Put the lawyers on the front line

JEWISH PRESS

PM Netanyahu told the Foreign Affair and Defense Committee in a meeting yesterday that the lawyers won’t allow Israel to shut off the water and electricity to Gaza.

He said this in response to a request by the committee chairman, Minister Ze’ev Elkin, for Israel to take a more harsh response against Gaza, including shutting off the water and electricity.

Netanyahu said he will bomb them a little harder.

We’re glad the lawyers permit that.

Still, one wonders, if we moved the lawyers to Sderot, would they come up with a different legal opinion?

July 11, 2014 | 61 Comments »

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50 Comments / 61 Comments

  1. SHmuel HaLevi 2 Said:

    @ dweller:
    You are totally correct.
    There is no obligation for the State of Israel to maintain that Islamic enclave and its murderers.
    The reason for the obscene setting is that Peresites, Sharon’s pals and other such piggy backed into, joined enterprises that supply that enclave and the rest
    of the PLO. There are huge profits for them on supplying the enemy. Like they say in town… “Sham kavur hakelev”.
    To cut that terribly wrong set up, the people will need to remove the interest groups out of the picture.
    Netanyahu will not do that.

    That’s essentially what I’ve been saying. When did this oligarchy arise? Was it always there? How about under the Labor governments in the ’60’s and ’70’s?

    If you don’t like it, change it. Maybe Israel should go back to being more socialist like it was (or supposedly was) back during the days when Labor was in control.

  2. SHmuel HaLevi 2 Said:

    @ dweller:
    The fabricated scenario is transparent.
    Certain circles in Israel who are profiting hugely, (mostly Peresite associates), promoted a so called “disengagement” which in practice was a Pogrom while the economic, monetary, services side remained intact. Gaza Hamasniks even use the Shekel as currency! Enough!
    That infirm situation cannot be tolerated. What is more galling is that the vermin does not even pay their debts closing on a billion dollars all included.
    I supported for several years the Engineering Labs of the Israel Electric Corporation and we ordered on behalf of the PLO certain electric power plant support equipment
    We also offered them excellent used electric power plants. The enemy elected to buy weapons rather than that and other facilities.
    We the taxpayers reject totally footing the bill for enemies.
    As a minimum we must demand payment of the debts, should them or their sugar daddies fail to pay up, cut services. And give Hamas/plo a grace period of two months to procure other sources before we disconnect them from the grid.
    Now. The Rottenberg IEC electric power plant, a major Israel Electric Corporation power generating plant is in Ashkelon, butting against Gaza border. ( Also the huge beer making faciliy is nearby :)). Should the beasts harm that station we must remove all vestiges of the enemy.

    They could harm the beer plant, which would be justification for their total annihilation.

    You live in Israel, you vote. Your country has the power to change the political leadership. I am not trying to justify the lawyers’ advice, I am trying to explain what I believe to be the legitimate concerns of the political leadership as far as the country’s diplomatic standing and compliance with international law (which is really a joke, but which must concern them). If you don’t like the way the leadership is doing things, get somebody else in power.

  3. @ dweller:
    You are totally correct.
    There is no obligation for the State of Israel to maintain that Islamic enclave and its murderers.
    The reason for the obscene setting is that Peresites, Sharon’s pals and other such piggy backed into, joined enterprises that supply that enclave and the rest
    of the PLO. There are huge profits for them on supplying the enemy. Like they say in town… “Sham kavur hakelev”.
    To cut that terribly wrong set up, the people will need to remove the interest groups out of the picture.
    Netanyahu will not do that.

  4. @ SHmuel HaLevi 2:

    “As a minimum we must demand payment of the debts, should them or their sugar daddies fail to pay up, cut services.”

    What I fail to understand is how Israel can contract to provide water, power or anything ELSE to Gaza District — even in the absence of a shooting war — as long as Gaza’s governed by an outfit which is sworn to Jewish destruction. Screw that! let ’em drink sea water & fuel their power needs with their own intestinal gas.

    If they’ll not accept Israeli sovereignty, then by law (so far as I can see), GOI owes them absolutely NOTHING.

  5. @ dweller:
    The fabricated scenario is transparent.
    Certain circles in Israel who are profiting hugely, (mostly Peresite associates), promoted a so called “disengagement” which in practice was a Pogrom while the economic, monetary, services side remained intact. Gaza Hamasniks even use the Shekel as currency! Enough!
    That infirm situation cannot be tolerated. What is more galling is that the vermin does not even pay their debts closing on a billion dollars all included.
    I supported for several years the Engineering Labs of the Israel Electric Corporation and we ordered on behalf of the PLO certain electric power plant support equipment
    We also offered them excellent used electric power plants. The enemy elected to buy weapons rather than that and other facilities.
    We the taxpayers reject totally footing the bill for enemies.
    As a minimum we must demand payment of the debts, should them or their sugar daddies fail to pay up, cut services. And give Hamas/plo a grace period of two months to procure other sources before we disconnect them from the grid.
    Now. The Rottenberg IEC electric power plant, a major Israel Electric Corporation power generating plant is in Ashkelon, butting against Gaza border. ( Also the huge beer making faciliy is nearby :)). Should the beasts harm that station we must remove all vestiges of the enemy.

  6. @ BethesdaDog:

    “Turning off the power and water could create a huge humanitarian crisis that would cast Israel in the worst possible light. Maybe it’s possible to do it selectively. It might still be down the line in Israel’s strategy. Better to accomplish Israel’s objectives without turning everyone against Israel. There ARE people who support Israel now; I’d hate to lose the last remaining support.”

    In other words, this is a PR issue — not a legal one — in which case, we can TALK about the PR side of it.

    But as the news brief [above] noted, BB had stated that the “lawyers won’t allow Israel to shut off the water and electricity to Gaza.”

    BB didn’t say the PR people wouldn’t allow it, but that the LAWYERS wouldn’t allow it.

    If the lawyers won’t allow it, then it must be a legal issue, and NOT a PR one.

    Well, which IS it???

    If in fact it’s a legal issue, then let the lawyers lay that out in black-&-white; let them show the outline & detail of the purported ‘legal’ problem — if indeed there is one. They should put up or shut up.

    — ENOUGH with this friggin shell game.

  7. @ BethesdaDog:
    I have no idea how many of you have actually soldiered in combat. I have. Several times and in two countries.
    I also maintain high level professional contact with colleagues in the military industries at engineering level. I was invited many years back to be a consultant to the IMOD and retired as a Senior-Fellow Engineer in the US Department of Defense Military avionics programs.
    Given a choice between more firepower or lawyers I would take both. And then first shoot the lawyers and turn all the remaining ammo against the enemy.
    I will not allow my sons, both already drafted and in combat level assignments to again serve in the depraved circus that the unJewish elements turned a fine military into. NO WAY I will allow them to go into combat assignments “armed” with rubber bullets and or paint ball rifles. Only mentally defective and arguably genetically defective individuals would support such suicidal lawyers made condition. Let the gaggles of lawyers face Islamic monsters from ISIS, el Q, Jihad, MB and other such, “armed” that way.
    Turulu.

  8. @ BethesdaDog:

    I watch a young Indian boy [ 12] in a remote part of Southern Alaska describe his encounter with a ” bigfoot” and one could tell by the fear in his face, he was not lying. As you said it’s interesting.

  9. Topaz Said:

    Do you suppose the other side has smarter lawyers?

    Netanyahu agreed to send an abject apology and compensation to Turkey. Perhaps it legal advice to ensure Israel was protected from world condemnation and reprisals, including those of their “friends” Dignity for your people, and the enemy made to pay, an end that assured the enemy could never arise to threaten again? The international community must be assuaged? So, is it a matter of the surgery was successful, but the patient died.

    2) What I advocated was the targeting of commercial enterprises, i.e. buildings, malls, factories, offices; infrastructure, markets. Life should not be able to go on as usual. The population needs to feel the effects of WAR, be angry with THEIR leadership who initiated. The principle had been, “They started it, we will finish it.”

    Your first comment borders on nonsense. I’m too tired at this point to try to make sense out of it. I doubt that this had anything to do with “lawyers.” It probably was a calculation that he made together with his advisers, because he was looking for a way to patch things up with Turkey, which at one time was an important strategic ally. (Of course, with your way of thinking, Israel has no strategic allies and what’s more, doesn’t need them). It did not work. Ergodan is a hopeless Muslim extremist. Still, Israel has some relations, economically and militarily. You would have Israel be totally isolated diplomatically it seems, but you don’t have the responsibility for running the country–so you are free to spout off here with any irresponsible and extreme contention that suits you. That’s fine. As long as you’re here talking about what Israel should do, you can treat it like a board game.

    As far as hitting the commercial targets–that’s up to Bibi, the cabinet, the military—and at some point, the lawyers. The lawyers can advise him on the question of what is or is not considered a “war crime” that can have consequences down the road. Personally, I think there’s a lot of merit to the idea that commercial sites should be targeted, especially if they are Hamas owned sites. I would not target a shopping center full of civilians–but I would hit it at night or after warnings. Office building? Perhaps, depends who is in it. Innocent civilians? No. Hamas officials, very likely.

    I still say, Israel has to be concerned about the external consequences of what it does. Bibi has a fine line, a balancing act. He needs to do as much damage as he can without being forced to a ceasefire. He might defy the UN as long as possible, but being sanctioned by the UN is obviously something Israel would like to avoid. It’s not something I’ve ever totally understood, but the people who run the government know better than I do about could happen if Israel is sanctioned by the UN for defying an order to ceasefire. The UN is an evil, corrupt institution, but I do understand the government’s desire to avoid total diplomatic isolation. It has some qualified and limited support from major powers right now. I can understand it doesn’t want that to change. If you live in Israel, and are not happy with the government’s actions, vote them out.

  10. honeybee Said:

    @ BethesdaDog:

    Saw the Professor Meldrome from ISU on ” Finding Bigfoot” Did not sound like a “nut job” to me. Just a very curious investigator of the odd.

    Just repeating what a friend who is on the faculty at ISU said to me. This was years ago, after I saw something on TV about that professor. Personally, I do like to watch stuff like that, since I like to see the unconventional and nonconformist, especially on such topics. It’s a diversion.

  11. the phoenix Said:

    @ BethesdaDog:

    I say we do have to be concerned about opinion outside Israel, very concerned, and very careful

    And why is that?

    if overwhelming power is applied indiscriminately to a large civilian population, it will hurt Israel in the end.

    In other words right now, Israel lives a golden age of glowing world opinion that should not be jeopardized…. Am I understanding you correctly?

    The kind of largescale attack on civilian populations that occurred in WWII will never be tolerated now. Things are different now.

    Ehm, has the news of the very recent “large scale attack on the civilian population ” of Syria reached Washington or THAT is just different… THAT could be tolerated it was only what, about 200,000 people?
    ‘And who did it?’… ‘Assad’
    Ah, ok then no big deal…..
    Right?

    You can thumb your nose at world opinion, Europe, etc., but it’s important not to antagonize the support Israel now has.

    Though repetitive, I shall reply in kind.
    WHAT SUPPORT MIGHT THAT BE?

    , If Israel is totally isolated, with boycotts economically, on travel, academic cooperation, and so on, it will be a disaster. There already seems to be some kind of unwritten boycott of Israeli travelers by the Obama administration–with Israelis having a harder time getting visas. It hasn’t received that much attention.

    So the bottom line would be let Jewish lives be in perpetual danger, this way some liberal peace now academician could travel to the u.s. and further expand on his kumbaya theories and maybe he might even get a picture taken with that baboon in the Oval Office…

    If I misunderstood your comment please set the record straight.

    Of course you did. You are putting words in my mouth. You have many non sequiters among your asserted conclusions to what I said. I’ll try to address them seriatim at another time. I have put in as much as I can at the computer at this point. I have cervical stenosis and begin to develop pain in my shoulders and down my arms after spending a length of time at the computer.

  12. Topaz Said:

    Do NOT allow ONE Israeli soldier to be sent into Harm’s Way. “SIGNALLING” a ground invasion!! Madness.

    INCONVENIENCE THE ENEMY. Nothing in or out. Night time massive Missile blitz on everything that is commercial; Office building, malls, factories. Destroy ALL property owned by terrorists.

    LEARN FROM THE ENEMY.

    Practice silence, as the old leaders did until the deed was done and then only a terse summary from military command. AND get a fabulous trained experienced P.R. person, to be the ONLY one to speak. Respond to each comment by fogging – “Talk to THEM”.

    Campaign from those who love the Jewish people, from Jews world wide, to send mega funds so that Israel can get out from under the US state department financial yoke.

    What are the chances? Sadness.

    Do you target a mall that is full of civilians?

  13. @ BethesdaDog:

    I say we do have to be concerned about opinion outside Israel, very concerned, and very careful

    And why is that?

    if overwhelming power is applied indiscriminately to a large civilian population, it will hurt Israel in the end.

    In other words right now, Israel lives a golden age of glowing world opinion that should not be jeopardized…. Am I understanding you correctly?

    The kind of largescale attack on civilian populations that occurred in WWII will never be tolerated now. Things are different now.

    Ehm, has the news of the very recent “large scale attack on the civilian population ” of Syria reached Washington or THAT is just different… THAT could be tolerated it was only what, about 200,000 people?
    ‘And who did it?’… ‘Assad’
    Ah, ok then no big deal…..
    Right?

    You can thumb your nose at world opinion, Europe, etc., but it’s important not to antagonize the support Israel now has.

    Though repetitive, I shall reply in kind.
    WHAT SUPPORT MIGHT THAT BE?

    , If Israel is totally isolated, with boycotts economically, on travel, academic cooperation, and so on, it will be a disaster. There already seems to be some kind of unwritten boycott of Israeli travelers by the Obama administration–with Israelis having a harder time getting visas. It hasn’t received that much attention.

    So the bottom line would be let Jewish lives be in perpetual danger, this way some liberal peace now academician could travel to the u.s. and further expand on his kumbaya theories and maybe he might even get a picture taken with that baboon in the Oval Office…

    If I misunderstood your comment please set the record straight.

  14. @ BethesdaDog:

    Saw the Professor Meldrome from ISU on ” Finding Bigfoot” Did not sound like a “nut job” to me. Just a very curious investigator of the odd.

  15. @ Ted Belman:

    I agree with your comment. As much as I emotionally would like to agree with many of the commenters urging swift, decisive action without limits, my head and experience tells me otherwise. I used to work for national Jewish organizations years ago. I know the hard work then of doing advocacy on behalf of Israel. I say we do have to be concerned about opinion outside Israel, very concerned, and very careful.

    I don’t know about Netanyahu–I’ve been told some things about different PMs by friends who are highly placed, not in politics, but another sphere. Those who live in Israel have some strong opinions and they probably know a lot more than I do. It’s frustrating to fight with one hand tied behind your back, but if overwhelming power is applied indiscriminately to a large civilian population, it will hurt Israel in the end. The kind of largescale attack on civilian populations that occurred in WWII will never be tolerated now. Things are different now. You can thumb your nose at world opinion, Europe, etc., but it’s important not to antagonize the support Israel now has. If Israel is totally isolated, with boycotts economically, on travel, academic cooperation, and so on, it will be a disaster. There already seems to be some kind of unwritten boycott of Israeli travelers by the Obama administration–with Israelis having a harder time getting visas. It hasn’t received that much attention. This goes on while we’re being flooded by illegals on the southern border. Somehow, Netanyahu has to walk a fine line, damage Hamas as much as he can, and wait for January 2017, hoping that there is a change for the better.

  16. Do you suppose the other side has smarter lawyers?

    Netanyahu agreed to send an abject apology and compensation to Turkey. Perhaps it legal advice to ensure Israel was protected from world condemnation and reprisals, including those of their “friends” Dignity for your people, and the enemy made to pay, an end that assured the enemy could never arise to threaten again? The international community must be assuaged? So, is it a matter of the surgery was successful, but the patient died.

    2) What I advocated was the targeting of commercial enterprises, i.e. buildings, malls, factories, offices; infrastructure, markets. Life should not be able to go on as usual. The population needs to feel the effects of WAR, be angry with THEIR leadership who initiated. The principle had been, “They started it, we will finish it.”

  17. Betestadog said:

    Sorry you don’t like it, but there are complex laws of war

    . ”

    Which one exactly are you referring to? We are eager to consult them.

    Israel has already a law referred to as the Enemy Act 1939, already adopted by Great Britain, and which further also became an Israeli law.

    According to said Act, Israel DOES NOT HAVE THE RIGHT to provide Gaza with electricity, water, fuel, food, healthcare and no services and supplies.

    Israel being in wartime, all the provisions of said Act must be enforced to their fullest extent, and all drastic measures should be taken against Hamas and its population.

  18. @ BethesdaDog:
    Tell me more about it…
    I am a retired Senior-Fellow Engineer US Department of Defense Military Avionics Programs. Also a published author and patent holder for the use on military aircraft, etc. Also a former front line decorated soldier.
    I do not recall that during our meetings at design and production levels we required lawyers to consider the relative merits of the weapon systems incorporated into those F-16’s, F-15’s, AH-64’s, F-117. B-2, etc.
    The idea was to make those systems as efficient and deadly as possible.
    If you take a moment Bethesda you may consider visiting WIKIPEDIA on the subject of weapons.
    Attorneys better be set aside or up frontin the line of fire if one intends to win, which remains the old fashioned objective of war valid to this day.
    I do not favor intentionally targeting civilians, as long that civilians are not active supporters of the enemy but civilians must understand that their actions must be carefully made to remain safe.
    Using civilians as human shields as used routinely by Islamic forces is a crude violation of law. It is incumbent upon the international community… to address.
    Should they fail, the guilt is all theirs.

  19. Please read this quote:

    As Brigadier General Charles Dunlap succinctly puts it, knowing the legal challenges they will face, “savvy American commanders seldom go to war without their attorneys.”11 In the end, “[lawyers] provide harried decision-makers with a critical guarantee of legal coverage, turning complex issues of morality into technical issues of legality, so that whatever moral or operational doubts a commander may have, he can at least be sure he will not face legal consequences.”12

    Lawyers are involved in decision-making in modern warfare, at least among civilized countries.

    Here’s the article:

    http://www.questia.com/library/journal/1P3-517218071/legal-support-in-war-the-role-of-military-lawyers

    This is the international journal published by the students of the Univ. of Chicago law school. I cannot find the full article, since the journal website has not completed the page for its archives.

  20. @ Topaz:

    Nowadays, civilized countries do. Sorry you don’t like it, but there are complex laws of war. The Americans employed lawyers in both Iraq and Afghanistan, from what I know. The Israelis are apparently doing it right now, from what I have read. The leaders of the country–whom you are free to criticize all you want for doing so–have to be concerned with taking actions that cause the Americans to abandon their use of the veto in support of Israel, other actions by international organizations, possible sanctions and boycotts, etc. I know you will all say to hell the U.S, the U.N., Europe, etc., and I feel the same way. you’ll say, “go it alone, the world doesn’t care about Jews, etc.”, but since Israel is a state, and still must exist in the international community, and not jeopardize the support Israel does have at this point, the leaders must walk a fine line. None of you have the responsibilities for the state the way the cabinet has. There’s a reason Netanyahu spoke with the leaders of a half dozen major countries, some of which are not reliable friends. Netanyahu has to engage in diplomacy; none of you commenting here does. So, you are free to say anything you want, it has no consequence to the international situation.

    Israel could literally flatten all of Gaza, kill all the civilian population, bomb like the Allies did in WW II or shoot rockets indiscriminately the way Germany did. It will not help Israel in the end.

    It’s not an easy situation to be in. I wish we could go in and kill every last terrorist, bomb the mosques where there are weapons, etc. Bibi is going further than Israel has ever gone, apparently. hitting a mosque (which is appropriate legally when it is a storehouse for weapons and might even appropriately attack hospitals and schools under similar circumstances.) There’s no sense in turning everyone else who is now sympathetic against Israel. Better to finish the job and secure the safety of Sderot and the rest of the country without doing that, if possible.

    Turning off the power and water could create a huge humanitarian crisis that would cast Israel in the worst possible light. Maybe it’s possible to do it selectively. It might still be down the line in Israel’s strategy. Better to accomplish Israel’s objectives without turning everyone against Israel. There ARE people who support Israel now; I’d hate to lose the last remaining support.

  21. @ yamit82:

    “Israel is not a Jeffersonian democratic republic. We are a quasi police state with a concentration of power structures and economic hegemony of a few oligarchical families.

    ALL soi-disant “Jeffersonian democratic republics” are (ultimately) quasi police states to the degree that their people tolerate such a state of affairs.

    A free country isn’t just laid in your lap; you have to want it enough to stand up for it.

    “The government has the law on it’s side…”

    Dunno what this means. Sounds like a contradiction-in-terms. If “no man is above the law,” then the govt isn’t above it either.

    “Become a vocal and visible threat to any of our power structure institutions and you might be put away with out trial for long periods or worse.”

    If you weren’t so scared, you’d be communicating these kinds of concerns to your fellow citizens; organizing them — and if you had the genuine sense of kinship toward other Jews that you talk about, this would come quite naturally to you.

    — Sounds, however, like the power structure has really intimidated you. I’d say you have all the earmarks of a defeatist.

    “But you are one of those true believers, not belief in truth but what you would like that truth to be.”

    You’re half-right; half-wrong.

    I believe in BOTH what the truth is AND what I would like the truth to be. And I have the commitment to do whatever it takes to bring the one around to faithfully reflect the other.

    “You seem to have an adequate grasp of the use of Google and other search engines and all you need is apply one of them by asking the correct questions…”

    Well then, don’t make this a guessing game — tell me what the “correct questions” are, and I’ll start Googling them!

  22. dweller Said:

    If the People don’t hold the govt’s feet to the fire, then the People deserve what they get.

    Holding the govt’s feet to the fire????

    Gee I wonder what you mean by that Barbs????

    Should we roast them as well??

    Should we all become cannibals??

    “Qui facit per alium, facit per se,” “quis cus·to·di·et ip·sos cus·to·des?”.

    Israel is not a Jeffersonian democratic republic. We are a quasi police state with a concentration of power structures and economic hegemony of a few oligarchical families.

    The government has the law on it’s side, the Police, the courts, the media, academia,the arts and most of the press and the control of the guns. Few private citizens are allowed to own guns.

    Become a vocal and visible threat to any of our power structure institutions and you might be put away with out trial for long periods or worse.

    But you are one of those true believers, not belief in truth but what you would like that truth to be. You seem to have an adequate grasp of the use of Google and other search engines and all you need is apply one of them by asking the correct questions. Ask the wrong question and you will receive wrong answers.

    “Ask No Questions and You will be told no lies”

  23. @ yamit82:

    “PM Netanyahu told the Foreign Affair and Defense Committee in a meeting yesterday that the lawyers won’t allow Israel to shut off the water and electricity to Gaza.”

    “Let them — or him — state the legal reason WHY. Surely the people are entitled to an explanation.”

    “This is Israel Barbie. The people are not entitled to anything the government is not willing to give.”

    This is the real world, shlemozzl. Supplicating the govt doesn’t make it.

    No govt of ANY country ever gives up ANYTHING of its own accord.

    If the People don’t hold the govt’s feet to the fire, then the People deserve what they get.

  24. @ Ted Belman:

    “[T]here is an attitude in the Israeli government that we must be careful to never be accused of collective punishment of the civilian population of Gaza.”

    Yes, but that presumes that Gaza is otherwise ENTITLED to power from Israel. How, ‘entitled’?

    Hamas won the 2006 election there; so providing water & power (in wartime or any other time) is HAMAS’s problem, not GOI’s.

    Why does Israel even contract to supply anything to Gaza — EVER?

  25. yamit82 Said:

    Let everyone see this.

    That why I handed it off to you, Tiger . As I said I am one of the great unrecognized geniuses of the world.

  26. @ Ted Belman:

    Let me remind you and Arlene the the PA and Hamas owe the IEC over $200 million dollars. They Owe Mikoret the Water authority almost as much. They owe Other infrastructure and service Israeli providers like fuel Oil, gas and Disel hundreds of $$$ millions as well.

    When you have deadbeats for clients you cut them off and or shut them down for chronic non payment. The IEC has even taken the PA to court to get judgement forcing the government to pay them from tax rebates we collect and pass on. There is no law forcing Israel to provide medical services to the wife of Abbas and Hamas leaders families yet we do it and the Israeli sucker picks up the bills.

    The problem with Israel is that our governments have never considered the Palis (any group) as enemies but as potential peace partners in the future and act accordingly.

    Were the order by the government of Israel to the IDF to destroy the PA and Hams it would be done within a week.

    Israel pays to much attention to world opinion who have grown accustomed to pressuring Israel and getting their way.

    If Israel were to say no or ignore them and do what needs to be done after the shock wears off the International community (spit) will have to adjust to a different Israel.

    In less than 10 years Hamas and Islamic Jihad has gone from making primitive little short rnge rockets to a whole home grown rocket Industry supported by Iran. The next round will not be like the current and the current is not like the last two. They are progressing and leaning our weaknesses and will find ways to defeat it.

    Part of the problem with our current talking heads and ex generals and analysts is that they always fight the last wars and battles.

    You want to prevent round 4 then you must be prepared to pay the price because it’s certain in the next round or the one after the next we will be forced to do what we are adverse to do today and the price to us will probably be much higher.

    I never belittle my enemy and his abilities. He may never beat us but he can certainly hurt us. Isis is setting up shop in Gaza and Sinai as well as Al-Qaeda. That’s the future and there is no way we can contain them from the outside only from the inside. Any retreat from my position is putting all of Israel and all Israelis at risk in the near future. An open would not treated becomes infectious and life threatening.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHAZvbdNAZA

  27. @ Ted Belman:

    it would serve us very badly from a PR perspective and cause us to lose the support we have.

    WHAT SUPPORT????

    What is envisioned is a headline that says, for example, that three people on respirators and five premature babies in incubators died because Israel cut off electricity and the hospital where these patients were did not have a working generator.

    God damn it , I am hoping to hand out candies for just such an occasion!
    Let there be no more headlines describing OUR casualties…
    Callousness and treason….

  28. @ Honeybee:

    You are absolutely right.

    Netanyahu cannot take harsher steps like any other self-respecting country.

    He even added “We can’t do what the Russians did to the Chechens”.

    WHY NOT ????!!!!

    ARE THE LIVES OF RUSSIANS WORTH THAN THE JEWISH ONES?

  29. Ted Belman Said:

    My response has been that there is an attitude in the Israeli government that we must be careful to never be accused of collective punishment of the civilian population of Gaza.

    @ yamit82:

    Are international norms and laws more important then the lives of Israelis? I realize that I am as ignorant of military tactics as a “novice in a Nunnery” , but as a devote of William Tecumseh Sherman I believe the most important tactic is winning and ending conflict quickly as possible. I am a mistakenly foolish novice?

  30. @ Mr. Belman:

    As I mentioned, the Trading with the Enemy Act 1939 became an Israeli law.

    Israel being currently is in wartime, said Act must be enforced to its fullest extent.

    The Israeli government is always twisting the laws when it is to benefit Arabs and deprive Jews.

    They did it with respect to the dismantlement of the Land of Israel in contravention of international law and Israeli Penal Code.

    They did it when they demolished Jewish homes in Judea and Samaria, in conditions which contravene the Declaration of Human Rights

    Distorting the laws became the national sport of the government of Israel.

  31. @ SHmuel HaLevi 2:

    Reservists in 2012 call up in operation Pillar of Defense

    “We were called on Friday evening. We left everything – our work, families and daily duties – and went to serve our country. That’s how we live our lives here in Israel, and it has nothing to do with our political believes. Though I can’t say I was eager to fight, I was ready to follow my friends into battle.”

    From 2 years ago should mirror the call up this week as well!

    Last time BB and Barak chickened out and it cost BB and the Likud 10 mandates in the elections a few months later.

    Will BB revert to his standard MO and destroy the Likud a third time?????

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XeglNGPQPrk

  32. dweller Said:

    Let them — or him — state the legal reason WHY.

    — Surely the people are entitled to an explanation.

    This is Israel Barbie. The people are not entitled to anything the government is not willing to give.

  33. Arlene Kushner’s comment:

    One of the things Kedar suggests is that we cut off all electricity and fuel to Gaza, something which some of my readers have been asking me about.

    My response has been that there is an attitude in the Israeli government that we must be careful to never be accused of collective punishment of the civilian population of Gaza.

    Aside from the fact that it may not be legal according to humanitarian international law, it would serve us very badly from a PR perspective and cause us to lose the support we have. What is envisioned is a headline that says, for example, that three people on respirators and five premature babies in incubators died because Israel cut off electricity and the hospital where these patients were did not have a working generator.

    What’s being said is that the government’s legal advisors (which may primarily mean the attorney general) advise against cutting off of electricity. But my own suspicion is that our prime minister, who is so inordinately concerned about world opinion, would, himself not go this route.

    In 2007, what Israel did, however, was reduce the amount of electricity sent into Gaza without cutting it off completely, and government lawyers at that time said this was legal. This, then, might be the way to go – it would fall to Hamas to decide how to allocate available electricity and if hospitals were deprived it would be the fault of Hamas. But I don’t know that Netanyahu is about to be convinced of this.

    http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/182788#.U7_cwJvlrIV

  34. SHmuel HaLevi said:

    I say that only a rigid formal presentation via the media and courts including a stern demand for disclosure of all the protocols regarding the subject, will do

    There is no law impeding Israel to cut off electricity. A contrario, since Israel is in wartime, it has to apply the laws dealing with enemies.

    As I mentioned in great details in article entitled “What is Hamas doing”, Israel is prohibited to provide the enemies with goods, services and money according to the Trading with the Enemy Act 1939 which became an Israeli law and applied towards Arab countries named in it as “The Enemy”.

    When a law or a measure is for the protection of the rights of the Jews, Israel looks the other way and never applies it. When it comes to defend its enemies, Israel goes as far as inventing rules and obligations it is not subjected to.

    The Israel government leads its Jewish citizens as they were peasants totally ignorant, and instead of ruling the country in accordance with justice, it pursues a two tier justice system.

  35. ” First we hang all the lawyers” Wm. Shakespeare ” The horse that pulls the Hurst of a lawyer to his grave, snickers all the way” Charles Dickens

  36. @ Topaz:
    The whole country outside the laflafim of North Tel Aviv realizes that there has been a huge deceitful fraud at play by the gangs up there. I say that only a rigid formal presentation via the media and courts including a stern demand for disclosure of all the protocols regarding the subject, will do.
    Netanyahu is, along with the garbage in uniform a liar and at least a sold out charlatan.
    No ifs, buts or whens. Disclosure now!

    We have been betrayed and assaulted by the unJews for long enough.

  37. Do NOT allow ONE Israeli soldier to be sent into Harm’s Way. “SIGNALLING” a ground invasion!! Madness.

    INCONVENIENCE THE ENEMY. Nothing in or out. Night time massive Missile blitz on everything that is commercial; Office building, malls, factories. Destroy ALL property owned by terrorists.

    LEARN FROM THE ENEMY.

    Practice silence, as the old leaders did until the deed was done and then only a terse summary from military command. AND get a fabulous trained experienced P.R. person, to be the ONLY one to speak. Respond to each comment by fogging – “Talk to THEM”.

    Campaign from those who love the Jewish people, from Jews world wide, to send mega funds so that Israel can get out from under the US state department financial yoke.

    What are the chances? Sadness.

  38. This makes no sense. The lawyers won’t let him? Who consults lawyers at a time of war?

    The old leaders knew that Israel had to move fast and furious because time was NOT on their side, not from the enemy and not from the world leaders. So, this delaying and still providing everything to the enemy speaks to something else going on, and THAT IS THE BIG SECRET. That is what needs to be exposed. Who rules the rulers.

  39. “PM Netanyahu told the Foreign Affair and Defense Committee in a meeting yesterday that the lawyers won’t allow Israel to shut off the water and electricity to Gaza.”

    Let them — or him — state the legal reason WHY.

    — Surely the people are entitled to an explanation.

  40. There is no such legal oppinion. Netanyahu himslef refuses to do his job and must be sent with his family to Sderot and the other areas hit by the Hamas he is protecting and supplying.
    I suggest that parents sternly reject allowing our children to be made cannon fodder while the garbage supplies the enemy for the profit of certain cadres.