T. Belman. Singer misleads by writing
“My humble opinion: Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu needs to confirm to the Court, if true, that one of his senior officials has been discussing implementing the Saudi-based Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine solution or alternative solutions in alleged secret back channel meetings with a senior PLO official for the last three months.”
He offers no evidence that it is true or that it threatens his Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine solution
The Khan al Ahmar issue is solvable but two practical solutions were rejected by the illegal residents who seem to want confrontation. Op-ed
By David Singer, INN May 2, 2023, 9:49 AM (GMT+3)
A showdown between Israel’s Government and High Court of Justice on 1 May concerning the demolition and evacuation of an illegal Bedouin encampment-cum-village – Khan al-Ahmar – threatens to shred the implementation of the Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine solution and cause an international uproar.
Three judges of the High Court of Justice on 24 May 2018 unanimously rejected a final appeal by the 200 residents of Khan al-Ahmar to demolish the illegal settlement and evacuate its residents – finding the Government had that right “under the letter of the law”.
Two sites for their evacuation have been rejected by the residents:
- A relocation site 8.5 km. away
- Relocation to an area adjoining Abu Dis – where Israel has reportedly invested some 80 million shekels ($23.7 million) preparing infrastructure, roads, electricity, water, sewage, a health clinic and school – all on state land
Nine adjournments had been granted since 2018 until 1 February this year when these three Judges refused to grant the newly-installed Netanyahu Government a tenth adjournment for a further four months – creating an immediate political crisis by ordering the Government to come up with a plan of evacuation by 2 April and relisting the matter for final hearing on 1 May.
The Judges were unmoved by the political ramifications they were causing for the Government by refusing another adjournment and demanding a timetable for demolition.
That plan of evacuation was apparently not provided by the Government to the Court by April 2.
Instead a submission has been filed in the Court by the Government arguing that only the Government should decide on the timing of any demolition – not the Court:
“The petitioners have not proven any cause which would justify court intervention in the broad discretion the political echelon has regarding the manner and timing of the implementation of the demolition orders in the [Khan al-Ahmar] compound … the question of timing and method of implementation the [demolition] orders are influenced by wide and varied political and security considerations. As such, and bearing in mind the classified information on which these considerations are based, the position of the political echelon is that the decision regarding the question should be left in their hands…is a complex and sensitive question, the consequences of which exceed mere construction and planning laws,” and could have consequences “for Israel’s foreign relations and security.”
From tens to hundreds of thousands of anti judicial reform leftist protestors demonstrating throughout Israel every Saturday night for the last thirteen weeks, waving PLO flags until their public relations experts warned them they would lose support, have been demanding no suggested reforms be made by the Government to the High Court’s jurisdiction to hear and determine cases brought before it.
They have now been joined by two of the leftist demonstrators’ most-hated politicians – Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich and National Security Minister Itamar Ben-Gvir – who both unsuccessfully argued that the Government in its submission should allow the Court to make an order for Khan al-Ahmar’s demolition – the last thing these protestors would want to see.
How is this looming showdown going to be avoided?
My humble opinion: Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu needs to confirm to the Court, if true, that one of his senior officials has been discussing implementing the Saudi-based Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine solution or alternative solutions in alleged secret back channel meetings with a senior PLO official for the last three months.
This disclosure should be sufficient for the Court to grant a further adjournment – avoiding any damaging confrontation between the Government and the Court – leaving those secret negotiations to determine the fate of Khan al-Ahmar and thousands of other illegally-built Arab structures.
What a tangled mess we weave….
Author’s note: The cartoon — commissioned exclusively for this article — is by Yaakov Kirschen aka “Dry Bones”- one of Israel’s foremost political and social commentators — whose cartoons have graced the columns of Israeli and international media publications for decades
David Singer is an Australian lawyer who is active in Zionist community organizations in that country. He founded the “Jordan is Palestine” Committee in 1979.
#Singer – Why would someone negate a concept that they have nothing to do with. Not negating something does not prove it exists. You are really groping for proof when you are saying not negating something is evidence that it exists. Something that did not happen did not happen.
An article with a concept exists. Lots of articles with concepts exist. Bibi correctly has stated that in any plan Israel must retain security control until the Jordan River. That is correct. He stated this with Trump’s plan. He has made no reference to your plan because as of this time in point it is only in play with you. Anyway beating a dead horse or one that only exists in your mind is of no further avail.
#Edgar G
The Trump Plan was released on 28 January 2020.
The Abraham Accords were signed on 15 September 2020.
I am not going away until the Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine solution has been rejected by King Abdullah, Mahmoud Abbas, Ismail Haniyeh, Crown Prince Mohammed Bin Salman, Bibi Netanyahu and Ahmed Aboul Gheit.
#Bear
The “man” happens to be the confidant of Mohammed Bin Salman and a member of Bin Salman’s advisory board on Neom – a new $500 billion megacity the size of Israel planned for northwestern Saudi Arabia
Not one word rejecting the plan has been uttered by King Abdullah, Mahmoud Abbas, Ismail Haniyeh, Mohammed Bin Salman, Bibi or Ahmed Aboul Gheit in the eleven months since its publication. Israpundit readers have rejected it repeatedly – as has Ted – which is the natural thing to do if you don’t like something. Hasn’t happened here with any of these leaders whose policies for decades have been trashed by this plan.
I guess you know secret negotiations have been going on for the last three months between Israel and the PLO. You must also know Bibi has got the High Court of Justice to not set a date for the demolition of an illegal Beduin encampment after secret evidence was given in court that to do so could affect Israel’s foreign relations.
Bibi has already made it clear that Israel would demand total security control over all territory west of the Jordan River in any peace treaty. No security control – no Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine.
David-
I overlooked your address to me. Easy to do. Trump’s letter, with its usual hyperbole, was totally ignored by the PLO, AS YOU WELL KNOW, and NEVER acted on. Also, there was a preannounced refusal by the PA to ignore it or anything to do with the Abraham Accords.
That was over 5 years ago, and formerly recalcitrant countries are still, and increasingly applying to join the Accords. The process was begun by the Accords and is continuing.
And, of curse, as all expected, NOTHING was done by the PA.
I fail to see any relevance between Trump’s letter and facts that developed on the ground. There is little relevance to facts in your obsession.
You throw out these already dissipating “smoke screen”, totally irrelevant, and sit back expecting us to say” Oh Yes David, you are so RIGHT , we didn’t think of that”” or something like.
Well you can amuse yourself anyway you want to, and we thank you for amusing us also.
SEBASTIEN, whose post is just below, is 100% correct and expresses what we ALL feel about your hash-knife Mulligan Stew. You’ve cooked it on the stove forfar too long and the bottom is burnt through, making the contents poisonous, certainly to Israel.
Why don’t you silently fold your tents and steal away…….as the poet said.
@David Personally, I find the very thought of what you are proposing being taken seriously terrifying. Fortunately, I have seen no evidence of that.I hope and pray I never will. How can you forget it was the “Jordanians” who ethnically cleansed the Jews from Judea and Samaria, from the Eastern half of Jerusalem which had a Jewish majority for a hundred years before 1948. Robert F. Kennedy was murdered by a “Jordanian-Palestinian” Arab.
“M.T. Mehdi, then secretary-general of the Action Committee on American-Arab Relations, believed that Sirhan had acted in justifiable self-defense, stating: “Sirhan was defending himself against those 50 Phantom jets Kennedy was sending to Israel.” Mehdi wrote a 100-page book on the subject called Kennedy and Sirhan: Why?[42]”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sirhan_Sirhan
Shades of Dayan, Rabin, Peres, Beilin, Barak, Sharon, Olmert, etc.(and I would include Eshkol over res. 242, Begin over Sinai, and Bibi over Hebron, Lapid with the gas fields and Israeli waters..)
“Their refusal to make the difficult choice of telling the Americans “no”, now, at this moment, will see them making the retreats they hope will avert American anger; it will see this effort fail even as the frontier moves from its present lines within the Arab heartland to new ones close to the Jewish cities; and most important, the Americans will make the same demands they always have envisioned since the days of the Roger Plan-total Israeli withdrawal. And since this is a thing that not even the most dovish of Israelis will agree to, the result will be an ultimate Israeli firm “no”, an ultimate American anger of the kind all men of “new initiative” propose to avert today by compromise, and exactly the same conditions of confrontation that would come anyhow if the Israelis said their “no” today. There would be one great difference, however, a “no” today will bring the crisis while Israel stands poised near the Arab capitols. A “no” tomorrow, after all the hapless and confused compromises and “initiatives,” will bring the same crisis near Tel Aviv, Beersheva and Netanya.”
“The frantic search for human allies will end as unsuccessfully as those Jews in the past who forgot what faith in the Jewish G-d was and who turned to Egypt or Assyria or other “allies” for help, only to learn to their dismay that the allies betrayed them.”
(I think he must have meant Persia and Rome. Assyria?)
https://barbaraginsberg-kahane.blogspot.com/2012/12/israel-us-and-stinking-fish-1976.html
As we are seeing unfold in real time before our very eyes 47 years after these words were written.
How can you still be so gullible?
@David
@David
April 12, 2013
https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/jordanian-mps-release-island-of-peace-massacre-murderer-309626
’nuff said.
@David
@Bear
Nicely stated Bear. Good to see you posting again, by the way.
#David Singer, thanks to a link to a man’s article about his theory to solve the problem. You like the idea, good for you. It is not proof that the anyone in Israel and Jordan are discussing nor any of the myriad of Pal-Arab factions. Saudia Arabia has not even signed the Abraham Accords, and do not appear to doing so anytime soon.
The concept (not a plan except in your view) is a non-starter as Israel does not need Jordan involved west of the Jordan River in its affairs. One of their parliamentary members was just arrested for smuggling weapons and gold into Judea/Samaria. Jordanians are not to be trusted. Israel can ONLY rely on itself for security.
@David There were a number of attacks from Jordan between 1950 and 1967. See:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_attacks_against_Israeli_civilians_before_1967
#Bear Klein
No evidence of a Saudi plan? Here is the link:
https://english.alarabiya.net/in-translation/2022/06/08/The-Hashemite-Kingdom-of-Palestine
In contrast to Ted and Zahran’s failed “Jordan Option” plan – negotiations to implement this Saudi Plan can be successfully resolved or fall into a heap within possibly six months. I believe negotiations are currently being conducted under the radar following evidence given in secret to the High Court of Justice by Tzachi Hanegbi on 1 May in the Khan Al-Ahmar case – confirming an earlier report in Axios of secret negotiations between Hanegbi and a high ranking PLO official.
What is truly puzzling is Israeli and international media total disinterest in pursuing Netanyahu seeking confirmation of negotiations under the Saudi solution.
Thousands of column inches reporting judicial reform and rockets flying into Israel from Gaza but not one inch addressing a solution that could make history by ending 100 years of conflict between Arabs and Jews.
#peloni1986
The Saudi-based Plan provides that the Hashemites will govern the newly-created Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine – as they did between 1950 and 1967 – not the PLO, Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Hezbollah nor the many other myriad disparate groups of terrorists and murderers.
It might be nice if you could particularise your following unsubstantiated comments:
Two points:
No evidence of a Saudi Plan that Mr. Singer is talking about.
Singer is correct however, the King is charge of Jordan.
Israel has been negotiating with him recently to return the Jordanian Parliament Member who has been working with terrorists. Mudar Zahran to put it very politely has no credibility and nothing he has ever said has come to fruition.
@David
And his decision has been to carryout repeated waves of subsidized terror and fomenting war against us. But you would still accept this acknowledged terrorist and treaty violator to be the negotiating partner for a new treaty with even greater implications than the one he has been seen to have repeatedly violated?
#peloni 1986
My rationale? – When such a game-changing plan as the Saudi-based Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine solution presents itself – Israel cannot miss the opportunity to try and implement it in negotiations that will involve Jordan’s current ruler – King Abdullah.
King Abdullah has ruled Jordan since 1999 – no matter what Ted and Zahran have been falsely shouting from the roof tops for more than 10 years. While King Abdullah rules – he makes the decisions.
Zahran said this back in 2012: “The King is not going to survive, it’s out of the question… I give him until next summer, more or less. And even if I am wrong, I can’t see the King making it to 2014 by any stretch.”
https://www.timesofisrael.com/preaching-the-gospel-of-liberalism-to-the-jordanian-street/
Ho hum…
@David
I didn’t ask you what Bibi would do when negotiating with another terrorist for peace. What I asked was, given the role that Abdullah is currently playing in murdering our people, how can you advocate a plan which provides him any role in any peace plan, no matter who advocates to the contrary – and nobody but you is actually advocating that we should.
Please answer the question I asked without deferring to Bibi or anyone else. It is you who is advocating that we empower this brigand fake king with a greater role in the region as he is murdering our people, so upon what rationale might doing so make any sense at all to you?
#Edgar G
“Trump said he had sent a letter to Abbas asking him to study the deal.
“I explained to him that the territory allocated for his new state will remain open and undeveloped for a period of four years. During this time, Palestinians can use all appropriate deliberation to study the deal, negotiate with Israel, achieve the criteria for statehood and become a truly independent and wonderful state,” he said.”
https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-israel-palestinians-plan-idAFKBN1ZR1SX
DAVID SINGER-
I am the last person needing instruction in “old English expressions”. I know them all; right back to Bolingbroke, even Pepys But we are talking of and writing in the Present day.
Laughable, but nevertheless highly insulting and offensive. You are old but not that old even though verging on senility. You are NO Nat Gould relic. Nor a P.G. Wodehouse enthusiast.
You are not a “friendly” correspondent.
You know it’s used TODAY as a pejorative description of a homosexual, and you used it deliberately, as I did “limpwrist” It is today we are posting.
I could call you a “sickening brute”, with an obsessive desire to hand Jewish Land over to Arab Mamzerim, and with good reason..
L
And you STILL do not answer about the 4 year PA linit.
#Edgar G
“old fruit”
PHRASE
?BRITISH
?INFORMAL OLD-FASHIONED
DEFINITIONS1
1
used for talking in a friendly way to a man
“limp wrist”
in American English
NOUN
slang, derogatory, offensive
a homosexual, esp. a male homosexual
Calm down old fruit …The offensive tongue happens to be yours.
Peloni1986:
You state:
Correct – and Bibi has already said that in any solution to the conflict Israel will need to retain total security control over all territory west of the Jordan River – which it does not currently have.
If Bibi is not satisfied this will be achieved – then the Saudi Solution will not be implemented.
#Ted
As to your point 1:
Another indicator that the Saudi Solution is being discussed was suggested by
Bibi in his 50-minute interview on Saudi Government-controlled Al Arabiya TV on 15 December 2022:
“You know, I’m sort of a champion of a slight twist in what Woodrow Wilson said in the Versailles Peace Conference. He said he believed in open covenants, openly arrived at. I believe in open covenants, secretly arrived at or discreetly arrived at. There we will have to have discussions about all the questions that you asked today and see how we can advance this. If you try to sort it out in advance, you get stuck. That’s what happens.
In Israel, we say “climb the tree.” Everybody climbs on their own tree and says, “I’m here, and I’m not climbing down and no matter how many ladders you give me.” I’m stuck in my tree, the other guy is stuck in his tree, and we just shout at each other across tree trunks and we never get to a meeting of the minds or an actual meeting on the ground. I think we have to take a different position. All these things need to be discussed discreetly, responsibly and, within the confines of closed meetings, openly. And once we get an agreement, then we can come out.
I don’t need the public fanfare, I don’t need it. You know, if you come to an agreement, it will be publicised. If you don’t come to an agreement, nothing happens. I think we can come to amazing agreements.”
As to your point 2:
The plan being bad for Israel? You and your readers regard the plan as being bad because Israel only gains sovereignity in part of Judea and Samaria – not all of it. Conversely Israel will be gaining internationally-recognised sovereignty in a large area of Judea and Samaria for the first time in 3500 years, recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s sole capital and an end to 100 years of unresolved conflict.
In effect the status quo existing at 4 June 1967 that had been in existence since 1950 will be restored – but in a reduced area than existed then. The Arabs will have paid a price for their breach of the 1949 Armistice Agreements.
The saving of lives must surely take precedence over the recovery of sovereignty in every square metre of Judea and Samaria and the perpetuation of a conflict whose resolution is long ovedue.
This Saudi solution and the outcomes it promises if implemented represents the best plan yet presented to enable the Jewish people to live peacefully in their reconsituted Jewish National Home as authorised by article 6 of the Mandate for Palestine and article 80 of the United Nations Charter.
SINGER-
You’re busier posing irrelevant questions to string out your abysmal lack of responses.
You still conveniently ignore that the Trump Plan gave a 4 year time limit to the PA knowing that they had already rejected the Plan and refused to even read it, giving Israel free rein over all that 60%
By the way old limp wrist, your appelation of “old fruit” is a direct insult to not only my Capetown “mixed race” wife but my 4 children, not to mention myself who, if you were within reach would poleax you with my fists alone. I my be old but am still functioning physically well enough to do it.
Control your offensive tongue. Nd don’t bother to apologise after the facr. A well known legal truck.
@DAVID
You have no proof of anything related to the so-called “Saudi Plan” just conjecture.
I want to undermine your efforts i.e. play down the implementation, for two reasons.
1. There is no reason to believe it is being discussed and
2. It would be bad for Israel.
Justice Solberg stated:
“Foreign relations”? Could this not include possible discussions involving implementing the Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine solution?
Abbas silence: Considering the Solution trashes a Palestinian state between Israel and Jordan – why would Abbas remain silent for 11 months if not to indicate his preparedness to negotiate to implement the solution to see if agreement can be reached?
The Saudi plan specifically states: “Israel is a reality firmly implanted on the ground that has to be accepted, however grudgingly, by the region around it” and “Jordanians and Palestinians are as similar as any people can be. They are Sunni Arabs from the same neighborhood. Merging them will not create any long-term ethnic or sectarian fault lines.” Could it be that Abbas has accepted these positions? Negotiations will tell. He was recently in Saudi Arabia and met MBS – as did King Abdullah.
I understand your desire to play down the implementation of the solution but from my perspective it seems to be coming closer with every day following the visit by US Security Advisor Jake Sullivan to meet with MBS last Sunday.
Sullivan told the Washington Institute before leaving Washington that the US was still working toward a deal to normalise relations between Israel and Saudi Arabia stating:
Ultimately, getting to full normalisation is a declared national security interest of the United States. We have been clear about that. Now as a sign of my seriousness about how much we’re focused on this and how seriously we are taking this, I am not going to say anything further lest I upset the efforts we are undertaking on this issue.
Lots of whispers, back door negotiations and closed court hearings smack of something big on the horizon.
@David
That’s a choice, but so is advocating to replace Oslo with an agreement which includes, wait for it, another terrorist. The very reason why Oslo led to blood filled streets and wave after wave of terror is that it pretended that Israel was negotiating with someone interested in peace when it was always clear that Arafat, and Mazen after him, have never had any interest in peace. Now you are advocating that we should switch terrorists in order to make peace, only this time, the new partner in peace would be none other than someone who already has a peace treaty with Israel and has violated it viciously, leading to war and funding terror cells within Israel.
Who cares what the Saudi’s** want. The only thing that should matter is what we want, and that should not include a new terrorist controlled enclave on Israel’s side of the Jordan to add to the old terrorist controlled enclave on Jordan’s side of the Jordan, which is what you are in support of doing. So instead of advocating for regime change in Jordan, you are advocating for regime change in the PA, only the party with whom you would now partner with all the objectionable hallmarks which should have disallowed the previous leadership, ie Arafat and Mazen.
Better that we find a new neighbor in Jordan, one who is sympathetic to Israel’s existence rather than supporting the party now residing in Jordan who is actively committed towards Israel’s destruction, irregardless of the ’94 agreement which should require that he remove himself from power. Certainly, if we are not to interfere in changing Jordan’s leadership, it is still no reason to expand his treachery in any way to the near side of the existing boundary.
**I still reject your notion that the Saudi’s are actually supporting this plan as being anything more than mere conjecture, but let us ignore this for the moment.
@Singer
The Axios statement says:
Emphasize mine. This I can believe though I am concerned that it goes on to say:
After all, Min Smoltrich is responsible for Area C and Min Ben Gvir is responsible for internal security.
Be that as it may, talking with Abbas about “deescalating tensions is a far cry from talking about the Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine The first doesn’t suggest the second at all.
It is immaterial that neither Netanyahu not Abbas have “rejected the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan solution”. Why should they? It is just a solution put forward by a Saudi author and friend of MBS. Until such time as MBS takes ownership of the solution, there is nothing to reject or pursue particularly with Abbas who is soon to retire or die.
I make nothing of your comment about Hanegbi. It is irrelevant to the discussion.
Yet you write:
You don’t even know if they did talk about the the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan solution at all, yet you say Netanyahu “needs t confirm to the Court” etc. Why does he need to confirm it to the court even if they talked about “other solutions”.
I might add that it is a leapfrog to say that talking about reducing tensions is tantamount to discussing ultimate solutions whatever they may be. And why with Abbas.
Your title says “Khan al-Amar showdown threatens Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine “ What is your basis for this at all. You have no justification for making this statement. I grant you it was in the title only but titles are often misleading.
Again, you have absolutely no evidence that they talked about the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan solution not that “KIahn al-Amar” threatens it.
#Ted
Would appreciate your response to my comments posted on: MAY 4, 2023 AT 10:43 AM
#peloni1986
I have never believed in calling for regime change – as Ted and Zahran have been doing for years. Israel has to deal with whoever rules Jordan. That happens to be the Hashemites and they have ruled there for over 100 years. They have been appointed to rule the Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine under the 2022 Saudi-based Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine solution – not the PLO or Hamas.
#Edgar G
Calm down old fruit. My post should have read:
“You state:
When are Netanyahu and Gantz going to suffer this fate since both endorsed the Trump Plan which called for an independent Palestinian State in 60% of Judea and Samaria between Israel and Jordan?”
Could you please answer the question I have posed to you?
Hi, Sebastien. My ancestors lived in Manhattan before Pieter Stuyvesant. The place has changed a bit since then.
MAGA, Baby!
https://thehashtag.us/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/map2.png
BTW, even the above map greatly exaggerates the “blue”. Here’s the map of a typical “blue” county in California:
https://i2.wp.com/www.chicoer.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/REDBLUE-01.jpg?fit=780%2C9999px&ssl=1
DAVID-
I AM surprised at you, a well known lawyer and activist with an unbalanced obsession, actually adding a tissue of falsehoods to my quote, which are completely untrue in that they were never part of my quote, and were far from my thinking.
You quote 2 lines of my post correctly (an easy task) and then add 3 lines about Netanyahu and Gantz whom I never once thought or nor mentioned, (an easier task–for YOU).
A “lawyer” or a “liar”…. for me this is an easy choice with the evidence highlighted in front of my eyes/
Yes David, I’m MORE than surprised that you would stoop so low
*** ***** ******** ****** *** *** ***** **** ******
AND…lest we forget, The Trump Plan included a time limit of 4 years for the PA to do its stuff failing which, Israel had the choice to take over ALL of YESHA. Ab\nd the PA had already refuse to even consider the Plan,
You always seem to leave out the very important “small print’, and include imaginary quotes, meetings and actions.
Some imagination. You should be working for Disney.
@David a) It is impossible to disprove a negative, They haven’t denied that the earth is flat either for the obvious reason that none of them think it worthy of consideration or discussion in the first place. *
b) PA and Israeli representatives normally meet about various things.
—
* I sympathize with your predicament since as a life-long citizen of the island of Manhattan which I have never left except for short periods and even then, rarely very far, I do know, for a fact, that my world is flat but, unlike you, I would never engage in sharp words about this or try to augment it into a major issue when the powers that be would diminish this into a minor one, because I know that my pitch will fall on deaf ears. But, oh well, nobody’s perfect.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/View_of_the_World_from_9th_Avenue
What do you think of the plan to sell Long Island to the Hashemites?
Why do you suppose they haven’t mentioned it? Top Secret? Could the fact that I just made it up be a factor? I mean, it’s in print! Right here. In black and white, though it has to be digitized to be seen, true. Funny, it doesn’t look digitized.
😀
You again ignore the point I have raised. It is neither about Israel nor about Bibi we are speaking. We are speaking about the Hashemite Terrorist Abdullah and your desired role of making him a partner in peace over Area A while he has so egregiously betrayed his commitment to keep the peace as the obliged partner in peace with Israel from within the borders of Jordan. The question I raised for you, which you have failed once more to address is simply why? Why would you advocate for his role in bartering for peace on this side of the Jordan when he has failed to maintain it as a partner in peace on the far side of the Jordan? Why do you persist on supporting in such a role a terrorist with fresh blood on his hands, who has raised unprovoked wars against Israel in just the past two years, and has been caught smuggling money and arms as the means by which to continue this murder spree against the innocents of Israel? By doing so you would stabilize him in his position of domination over his people, and promulgate his stature in the region as a proper role model for other leaders, while providing him the means to extend his assaults against the Israeli people? Just answer why you would support Abdullah in this role.
Asking why any Israeli statesman would do this is a separate question – and the answer seems obvious enough that they wouldn’t – but I am not asking you about Israel. So answer the question I asked, if you would…I believe it is a fair question to ask, and given your constancy of support for this ever increasingly bold Hashemite terrorist, it would seem to be an important one for you to answer.
#peloni1986
You state:
You are obviously unaware that Netanyahu has made it clear that Israel must retain full security control over all territory west of the Jordan River in any peace agreement. Netanyahu expressed it very concisely when he said that Israel was not going to commit suicide for an obituary in the New York Times.
If Netanyahu is not satisfied with the security arrangements – there will be no Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine created.
#Edgar G
You state: ”..
#Ted
Thanks for correcting the omission. However you should have deleted the sentence immediately following it. Please do so.
My humble opinion was based on this story in Axios:
Furthermore I referred to the
not just the Hahsemite Kingdom of Palestine only.
My opinion was based on information freely available and was not misleading.
I would appreciate your withdrawing your comment that my expressed opinion was misleading.
As I have repeated many times over neither Netanyahu nor Abbas has rejected the Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine solution since its publication almost 11 months ago. What do you think their silence signals given there are secret back channel negotiations taking place?
What do you make of the fact that Tzachi Hanegbi – the Israeli interlocutor in the secret negotiations with the PLO – turned up at the High Court of Justice on May 1 in the Khan Al Ahmar case and that the court was closed to the public?
DAVID SINGER-
No David I don’t know how to document-(ize) an Internet item. My many talents do not include include computer skills. But T.G. lots f common sense and reasoning ability.
I suggest that the “secret” meetings between Israel and the PA are the usual, about how to curb the present increase in Arab terrorism which has been found to be under PA auspices, so as to avoid the IDF having to move in and do the job. This is a Netanyahu priority, he keeps the PA running, but they have to reciprocate and be useful.
How secret are those “secret meetings” which you indicate are on Youtube, and Far off Australia is well in the know. (yes, I know, the electronic Age)
Your pet mishugas David, will never fly, no Israeli who wants to stay in Israel and not be hounded out or tarred and feathered, will ever give the mamzerim you support a single inch of the Land. Nationalism is far too strong for you.
Any talk about “civil war” over the reform of the Justice system pales beside the furore that would be caused if you lived in Israel. You wouldn’t be here long, I know that.
Your mishugas is like the “Spruce Goose” attempting to lift off the ground carrying 1000 tons of lead cargo.. If it ever did G-D Forbid it would nose-dive straight down., and that would be its end.
But you, before this abberation, used to write excellent articles and I looked forward to reading them. Used to, but now… you seem “possessed by a dybbuk”.
@David
I appreciate your limited response, but you limited your response by ignoring the very crux of the issue:
How can you hope for the Hashemites to fulfill their role as a peace partner with a greater role in Isreal’s security, ie with control of the territory in Area A, when we can’t trust this dodgy bugger while his power is limited to the far end of the Jordan River. He used a diplomatic envoy to smuggle arms and bullion into lands where Israel controls the security so the Pals could continue to kill more Jews. And yet still you consider this fake king, who is a real terrorist, as some form of hopeful peace partner? You would expand his power over the terrorist Pals, increase his dominion into Israel and, elevate his stature in the region, even as he is implementing the slaughter of our people. Explain this, if you would.
I am quite sincere in my request for an answer to the above querry, as it sounds very much like the question of how many times do you beat your wife, but more accurately for Abdullah, we should inquire as to how many dead Jews have you arranged to be slaughtered by diplomatic packages such as were being carried by Imad al-Adwan on your behalf and instruction.
Again, this may sound like some rhetorical question, but I would be much obliged if you can clear the air as to what your answer on this might be.
The article David Singer cited says nothing about the Shihabi-Singer proposal or Jordan. It just says un-named senior aides of Bibi and Abbas met to discuss de-escalating “tensions”in the West Bank. Each side voiced its complaints and the meeting came to the usual impasse. It doesn’t even mention Khan al-Amar.
(Is this even news?)
https://www.axios.com/2023/02/20/israelis-palestinians-secret-talks-west-bank
@DAVID
Sorry for the omission. It’s now corrected.
I couldn’t understand how you could base an article on a hypothetical, “if true”.
Your article presumed it was true yet you had no evidence it was true. For that reason I thought the article was misleading. You suggested that the Hashemite Kingdom was in play when you admitted their was no evidence that it was in play. So there is no evidence it is in play.
Peloni made a different point in his comment. Given the role of the king in promoting terrorism in Israel why do you persist in pushing this plan?
#Ted
You left out the first paragraph of my article:
Could you please make the necessary connection.
Not sure what you mean by alleging I was misleading in my article. Please elaborate.
#Edgar G
Don’t you know how to make a copy of an electronic document?
You can read about the secret negotiations being conducted between Israel and the PLO at: https://www.axios.com/2023/02/20/israelis-palestinians-secret-talks-west-bank
#peloni1986
Whilst King Abdullah, Mahmoud Abbas, Ismail Haniyeh, Crown Prince Mohammed Bin Salman and Bibi all maintain their silence and utter not one word rejecting the Hashemite Kingdom of Palestine solution – I will continue to write about it as the best solution yet presented to end 100 years of conflict between Arabs and Jews.
Mirib-
They should be shipped back to Area A, from where they came. It is totally ridiculous to spend 80 billions in setting up a new, town including clinics etc for these illegal interlopers Whoever did it should be charged and jailed.
My complaint is that, since the “document” Singer raves about is electronic, it can’t even be used as wipe-up paper. As for the Netanyahu official’s secret meeting…yes, i believe this, I also am sure that Martians landed erev Pesach and taking over our world.
Originally there were 5 who sneaked in and lived in the EU prefab. Now 200…Magic. No one yet can say HOW the low-beds which are NEEDED to transport pre-fabs, get through customs strangely unseen, and unnoticed all the way to the site…??
@David
So you still persist in your dream of Israel negotiating with the Hashemites to take on the role of leading the Pals, even as these brigands have so freshly been caught with their hand in the cookie jar as a state sponsor of Pal terror against Israel? If ever there existed any support for such an undertaking, which their has been no indication but rather the opposite, there would be no possibility of continuing such an illogical, radical, and unwise undertaking as you have fantasized about for some time now. With all due respect, it is madness to suggest that there is any foundation for the unspoken plan for which you hold so close an affection. Of course, forlorn hopes will springs eternal, but in what rational moment might you want to hand such state sponsors of terror as the Hashemites a greater position by which to make war on the Jewish Homeland. Your faithfulness to this delusion of peace does seem inconsistent with all reason.
More detail about the case can be found here, without the imaginative fantasies indicated by Singer:
Following Stormy Debate, High Court Again Postpones Its Khan Al Ahmar Ruling
The hearing which will be held to decide on the delay will be held behind closed doors. Regavim, who is the party which originally brought this case back in 2009, raised a particular request. Since this case has political, international, and security concerns, and since the hearing for this delay, which they oppose, is to be held outside the earshot of the public, Regavim has requested that it be released as to whether the basis of delay is due to political concerns, international concerns, or security concerns. They noted that if the delayed implementation of this , which the govt claims they do not oppose, is related to the influence of foreign govts, this at least should be revealed to the public.
They rejected 2 new sites!?
Send in the IDF & drag them off like they did our citizens from Gaza and their community hill settlement.