ancient communit
The Jewish community of Slovenia pre-dates the 6th century Slavic migration to the Slovenian Lands. The first Jews arrived in Slovenia in Roman times, with archaeological evidence of Jews found in Maribor and Škocjan. In Škocjan, an engraved menorah dating from the 5th century AD was found in a graveyard.
In the 12th century, Jews arrived in the Slovenian Lands fleeing poverty in Italy and central Europe. Even though they were forced to live in ghettos, many Jews prospered. Relations between Jews and Slovenes were generally peaceful. In Maribor, Jews were successful bankers, winegrowers and millers. Several “Jewish Courts” (judovsko sodiš?e) existed in Styria, though not in Carniola or Carinthia, settling disputes between Jews and Christians. Israel Isserlein, who authored several essays on medieval Jewish life in Slovenia, was the most important rabbi at the time, having lived in Maribor. In 1397, Jewish ghettos in Radgona and Ptuj were set ablaze by a secret society called Ungenannte Judenhauer.(The name, translated from German, means “Anonymous Jew-beaters”)
The first synagogue in Ljubljana is mentioned in 1213. Issued with a Privilegium, Jews were able to settle an area of Ljubljana located on the left bank of the Ljubljanica River. The streets Židovska ulica and Židovska steza, which now occupy the area, are still reminiscent of that period. The wealth of the Jews bred resentment among the rulers and nobility of the Slovenian Lands, with many refusing to repay Jewish money-lenders. Individual regions began expelling their Jews already in the 16th century, with the last Jews expelled by 1718.
The modern era
In 1709 Charles VI, Emperor of the Holy Roman Empire (and ruler of the Slovenian Lands), issued a decree allowing Jews to return to the Slovenian Lands. Nevertheless, Jews in that time settled almost exlusively in the commercial city of Trieste and, to a much smaller extent, in the town of Gorica, which are now both part of Italy. The decree was overturned in 1817 by Francis I, and Jews were granted full civil and political right only with the Austro-Hungarian constitution of 1867. Nevertheless, the Slovenian Lands remained virtually without a consistent Jewsih population, with the exception of Gorizia, Trieste, the region of Prekmurje and some smaller towns in the western part of the County of Gorizia and Gradisca (Gradisca, Cervignano), which were inhabited mostly by a Friulian-speaking population. According to the census of 1910, only 146 Jews lived in the territory of modern Slovenia, excluding the Prekmurje region.
Rampant anti-Semitism was among the causes why few Jews decided to settle in the area, mantaining the overall Jewish population at a very low level. In the 1920s, After the formation of the Kingdom of Serbs, Croats and Slovenes (Yugoslavia), the local Jewish community merged with the Jewish community of Zagreb, Croatia.
According to the 1931 census, there were about 900 Jews in the Drava Banovina, mostly concentrated in Prekmurje, which used to be part of the Kingdom of Hungary until 1919. This was the reason why in the mid 1930s Murska Sobota became the seat of the Jewish Community of Slovenia. During that period, the Jewish population was reinvigorated by many immigrants fleeing from neighouring Austria and Nazi Germany to a more tollerant Kingdom of Yugoslavia. Nevertheless, the anti-Jewish legislation, adopted by Milan Stojadinovi?’s pro-German regime and the anti-semitic discourse of Anton Korošec’s Slovenian People’s Party, made Slovenia a less desirable destination.
The number of Jews prior to the Axis invasion of Yugoslavia in April 1941 is estimated to around 2,500.
The Holocaust
The Jewish community, very small even before World War II and the Shoah, was further reduced by the Nazis occupation between 1941 and 1945.
Post-war community
Under Communism in Yugoslavia, the Jewish community in Socialist Slovenia numbered fewer than 100 members. In 1953, the synagogue of Murska Sobota, the only remaining after the Shoah, was demolished by the local Communist authorities. Many Jews were expelled from Yugoslavia as “Germans” and most of Jewish property was confiscated. The Judovska Ob?ina v Ljubljani (Jewish Community of Ljubljana) was officially reformed following World War II; its first president was Artur Kon, followed by Mladen Aleksander Švarc in 1957. In 1969, it numbered only 84 members and its membership was declining due to emigration and age. Berta Bojetu, Miriam Steiner (Vojak z zlatimi gumbi) and Zlate Medic-Voka? (Marpurgi) were Jewish authors who wrote in Slovene.
Today
The Jewish community today is estimated at 400-600 members, although there are only 130 members of the Jewish Community of Slovenia. The community is mixed Ashkenazi and Sephardi descent. In 1999, the first ever Chief Rabbi for Slovenia was appointed after 1941. The present chief rabbi for Slovenia, Ariel Haddad, resides in Trieste and is a member of the Lubavitcher Hassidic school. The current president
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Ah, yes! The Balkan Wars. I remember them well! I remember how the Greeks, Bulgarians, Romanians and everyone else except the Russians betrayed the Serbians, and let the Germans and their allies return to the Balkans as victors. I also remember looking at the Jerusalem Post every day, hoping to see the tiniest shred of even interest in (much less sympathy for) what was going on there.
I’m a Slovenian, but I was rooting for the Serbs. The Jews were rooting for nobody but themselves. Now it’s their turn to have the world community gang up on them. Why should I care about them? Their supposed “concern” about the Serbs now is too little, too late.
Choices, choices. Lessee…
Serbs = Christians for 2,000 years who believe in LIFE and the G-d given right to defend LIFE.
Kosovars = Muslims belong to an INSANE DEATH CULT known by its lies, violence, mayhem, murder of innocents and desire for world domination.
Big choice, Ted. The one who sent you the email is a deceived fool or a Muslim. Probably the latter, although there are many deceived fools around.
Wikipedia is known to be a liberal haunt. Don’t believe everything you read there.
I received this email
Hi Ted,
I am really surprised to see you embrace without hesitation (or so it seems) the Serb
narrative regarding Kosovo. I would suggest you do more in-depth research and not limit
yourself to Serb propaganda. The Serbs behaved in the most abominable fashion in the 90s,
veritable reincarnations of the Nazis, killing more than 200,000 innocent civilians in
Bosnia and Croatia before turning their wrath on Kosovo. Regarding the Sebrenica
massacre, they committed the worst mass massacre in Europe since WWII (see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre as just one source that tells it like it
happened). Now they try to turn the tables and blame the Kosovars for killing Serbs and
denying that Srebrenica ever happened. Sound familiar?
But here is the trick: they were bombed out by NATO to force them to stop the massacres
and have since been forced by the international community to surrender one war criminal
after another to the international tribunal in The Hague. That’s not by chance, nor is it
for imaginary crimes. Nevertheless, they figured out that what worked so well for the
Palestinians couldn’t fail to work as well for the Serbs: lie, lie, and lie again, and
people will eventually start believing your version of history. There were no large-scale
massacres of Serbs by Kosovars or Bosniaks. There definitely was killing on both sides,
but respective tallies don’t even begin to compare. The gruesome photos are pictures of
victims of the Serb killing squads that they pass as victims of non-Serbs (with the only
exception of the pictures showing Arab “volunteers”). Better yet, they’ve figured out
that by conning the Jews and their friends by playing the victims of the international
Muslim conspiracy (which we know does exist), they are sure to raise sympathy among
Israel’s friends. It is clever because it is oh so tempting to blame the radicalisation
of Kosovo of the world-wide Muslim plan to conquer the world. The thing is, the
radicalisation of the Kosovars (and of the Bosniaks before them) was entirely due to the
brutality and excesses of the Serbs. Before the Balkan wars, the Bosniaks were notorious
for being the mildest Muslims there were in Europe. The attempted genocides and ethnic
cleansings perpetrated by the Serbs radicalised many Bosniaks and Kosovars into a
militant Islam they had little sympathy and interest for before.
Sympathising with the Serbs is making a pact with the devil. Not only are they lying by
claiming that they are the victims, but they are lying again when they try to manipulate
Jews and Israelis into siding with them. I have no sympathy for the radical Kosovar and
Bosniak muslims, but the mere thought of sympathising with the very people who committed
the worst atrocities ever committed in Europe since WWII makes me positively sick. Don’t
let them feed you lies and manipulate you into believing their narrative. It is as false,
fictional and misleading a shameful rewriting of history as is the Palestinians’
successful (so far) attempt at rewriting their version of their history.
I would encourage you to delve into this subject more deeply. Diversify your sources.
Regarding the Israel-Arab countries conflict, would you rely on Palestinian sources to
find objective data and opinions? You know the answer to that one. Serb sources are as
unreliable as the Palestinian ones.
go here. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srebrenica_massacre
Other than that, keep up the great work.
Read this article by Tamar Yonah about the cover-up of Rav Kahane’s assassination (excerpt below). It contains 3 YouTube videos and this special link to a Israel Channel Two video you must see. Got to the Click Here below:
“… Let us look at one other subject here that questions the intentions of the American – Arab/Moslem relationship towards Jews, and its foreign political agendas. Below is a very interesting documentary about the murder of Rabbi Meir Kahane z”l and the Twin Towers connection. It seems that the murderer of Rabbi Kahane was part of a Arab-Moslem terror cell newly based in America. Yet U.S. security agencies interfered with New York police from doing their job. They denied that there was any conspiracy and that the gunman was a lone gunman. They forced the police to release one of the suspects from Rav Kahane’s murder, who just happened to be one of the terrorists who was planning the bombing of the World Trade Center, that took place just a few years later. How can this be? Watch this documentary made by Israel’s channel 2. It is both in Hebrew and English. Even if you don’t understand the Hebrew, keep watching, it will switch into English soon and you should be able to follow exactly what is happening. This case is a very worrying one, and you in America, should be concerned about this cover-up. … Please click HERE to view. …”
It was George’s father, Prescott, who was arrested by the FBI for Trading With the Enemy (Hitler). Rabbi Meir Kahane was assassinated on November 5, 1990. That was on George H.W. Bush’s watch.
The outrage in Kosovo started under Bush, was executed under Clinton and continues under Gog 2. Because one of the goals of globalists is Population Control and they have stated they want to kill 11 out of 12 people on the planet, the photos we see of the butchered Christian in Serbia is exactly what they plan for the rest of the world, including for the U.S. where so many Americans actually believe that writing a letter to the White House or to their Congressman makes one whit of difference. The Nazis are in control of the political structure on the earth, but G-d allows it. Why?
How G-d can use this for his purposes is that He holds people responsible for the shedding of innocent blood, i.e. a life for a life. See Deut. 19 for a start. America has murdered 100,000 million babies in the womb, more than the number murdered in the Holocaust, and exported abortion around the world in exchange for aid, but it is little Israel which has the highest death rate to abortion per capita of any country in the world.
Da 4:17 This matter is by the decree of the watchers, and the demand by the word of the holy ones: to the intent that the living may know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will, and setteth up over it the basest of men.
G-d raises up the basest of men, not the best, and those evil men want Population Control. G-d just calls it Judgment. The judgments of G-d are in the earth NOW.
Ps 105:7 He is the LORD our God: his judgments are in all the earth.
Jonathan – good idea to write a letter and I did just that…
Dear Prime Minister Stephen Harper (pm@pm.gc.ca)and Minister Peter MacKay (MacKay.P@parl.gc.ca):
I would urge Canada not to recognize Kosovo as an independent country. There
are too many failed Islamic states that are now off-limits to non-Muslims
and which have become havens for international terrorism.
Kosovo is now being targeted by wahabi propaganda and cash from Saudi Arabia
and it looks like Kosovo will continue to go down the path to radicalism and
terrorism if allowed their independence.
Also, Kosovo has been implicated in a lot of slaughter and carnage in the
past even though the international media has tended to concentrate
exclusively on Christian Serb atrocities. There seems to be a lot of bias
against Serbia and a lot of reporters and powerful individuals who tend to
put on blinders when it comes to Islamic terrorism in Kosovo.
Just because a region has a certain number of Muslims does not mean that
they necessarily need or deserve a country of their own. Muslims can and
should learn to live with all religious and cultural groups without
demanding their own countries.
The US is playing a game with Russia that has them supporting an Islamic
state in Kosovo because the Russians are meddling in Iran and other places and supplying Iran
with nuclear expertise. Two wrongs do not make a right and these matters are
too important to play high level political games between Russia and the
USA/EU.
An Islamic state will likely create more divisions, problems and more
parochial and narrow-minded thinking. Terrorism is always a factor in
Islamic states and we do not need that in Kosovo at this time.
Thanks
Felix Quigley#27 Felix who would you trust a leader wo fears man or a leader who only fears God? Now even an atheist like you can decipher the difference?That the Jewish people were ethnic minorities and very impoverished ones at that had no power to to alter the political sledge hammers aimed at them by the Nazis and other antisemites in Europe. Fascism Is not so New |Note the Jewish Holiday of Purim which begins on the 20th of Feb. Pls read and you will see what I mean I hope:
JEWISH DEFENSE LEAGUE OF SHUSHAN HABIRA
I. Who Is A Jew In Shushan?
The classic age of Jewish Exile began with the story of the Book of Esther, which perhaps for that reason is the most controversial book of the Bible. N either G-d or the land of Israel are mentioned in that Book. And although the story of Joseph in Egypt already adumbrates the laws that govern the life of the Jews in the diaspora, it still deals only with the fate of one individual, while the story of what happened in Shushan relates to the collective fate of diaspora Jews. It is certainly no accident that the hero of the Book of Esther, MORDECHAI THE JEW (note this qualification – the first time it occurs in our literature) was from the tribe of Benjamin, that is a remote descendant of Joseph. Another characteristic they, Joseph and Mordechai, have in common is that both are referred to as TZADIKIM, as righteous men, to stress, as it were that although both served foreign kings they nevertheless remained righteous… And if they were so righteous, why did they stay in the diaspora rather than come to the land of Israel? Clearly in order to save the Jews of the diaspora in their hour of need.
Ostensibly we have here the beginnings of Jewish assimilation. Note that the names of the two main protagonists – Mordechai, after the Babylonian god Mardukh and Esther after the Babylonian Istar, who is the Canaanite Ashtoret. Their parents still bare Jewish names: Mordechai was the son of Yair, Esther the daughter of Avihayil. But names are not a safe indication. Early Jewish tradition clearly tells us who is considered more of a Jew, Manasseh, a king of the House of David, who worshipped foreign gods, or Mordechai who bore a heathen name but remained faithful to the one G-d? Nevertheless, both sociology and history tend to show that assimilation begins either with a change of name, or of dress. There is nothing in the Book of Esther to tell is what clothes Mordechai wore, and although Itzik Manger in his “Megille Lieder” visualized him as wearing a Streimel and a Kaften, and so do Lilien and Chagall in their paintings, these are but the visions of artists who deliberately look upon the heroes of the past with the eyes of the common people, attributing to them as great as possible an external resemblance. This is perfectly legitimate. The artist’s truth is not the truth of the archeologist. It is the truth of life.
About Esther we are told explicitly and at length what she wore and how she made herself up. But in this she only did her duty as the future reigning queen. Nor does the Torah forbid this practice. There is, however, nothing in the Book of Esther to tell us what she ate at the court Ahasuerus. It can hardly be assumed that he kept a kosher kitchen. Since she said nothing about her Jewish extraction, she could also hardly have asked to have special food prepared for her. Possibly she pretended to be on a diet as an excuse not to eat unclean food – and being a righteous woman the chances are that this was what she did – incidently improving her figure and enhancing her beauty, which was one of her main strategic weapons.
Nevertheless, there still remains the fact of her marriage to a gentile. Could this not be regarded as a legitimation of mixed marriage? Of course the text has it that she was “taken” or abducted, but what about “Kiddush HaShem”, that is, preferring martyrdom to abjuring the name of the L-rd? Yet in her case Divine providence intervened to save the entire diaspora through her, and this was her martyrdom, for she did not marry Ahasuerus out of love. What fun could she have had, living with this drunken brawler who on top of everything, according to Jewish tradition, was also a fool?
We can only hope that there will be few Jewish girls in the diaspora who go and marry Gentiles, on the excuse that they might thus have a chance of saving their brethren, and if they do, let them at least marry some ruler or king to make it worthwhile. Who knows whether a beautiful Esther might not help change PUTIN’S policy, even today? Hardly. For not every king is as stupid as Ahasuerus was, and miracles of that kind do not happen nowadays, And above all, what guarantee have we got that a contemporary Jewish beauty will behave as Esther did?
This, in fact, is the first lesson we may learn from our two protagonists: Their assimilation was only in external things. Inside, in their heart and in their being, they remained loyal Jews. Mordechai refused to bow down to Haman, even when Haman became the all-powerful prime minister, and Esther risked her life and her position to save her people. This may be the reason why Purim has become the day of eternal appearances. This is to teach is that loyalty to the Jewish people is tested in the hour of danger and need, at those times when the weak in spirit, the cowards and the traitors try to run away…often even join the other camp, the camp of the Hamans. For can you imagine a Mordechai and an Esther who would be willing to attend an anti-Zionist press conference and make anti-Israeli declarations there, as is happening now in America and Israel, Shushan. where haman is still high on his horse?
II. Who Is Haman?
Before we come to Haman and his doctrine there still is one point to clear up concerning Mordechai. Mordechai saves the life and the throne of Ahasuerus. He discovers a plot against the king, and since the story is told in romantic-poetic and not in political-historical terms, we are not told whether this is an imperialist, fascist, or Trotskyist-Maoist plot. Or perhaps it was a plot instigated by Haman himself? And now we come to the central theme which is the first presentation of anti-Semitic theory and practice. Thousands of anti-Semitic books have been written since them in every country and every language, which are all nothing but a repetition and amplification of the same basic theme stated by Haman: “There is a certain people scattered and dispersed among the peoples in all the provinces of your kingdom; their laws are different from those of every other people, and they do not keep the king’s laws, so that is not to the king’s advantage to tolerate them.” (Esther 3:8)
No clearer, more succinct definition of anti-Semitism has been formulated since. All the three elements are there: Desire for domination, particularism, disloyalty. But Haman was not only the first anti-Semite theoretician, he was also a man of action who submitted to his king, and to all the kings and rulers throughout the ages, the model plan for the FINAL SOLUTION — this time not in Berlin and not at the Kremlin, but at Shushan: “To destroy, to slay, and to annihilate all Jews, young and old, women and children, and plunder their goods” ( Esther 3:13).
III. One Cannot Rely On A Miracle
There are some hints in the Talmud that not all Jewish Leaders at that time — the period of the Second Temple when most of the leadership was spiritual rather than political-secular — were happy with the story of Shushan and the behavior of Mordechai and Esther. It is said that when Esther wanted “to be written down for the generations to come,” that is, to have her codified part of the Bible, when at first met with a blank refusal, Nevertheless, she finally managed to convince them. (Perhaps she threatened to cut off United Jewish Appeal funds which no doubt were being raised in Shushan at that time, the rich diaspora, for the residents of Jerusalem, who were economically much worse off). Still, according to the halacha the sanctity of the Book of Esther is not the same as that of all the other Scriptures. Purim, however, soon became a popular folk festival, and once the people accepted it, “the heaven followed suit”, despite the ideological qualms. A wise act indeed, for it is a good thing that the Jews, doomed to so many centuries of exile, should have one holiday that is sheer fun and delight when it is almost a virtue to get drunk; all the more so as it tends to inspire the optimistic Jewish soul with the belief that all the enemies of the Jewish People are bound to end up in the same way as Haman, though not so speedily and miraculously. Hitler’s end was in fact delayed, but with Stalin we almost experiences a similar miracle. After the famous doctors’ trial he had intended to exile all the Russian Jews to Siberia — dispatching them to their certain death, but it was his death that intervened.
By the way, it was on Purim that he died. Be that as it may — the sages of the Talmud expressly provided that one cannot and should not rely on a miracle.
IV. One Can Only Rely On One’s Own Hands . . . And Feet
If not miracles, what is there to rely upon? For Mordechai, the Jew of ancient Shushan, it was not enough to have the anti-Jewish decree revoked. He also realized that it was necessary to pray and fast — and pray and fast he did. He saw that it was necessary to plead with the king, and so he sent a certain lady to plead with him. Ultimately, he also asked the king’s permission to destroy and kill all of Haman’s followers, and if the Book of Esther says that he killed seventy-five thousand men that day it means that Haman has a whole party behind him a kind of Persian SS or El Fatah, through which he had intended to implement his final solution. On them Mordechai took his revenge.
This is a good thing to keep in mind. For, of course, there were people in the ghettoes and in the forests who fought back and took their vengeance. But they came too late. Most of the Jews of Europe were exterminated. This is a good thing to remember — lest once again we be too late. What Mordechai did in Shushan was to set up a Jewish Defense — and Revenge — League. The Book of Esther, which was compiled in Persia, says that he did so with King Ahasuerus’ consent. But who can tell. Queen Esther certainly could not tell the whole truth, how Mordechai had set up this organization long before he got official permission for it, so that it was ready when he needed it. Certainly no democratic regime can suffer in it midst an illegal organization for armed defense. On the other hand — one cannot always rely on the “establishment” and on the police. Sometimes they come too late. Nor can one always rely on the democracy of a city like Shushan. Therefore, a people that has a leader like Mordechai, a leader who can follow the triple course of faith and prayer, of political action and active defense may call itself truly blessed.
As the feelings are running high on this matter, and as the U.S. but not Canada has recognized Kosovo, perhaps a letter to one of the following two fellows might be helpful
Peter Mackay , Stephen Harper ,
#21…… enigmax: You seem very passionate and I do appreciate your fervor and even your criticism of me whoever misplaced they may be but-
I can give you six hundred years of documented brutal History, part you can read below! In all due respect to George Soros and his gang, the conflict between Serba and muslims from Albania go way back before A nut like Soros was even born.
M
Not everything the fascist left says or believes is not necessarily incorrect! The Serb Albanian(Kosovo) conflict is Historical almost Tribal in scope and character and ea. cannot claim Humanism and Love thy neighbor as essential tenants of belief and behavior. That said historically the Serbs seem the have History on their side but in the real world historical rights are only valid if one can defend them successfully! That said you and they cannot use the excuse of the Serbs being powerless due to Having non Serb dictator Tito rule over them. Should we then blame the Eskimos in their stead and give the Serbs a free pass (historically)? In any event I sided with the Serbs in the conflict A- because I know Serbs and tend to like them, B- they have Historical right on their side(for what its worth) C- I hate Nuslims of any stripe especially the (European species). I do not like the American and European interference using Mil. force to solve ethic and religious generational conflicts as they always choose the wrong sides and in the end complicate an already complicated geopolitical situation.
I would say first prove the allegation!!! I have only asked 1 time that someone be removed and that was because he was antisemitic and a fascist Nazi in Leftist sheep’s clothing. That was my opinion and I think mine alone.
This is not a good vs, bad or right vs, wrong black and white situation and I am not all that judgmental as you seem to be but before I dare comment on such a complicated mess as the Balkans I at least arm myself first with knowledge. I study at least the basics before engaging my big mouth as you seem to be doing here.
Kosovo has been a part of the national consciousness of the Serbian people for six centuries. The basic ethical values bequeathed to the Serbian on Vidovdan in 1389 are impressed in the innermost being of every Serb. Every nation has one date in its history that it considers most important; for the Serbs, that date is 15 June by the old calendar or 28 June by the new or Vidovdan calendar. On that day in 1389, Serbian and Turkish armies clashed on the Kosovo.Field.
To the Serbs, Kosovo is their Holy Land, the cradle of Serbdom, which contains their inalienable historical, national, and cultural heritage. Vidovdan, 15 June 1389, is not just the date of a battle but the day the national identity was born; the will and testament containing religious, ethical, and national principles that guided all Serb generations since. In the national conscious, that historic day divides Serbian history On the Kosovo Field on Vidovdan, the Serbs chose by unwritten pledge their religious, cultural, ethical, and national identity and they live by that pledge today
I did not side with the Muslims of Albanian extraction against the Serbs the reverse is true but I still say it not our concern it is a generational ethnic and religious conflict that goes back 600 years, It might have negative implications for Israel but nowhere as negative as the Iranians with a nuke or two.and in any event there isn’t much we can or should do. I said in the past we have enough on our plate without getting into someone else’s problems. That the Serbs never supported us in any real and tangible way also also supports my position I believe. NATO will not stay forever there as peace keepers and the Serbs will have eventually another chance to redeem themselves by going in to Kosovo and reclaiming it back for Serbia and the bloodbath that we also ensue will back up my positions but by then who will remember?
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Much of the Albanian history of revolts and rebellions is attributable to the internalization of the kanun. Bloodshed is the only remedy to dishonor; a person must arm himself at all times to be ready to protect his honor. The implications for KFOR are obvious. One of the peacekeepers’ primary tasks is confiscation of weapons, but the Albanians believe they cannot give them up. Family retribution retains honor no matter who is in control.
Ted,
I was not going to bother replying to Enigmax’s disingenuous response to my brief comments as I figured most would see that response for what it really was. Your applause of Engimax’s response as being masterful, has led me to the following response.
The only mastery I saw in Enigmax’s arguments against my points was in sophistry based on his disingenous tactic of trying to set me up as the straw man to knock down by suggesting what I was meaning or implying by the statements I made.
Example 1: quoting my statement, “the significance of this “truth” will not change the course of history that is galloping forward, but will be left for historians to discuss and consider.”, Enigmax states:
I implied nothing and offered no defeatist opinion.
I merely made the observation of a fact that the Muslims of Kosovo were about to declare their independent state, with the likely support of the EU and America. That declaration of independence came yesterday. If international recognition of the independent state of Kosovo follows as it appears it will, all the scholars and advocates that have tried so mightily to get their “truth” out and their alleged “big lie” about the Serbs being the evil villains and the Muslims, the innocents will not have been enough to stop the “big lie” bringing about the independent state of Kosovo.
That is a statement of fact. It is not an argument against the efforts of Nathan Pearlstein, Robert Peter North, Julia Gorin, Jared Israel, and Francisco Gil-White to force Western leaders to admit the “truth” they would have them believe and act accordingly.
It is also not an opinion that these people and people such as Enigmax, stop advocating their “truth”. I simply noted that it is a fact Enigmax and the pro-Serb advocates will have to accept and live with, but that does not mean for a minute they should stop advocating what they believe in.
Given circumstances as they are unfolding, it appears I am right that they will have to make their case after the fact that Kosovo has become another independent Muslim state.
Example 2: Enigmax’s statement:
Enigmax asked a perfectly reasonable question as to why I put the word “truth” in quotation marks. Without giving me a chance to answer, he tells you all that I must be implying that I do not believe it to be the truth.
The word truth when it comes to people advocating contrary views is usually not an absolute, except in the minds of those who advocate their truth against the views advocated by others as their truths.
So long as there are those who maintain the Serbs truly were the villains and offer up what facts they deem relevant, the word “truth” becomes a self aggrandizing characterization of what one is advocating on either side of the issue. That is why I put the word “truth” in quotation marks.
Enigmax completely ignores the first part of my closing paragraph where I state:
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This hardly means I believe what Nathan Pearlstein, Robert Peter North, Julia Gorin, Jared Israel, and Francisco Gil-White are telling falsehoods.
It is Engimax’s dishonest debating tactics that speak volumes about him.
Example 3:
What has this to do with my comment which narrowly focussed on what was occurring and not on what led up to it or issues of morality?
Again, you argue against me, not by dealing with what I did say, but rather to advocate your self characterized moral “truth” as if it is superior to my views, which you know full well, I did not express on those matters.
Example 4:
Here again, while I have expressed my negative views before about the Olmert government, I simply made a statement that I did not see Israel standing against Kosovo declaring itself an independent state and its being recognized as such which certainly accords with what is. I did not address why that is so.
The implication of my words that Enigmax suggests does not follow from my words.
Example 5 Enigmax says:
Here again, Engimax makes a speech and then disingenuously and sarcastically suggests he says it to contradict what I have said.
I gather Ted you didn’t notice that Enigmax is pontificating against nothing I said.
Example 6: Again Enigmax goes to his well of disingenuity and pulls up another bucketfull of dishonesty to wash over what I did say:
Here again, I did not address the issue at all that he says I am unable or unwilling to accept. Enigmax has made his case, but that is his case and not one that he can honestly make against anything I said in my brief comment.
My disdain for Enigmax is not with the views he holds, but rather for how he dishonestly sets me up as his straw man to knock me down by pontificating his views. Enigmax’s dishonest debating tactics are just that. Dishonest.
Ted, we both have frequently noted that you and I have little to disagree on.
We do now when you applaud Enigmax’s response to my brief comments that are riddled with his self aggrandizing sophistry, venality and disingenuity in advocating his views and making his arguments as if they are to challenge points he claims I made, but which clearly I did not.
To Gary
You mean you really don’t want parts of Mississauga and soon Newmarket to become separate Muslim communities within Canada?
Follow the money…
US politicians ally themselves with Islamofascism for pure capitalist greed and power over target countries weakened by Islamist terrorists that the US government supported in the first place…
Here are US foreign policy officials admitting it yet again (for the umpteenth time)
If you are a casual reader or newcomer to this blog I would ask you to read the links Max has provided especially to the Julian Gorin blog on post 23
It contains
That shows that Julia alone in so many bloggers and much Media coverage really is aware of what this Kosovo issue is all about.
The Russians are both hurt and also at the same time very scared, because as Julia says above the US and EU have stepped outside of International law norms to effect this.
And in regard to Gary’s`point why, it is clear that these things are not done casually, and that much thought has gone into this.
Remember that the new “Kosovans” are clearly pawns, they have for example coordinated every one of their moves, build-up, flag, declaration, “spontaneous” demonstrations, with the EU and the US.
The question is for why?
And remember that Zbigniew Brzezinski was in Syria just last week.
We are getting close to an understanding but the editorial board of Israpundit has to internalise this and has to effect a practice if it is to give correct leadership to Jews.
The answer is that it of course it does not.
But guess who calls the shots in this world Gary?
The empire builders over at the foreign policy establishment (CFR) in Washington D.C., and in Brussels, Belgium (H.Q. of the fascist EU).
Let’s not forget that our “esteemed” members of Congress(the corrupt crooks in the House and Senate) pushed for military aid, financing and recognition of these Jihadist Islamofascists for years.
People like McCain, Lieberman, Lantos, Biden, Engel,Hoyer,Gilman and others have the blood of these innocents you see in these photographs on their hands.
These assholes in the US government think that they can pay off and bribe the Islamic world; purchase its “good will” on the altar of murdered Christians and Jews. Worse still, they even admit this!
I found this in the archives of Israpundit which sheds light on what these assholes in Congress have been doing in secret behind our backs for years.
http://politicalmavens.com/index.php/2007/04/22/lantos-jihadists-will-love-us
Gary: The Muslims want total world domination and the globalists are helping them because of oil and power. See their map. The Judeo-Christian countries did not hold up a standard of righteousness and do rightly, therefore G-d raises up the “spirit of the Medes” as one of His four sore judgments against apostate Christians and apostate Jews (individually and nations) who have fallen away from the truth.
Jer 51:11 Make bright the arrows; gather the shields: the LORD hath raised up the spirit of the kings of the Medes: for his device is against Babylon, to destroy it; because it is the vengeance of the LORD, the vengeance of his temple.
Eze 14:21 For thus saith the Lord GOD; How much more when I send my four sore judgments upon Jerusalem, the sword, and the famine, and the noisome beast, and the pestilence, to cut off from it man and beast?
The big question is this: Why does the world need another Muslim-occupied land? Do they not occupy enough of the world’s landmass? Why does the world cater to the needs of one religious group that behaves like a cult over all others to take over land by conquest?
If Muslims want to live in exclusively Muslim countries, then they have plenty of choices. The world community does not need to make them a special case whom somehow deserve to take over country after country by dint of the violent threats contained in their religion and due to our growing fear that by not appeasing them and granting them their every wish that they will focus their violence and terror on us.