T. Belman. The reason Obama didn’t make mention of the conflict in his UN speech is because he wants to achieve this deal on a back channel rather than noisily. Netanyahu’s willingness is probably the reason that Obama has been sweet talking Netanyahu after the bitter fight on the Iran Deal. This is what I surmise. I have no inside info.
After meeting in Paris with four former Israeli ambassadors Sept. 21, Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas reportedly said that he would be willing to meet with Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. The problem, he said, was that a “third party” was preventing such a meeting from taking place. The Palestinian leader meant the Americans, more specifically, Secretary of State John Kerry, who will meet Netanyahu Oct. 1 in New York.
While American sources claimed Abbas’ statement was “inaccurate,” senior Palestinian and Israeli officials alike confirmed that the Americans were not enthusiastic about such a meeting taking place. They believe it would be explosive and cause the situation to deteriorate even further. The Americans have learned from experience. They bear the battle scars of countless disappointments. They would therefore prefer to spend time preparing for such a meeting, honing positions, coordinating expectations and going for a sure thing.
For the past few months, the Americans have been very concerned that they could lose Abbas. The Palestinian president’s status among his own people is getting weaker by the day, and demonstrations against him are turning violent. A quiet uprising of sorts against him is already underway in the refugee camps, and it erupts every so often. In some instances, there has even been an exchange of fire between insurgent Palestinians and security forces. The last thing Kerry wants to see is Abbas resign or be deposed and have the West Bank slip into administrative and military chaos. He’s already had enough problems like that.
The real drama is taking place behind the scenes on various fronts. Kerry met recently with the leader of the Israeli opposition, Knesset member and Zionist Camp head Isaac Herzog. While both sides deny they discussed the political situation, it is quite safe to assume that they did not skip over the topic.
Herzog is in the middle of advanced negotiations to join the current government. Netanyahu made him a very tempting offer in which Herzog’s party would receive the Foreign, Defense and Justice ministries. Herzog does want to join the government. He knows that the position of defense minister (offered for just half a term, in another year and a half) could help him overcome his image as a weakling and give him that special something he needs to become prime minister. Before he can join, however, he will have to convince his own party’s Central Committee to extend his term as chairman until late 2017. That is what Netanyahu wants in exchange for the deal. The prime minister is not willing to forego all these strategic assets only to see Herzog deposed a few months later and replaced with a new party chair who will lead the Zionist Camp out of the coalition. If that happened, Netanyahu would be exposed in every direction.
Kerry still hasn’t given up his dream of diplomatic negotiations between Israel and the Palestinians, but he is also a lot wiser now. He realizes that there will be no permanent arrangement between the parties during his term. The question, then, is what will there be instead.
Kerry and the peace team he put together (which has since come apart) are committed to achieving something. They have no interest in leaving the negotiations in ruins. It is quite possible he would prefer that negotiations were renewed after Herzog joins Netanyahu’s government and leads it to the political center. Not only is Netanyahu’s current government incapable of conducting negotiations, it wouldn’t last the first 15 minutes. Bringing 24 new Knesset members from the center-left into the coalition would turn this government into something very different. I assume that Kerry is kept abreast of the secret contacts between Herzog and Netanyahu and is keeping his fingers crossed for them.
But there is another issue that is even more significant. On Sept. 2, Al-Monitor revealed that in his meeting with Abbas on March 17, 2014, President Barack Obama handed Abbas a proposal for a framework agreement with Israel. This proposal was based on an earlier draft of a framework agreement reached between the Israelis and the Americans. That agreement was the outcome of intense negotiations between Kerry, Netanyahu and their respective staffs, conducted over many long weeks via video conferencing. The talks took place on an almost daily basis and lasted for hours. They eventually resulted in a very volatile document in which Netanyahu agreed to create a mechanism to rehabilitate the Palestinian refugees. He even agreed to take in a limited number of refugees (to be determined by Israel), as well as to the principle of the 1967 borders serving as the basis for each state (with land swaps).
The one point that Netanyahu refused to concede was the status of Jerusalem. The Americans inserted an especially explosive clause (making Jerusalem the capital of two states) and presented it to Abbas.
The Palestinian leader has been true to form and has yet to respond to Obama’s proposal. Kerry seems concerned that in any potential meeting between Netanyahu and Abbas, this draft will be raised for discussion. The ensuing explosion would be nuclear. There is no way Netanyahu could survive politically once that happened. When the Americans informed the Israelis about their changes to the draft, the Israelis responded with a shrug. Netanyahu’s adviser, attorney Yitzhak Molcho, told the Americans, “You can add whatever you want. The Palestinians will still say no.”
Molcho was almost right. Abbas is not the kind of leader who says no. But he simply doesn’t answer. He didn’t answer Obama in 2014, just like he didn’t answer Prime Minister Ehud Olmert in 2009. Given the current state of affairs, Kerry would rather see political change in Israel before the negotiations are renewed. Such change will be needed to lay the groundwork for a renewal of the negotiations with even greater care than before the last round of talks.
Felix Quigley Said:
danger in the lands and offices of the enemies is a good thing. I have never heard of a military strategist suggesting a paradigm of stabilization and order for his enemies: destabiliation, disorder,chaos is what is usually sought for enemies….. go figure. Apparently the Israelis have not yet caught on to the efficacy of this common and mundane strategy and still advocate for stability in the lands of enemies.
Felix Quigley Said:
yes, and I answered that in the past. the current question for which we await an answer from you is why are hezbullah and Iran, 2 genocidal threats to Jews, the babies of Putin?
Felix Quigley Said:
perhaps you are the one that should answer a question some times?
Felix Quigley Said:
😛 😛 😛 😛 😛 ….. I do!
shoudlnt you be singing the socialist international with that flag waving?
It may come as a surprise to you but the purest interest of Israel is related to Jews and their safety and security and not the safety and sovereignty of their anti semitic enemies
Felix Quigley Said:
I suggest a basic course in “some s is p” in order to avoid ludicrous fallacies of logic.
Felix Quigley Said:
No, not a vital issue… more vital an issue is that syria aids hezbullah to kill jews, and so does Iran… Russia supports all three… a much more vital issue than sovereignty of nations which means sweet f*ck all to me for anti semitic nations.
Felix Quigley Said:
close, but no cigar, reread my comments and take your ritalin to focus on what I actually said… and answer the questions put to you that you keep evading
Why did you just leave out the names of hezbullah and Iran from your narrative about assad… after all assad supports the terrorists hezbullah in alliance with Iran to kill jews.
was that an oversight…again?
As a result of the past 15 years we are now conditioned, not exactly to tolerate but to deliberately turn a blind eye, to the greatest human horrors.
Move on the MSN lecture us. It is just not polite to display beheadings, girls being sold etc.
Antisemites on blogs made up a rule not to enen mention the Holocaust
The same is now happening to discussing the Iran Deal.
There are no friends in the Media as seen in Megyn Kelly v Trump and also v Pamela Geller post Garland.
These are the main issues to deal with.
Isolation is the number one issue. Israpundit was founded to break down that isolation.
Anything which leads to chaos in the world of today is leading into situations of great danger. It is a feature of Fascism to destroy the old institutions. The way that hitler proceeded is of great knowledge to the present. Does Obama not proceed in that way, for example his hatred of gun carry in US? He breaks the Constitution all of the time. The defense of these forms of ruling and ordering is important.
Putin at the very least has smoked Cameron and Obama into the open. It is clear that IS and al Qaeda are their babies and they are going to protect them more and more.
Why are they their babies is the really biggest question of all?
The question Spencer will not even ask never mind answer.
Who can now deny that the purest interest of Israel is to defend with all it’s might this central human concept of national sovereignty?
I have said very often that Israel always reserves it’s right to defense if attacked by anybody.
But Israel to defend its own sovereignty must defend all sovereignty.
Five years ago the sovereignty of Syria was attacked I could say hammered from all sides, from everywhere actually.
Assad had every right to defense as also does Israel which is in a similar situation
Involved is the issue of nations being sovereign. As Israel is sovereign. As Palestine is not a nation. This is a vital concept and issue.
Catalonia deserves to be sovereign. But Syria was indeed sovereign.
Ross
You equate the fascist IS with Assad. You go further you say Assad is a bigger danger.
Felix Quigley Said:
😛
Felix Quigley Said:
😛 😛
Felix Quigley Said:
bernard ross Said:
you didnt run away this time for days, but true to my prediction you ran away from answering my questions. You want questions answered but you always run away from questions asked wrt to your ludicrous proposals: like Israel should support assad against jihadis.
Prove me wrong Felix, answer the questions.
Felix Quigley Said:
😛 😛 😛
Looks like Obama wanted Iran, the ally of syria who threatens to blow up Israel daily, to have nuclear fuel.
Did you mistake my exposure of Obama arming AQ through benghazi with support of Obama, perhaps? Are you confused and unable to tell the difference between support and reporting, or the difference between observing lunatic muslims killing each other and taking sides, or the difference between the immediate threat of the russian, hezbulah, iran axis and the future threat of the ragtag IS? Poor Felix, so immersed in trotsyite ideological fantasies that he is unable to see the forest from the trees…. or even which century the forest is in.
@ Felix Quigley:
slan·der
?sland?r/
nounLaw
noun: slander
1.
the action or crime of making a false spoken statement damaging to a person’s reputation.
Ted as I said before you have this Ross character who is supportive of ISIS
And who slanders me
Have you thought Ted how Ross is always on side of CIA stooge Obama?
That precise moment in time when a communist drops his veil of humanitarianism and reveals himself to be an avid fascist.
At least I am hoping that’s what it means. The Germans have great words:
Treppenwitz: The witty response that occurs to you after the other person has left.
Fremdschämen: The discomfort you feel while watching someone else being embarrassed.
Ohrwurm: A song you can’t get out of your head.
Backpfeifengesicht: Someone who needs to be slapped in the face.
Kuddelmuddel: A situation that is a total mess.
It appears that facility with language is a positive byproduct of being genocidal maniacs.
@ babushka:
What does “Schicklgruberfreude”? means?
The Germans seemingly have a word for everything, so it would be interesting to know how the Huns describe that precise moment in time when a communist drops his veil of humanitarianism and reveals himself to be an avid fascist.
“Schicklgruberfreude”?
Felix Quigley Said:
Putin is not attcking ISIS he attacked the FSA.
Felix Quigley Said:
what drives Israel into crisis is that your idol putin has now overtly, and fully, allied with hezbulla and Iran both of whom seek the total destruction of Israel. This makes conflict between Israel and russia quite likely.
Felix Quigley Said:
IS in syria has not once attacked Israel, neither has the FSA or nusra, all sunnis. However, your idols proxies have attacked Israel from syria and daily threaten the destruction of Israel and the Jewish people. So now we see that I was correct when I heaped ridicule on your advice that Israel support assad against the rebels. At the time I agreed with Israels policy of overt neutrality because enemies killing each other is ideal and also none of them are trustworthy as allies. However, I did note that the enemies were being weakened and perhaps Israel should take the window of opportunity to strike hezbullah the death blow. Now with russia clearly on the side of the wannabe genocidal murderers of the Jews that window of opportunity has disappeared and it now appears that it might have been better for Israel to have helped the jihadis against hezbullah/assad. I said then that Syria, hezbullah and Iran are more dangerous to Israel than IS and the sunni rebels and I am proven correct. Now that Russia is on their side the danger has increased 100 fold.
Felix Quigley Said:
felix?????
it appears that you are on the side of those who actively work for the destruction of the Jewish state. As a result of your russia, hezbullah, assad, iran axis forming we will perhaps see war between Israel and russia and even WWIII. it is likely that putin will again transfer deadly heavy weapons to hezbullah and iran in their war against syria thus provoking either Israels attacks or Israels endangerment. Perhaps Israel should be helping IS repeat the mujihadeen hounding of the soviets in afgahanistan. Unless there is suicide bombing of russian facilities in syria there will likely be WWIII. There is no comparison for the Jews between the threat of IS and the sunni jihadis as opposed to hezbullah iran.
What do you expect hezbullah, russia and iran to do vs Israel….. seek peace?
Now that russia openly supports hezbullan and iran what further good advice do you have for the Jews?
Felix….?
Felix……are you there?????
this is usually the time you run away for days to avoid the questions.
Putin is correct. To destroy ISIS you have to destroy Obama and all his jihadist forces in Syria
This is what drives all Israeli elites into crisis
Do THEY want ISIS defeated?
Bernard?
Ted?
I read that the sadat speaking in Jerusalem was originally agreed between Israel and sadat directly but the carter and americans pushed in and wanted credit for the peace… hence camp david.
Perhaps something similar is happening here as they probably want to have their finger in the process every step of the way so if there is any headway they will claim it.
Abbas just gave a an ambiguous speech at the UN. Typical whining victim-hood speech Abbas speech. Threat to sue Israel and make Israel responsible for the Palestinian areas if Israel does not give in to his demands. Basically a big yawn!
Syrian issue is what all the Arabs, US, Russia and EU care about. The Pals are way down the list. No two state solution is happening even if Herzog ever joins the government.
I like Al Monitor. The EMPIRE misjudged Assad. In that Assad did have a constituency support against Jihad.
Netanyahu’s desire to create this demographic suicide bomb is entirely plausible because it is consistent with his passive complicity in the Iranian fiasco. Most American conservatives misperceive Netanyahu as being a latter day Winston Churchill even though he has always more closely resembled the hapless James Buchanan. If Bibi has his way, there will definitely be a Palestinian state, but it is far less certain that there will be a Jewish state.
Ted, Obama has sent signs that their is really nothing he can achieve during his year plus in office to achieve a two state solution. He wants negotiations to start and the PA survive period for now.
Bibi is not doing a deal giving up security of Judah/Samaria and letting the borders be controlled by the PA. He knows ISIS and or Hamas would shortly take over.
I suspect the only part of it that’s true is that Netanyahu would like to take out Herzog as a future rival.
As for the rest of it, Abu Bluff will never sign a deal acknowledging Israel as the Jewish State. That’s the long and short of it.
The rest is media spin.