US Secretary of State John Kerry warned of a return to Palestinian violence and Israel’s isolation if the faltering peace talks between Israel and the Palestinians ultimately fail. This is a typical leftist Pavlovian response to the impasse in Israeli-Palestinian negotiations that is now over a decade old. Such thinking primarily reflects the frustration that the optimistic evaluations that the conflict can be ended quickly remain unfulfilled. Unfortunately, Kerry’s remarks tell the Palestinians to hold on to their maximalist positions. This reflects an inability to grasp the intricacies of protracted intractable ethnic conflict and a misguided American policy.
There is definitely a possibility that the Palestinians, in particular the radical forces, will recur to violence. In reality these forces try to kill Israelis all the time, and a dearth of terrorist attacks in recent years can only be attributed to the work of the Israeli security forces. Yet the likelihood of massive organized violence by the Palestinian Authority (PA) is small. Rocking the boat endangers too many vested interests of the Palestinian ruling class. The PA leadership has probably registered the heavy price paid by the Palestinians during their terrorist campaign at the beginning of the twenty-first century, as a result of Israeli countermeasures.
Moreover, even if the Palestinians miscalculate once again and go for a “third Intifada,” Israel’s capability to contain terrorism and other modes of civilian struggle is high. The Israeli army can be trusted to meet all challenges successfully. Most important, a large majority of Israelis believe that the Palestinian demands, such as Jerusalem and the “Right of Return,” are the real obstacles to peace. This large consensus about Palestinian intransigence allows for significant social mobilization and resilience in protracted conflict. Israelis will go once more to war with a feeling of “Ein Breira” (no choice) and are likely to win that engagement as well.
Large parts of the hypocritical world may indeed see Israel as the culprit for the failure of the negotiations and for a new round of Israeli-Palestinian violence. But such negative attitudes do not necessarily lead to international isolation. Public statements and the voting record of states at the UN – an ineffective, morally bankrupt organization – are not indicative of the true nature of interstate relations.
National interests dictate state actions, and in most cases bilateral relations with Israel are hardly affected by the ups and downs in the peace talks with the Palestinians. For example, the rising powers India and China have expanded their bilateral ties with Jerusalem because it is in their interest to engage a successful state such as Israel. Nowadays, when the Iranian threat dominates the region, Arab Sunni states such as Egypt, Jordan, and Saudi Arabia, who are exasperated with American behavior, are in the same strategic boat as Israel. Generally, the Middle East – especially today, while in the throes of a colossal political, social, and economic crisis – is hardly paying attention to the Palestinian issue. In the Caucasus and in Central Asia, Muslim Azerbaijan, Kazakhstan, and Uzbekistan are friendly to Israel.
Moreover, isolation of Israel is unlikely because of the large existing reservoirs of support for Israel in many quarters. Canada and Australia are ruled by governments most responsive to Israeli concerns. Even in Western Europe, concerns about Muslim immigration and foreign aid place the Palestinians in a problematic spot. Above all, two-thirds of Americans have consistently favored Israel over the past two decades, which translates into Congressional support. The US is Israel’s most important ally and even the Obama administration has maintained the strong support and cooperation in the military sphere.
But the prism of the Obama administration on the Middle East and global affairs is fundamentally flawed. An American foreign policy that supports the Muslim Brotherhood, estranges its traditional Arab allies such as Egypt and Saudi Arabia, allows Iran to get closer to the bomb, sees in Turkey’s Erdo?an a great friend of the West, and insists that the Israeli-Palestinian conflict can be ended in nine months is dangerous and does more damage that good. Similar complaints about poor US political judgment are abundantly voiced by America’s friends in Asian and Eastern European capitals.
It is the enemies of the US who rejoice in President Barack Obama’s foreign policy, and who relish in America’s perceived decline in world affairs.
Ironically, at this historic juncture, even an isolationist America would be a better alternative for those that want the good guys to win. Therefore, dear President Obama, please do us a favor: save some money and keep Kerry at home.
Prof. Efraim Inbar, director of the Begin-Sadat Center for Strategic Studies, is a professor of political studies at Bar-Ilan University and a fellow at the Middle East Forum.
BESA Center Perspectives Papers are published through the generosity of the Greg Rosshandler Family
@ yamit82:
Your sure are “wolf bite” tonight [you time]. Kerry is just Obama’s “wolf bait” or” ghoat”. Obama uses Kerry [a la Syria] and Kerry does’nt have the stones [ or in Kerry’s case marbles] to resign.
honeybee Said:
Actually dear I just finished off a half bottle of vodka with beef sticks (cabanas) feeling quite mellow at the moment.
I’ll take a rain-check. 😉
Netanyahu Reprimands Ariel for New Construction
PM Netanyahu directs Housing Minister Uri Ariel to reconsider all new plans for construction in Judea, Samaria and Jerusalem.
A statement from the Prime Minister’s Office said that Netanyahu directed Minister Uri Ariel to reconsider all of the steps for evaluating planning potential that he distributed without any advance coordination.
The Prime Minister told Minister Ariel, according to the statement, “This step does not contribute to settlement. On the contrary, there is damage here for settlement. This is a meaningless step – legally and in practice – and an action that creates an unnecessary confrontation with the international community at a time when we are making an effort to persuade elements in the international community to reach a better deal with Iran.
Minister Ariel told Prime Minister Netanyahu that he accedes to his request to reconsider all publications that were issued today regarding the evaluation of planning potential and said that in any case the issue was the potential for planning and not any sort of official stage.
Arutz Sheva has found out that Netanyahu’s actions came as a result of complaints by extreme leftist organizations over Israel’s latest construction plans.
@ yamit82:
I have toast and vodka/burbon,any way you prefere, Darlin
honeybee Said:
With BB leading the pack here we are as good as chopped Liver with lots of schmaltz.
When the Talks Fail Again
Dr. Mordechai Nisan
The present and culminating political dead-end may hopefully evoke more reasonable thinking.
A New Peace Paradigm
When the talks fail, and no Israeli-Palestinian diplomatic breakthrough occurs, we should reflect on the deep-seated religious animosity and political incompatibility between Jews and Arabs.
@ yamit82:
Chopped Liver??????????
@ bernard ross:
Abbas: Cancel Building or Peace Talks Over
Abbas delivers ultimatum: cancel 20,000 new Judea Samaria home tenders or else peace talks over. US criticizes buildings as ‘illegitimate.’
By Ari Yashar
Stupid BB walked into the trap set by Obama/Kerry and Abbas. Or clever BB knew the outcome when he willing accepted negotiations and can now blame American duplicity for the freeze?
Election fraud now proven
CuriousAmerican Said:
I keep hoping you would not chat ludicrous rubbish so I would not have to point out the garbage. The arabs and americans were completely informed and aware that Israel would continue to build in areas it will not relinquish. All the strutting and profiling by Kerry and abbas is fake, a drama, a pretense, just like your statements. Abbas was aware but could not publicely accept it so Kerry gave him a letter that BB would not agree to, All prior to the start of the show. They are playing to their constituents to pretend that there is a conflict going on. Haven’t you read any of the articles regarding this.
CuriousAmerican Said:
Jews are referred to in the Bible as a mamlekhet kohanim ve’goy kadosh, a kingdom of kohanim and a holy people (Exodus 19:6).
Jews still protect and venerate our hereditary priests and afford them several functions even today. He delivers the priestly blessing in the synagogue on holidays in the Diaspora and daily in Israel; and he officiates as the representative of the Temple in the Redemption of the First-Born at the ceremony thirty days after the birth of the first-born male.
The kohen: is forbidden any contact with the dead, except for his own immediate family and the abandoned dead; he is not permitted to marry a divorcee. The kohen’s integrity sprang from his purity of birth, belief, and action. His Torah was no esoteric lore of cosmic magic; he dealt with laws and morality and taught them to the community at large.
Divorcee (Ge’rushah) The kohen may not marry a divorcee, regardless of the cause of the divorce, the circumstances, or the duration of the previous marriage. If a Jewish divorce was issued for any reason, even though the couple never lived together as man and wife, she may not be married to the kohen. This is true even if a divorce was not biblically necessary, but was required by the Rabbis to prevent public misconception. The issuance of a divorce always precludes marriage to a kohen. While it is a virtue for an Israelite to remarry the wife he divorced (if she had not married another man in the meantime), the kohen may not even remarry his own wife.
If the kohen marries a divorcee despite the restrictions, he has violated the law and is under constant obligation to terminate the marriage even though it is technically valid. Any offspring of the marriage are (chalal), of defective kohen status. If the child is a girl, she is not permitted to marry a kohen; if it is a boy, he is prohibited from functioning as a kohen. The kohen’s wife becomes a chalalah as well. If he married a divorcee who was already pregnant, her child is not a chalal, regardless of who the father was. Since she was not married at the time, the child was not conceived in sin (lo ba mi-tipat aveirah).
Stupid christian!!!!!!
Comment to curious in moderation.
CuriousAmerican Said:
Feiglin is not my rabbi nor my authority. All he said is that Jewish law should not be imposed forcefully on non observant Jews. Not because it shouldn’t but in order to make his polical ambitions more PC in the likud and in the eyes of the secular anti Jewish media.Read his manifesto:
Jewish Orientation for the State of Israel
The actualization of the vision of redemption requires a process of renewal and spiritual/cultural creativity on a national scale. Consequently, Manhigut Yehudit defines its operative goal with an interim objective: To transform the State of Israel into a Jewish State – not only in name, but in its character and content. The State of Israel should be inspired by the Torah of Israel and illuminated by the vision of redemption. As a starting point, Manhigut Yehudit accepts the formal and legal framework of the State of Israel as it exists today. The movement sees the State of Israel as the state of the entire Jewish nation, including those Jews who still reside in the Diaspora.
Initiative and Responsibility
Manhigut Yehudit’s main challenge is to develop belief based consciousness. It strives for renewal, creativity and the development of a Jewish alternative in every facet of life: cultural, spiritual, ideological and political. Initiative, shouldering of historic responsibility, establishing national goals and challenges and honestly striving to achieve them are the cornerstones of the Manhigut Yehudit experience and activities.
8. Faith, Prayer and Anticipation
The renewed connection between Israel’s national consciousness and the G-d of Israel is a prerequisite for the continued life of the Nation of Israel in its land. The success of human initiative is impossible without prayer and anticipation of Heaven’s blessing for our human efforts.
Jewish Leadership
Feiglin believes that imposition by force of law and coercion would trigger a civil war today, so he plans to accomplish theocracy in stages based on eventual national acceptance of halacha (Jewish Law).
Only an idiot like you sees and reads and quotes what he wants to see and understands what his limited brain allows.CuriousAmerican Said:
Homeland in a political sense is a semantic distinction without a difference from a political state and that’s how it was meant and that’s how everyone except you understood it to mean even the Arabs.
A country cannot have different laws for different folk. Just as Hebrew became the language of the State and the Jewish festival calender recogized as national holidays personal civil and religious functions like births, marriages,divorces and burial were standardized under jewish law in placed under the jurisdiction of the rabbinate. By the way that was not a Ben Gurion invention but a British one. Ben Gurion just adopted the British model for the state & it was mostly a seamless transition.
Judaism is a practical religion for individual people. It has no requirements or conditions that make normal life impossible or cannot be fulfilled in reality. Minute regulation developed only in Levitical and especially in late rabbinic interpretation; the law of the Torah is not oppressive. In the end, Judaism is the law; all events in Tanach only demonstrate validity of the law. Any other view makes Judaism a pagan religion whose tribal deity favors one ethnic group above others. Jews are chosen to observe the law, and remain chosen insofar as they are expected to observe it. Unlike sectarian radicalism, Judaism is not maximalist. The world is not divided between good and evil. According to Talmudic tradition, it is enough for men to be one-thousandth good and enter the heavenly realm. The commandments do not require absolute obedience in the sense that transgression does not preclude righteousness. The more a man keeps, the better, the easier is the Way. Transgression is cause for repentance, aimed at not repeating the mistake.
Judaism, unlike other religions, is orthopraxy, a way of deeds. A christian can cross himself before or after a murder; his only maxim, “you should love your neighbor” is sufficiently flexible – perhaps he even murdered a Jew out of love to yeshu. Jews have clear commandments, and minimally religious Jew cannot murder. In family life, good deeds are more important than cheerful repetition of “I love you”; similarly in religion.
Observing the Judaic ethics is the all-important end; the path matters, not goals like salvation or nirvana. Jews are taught to enjoy the process of life, made comfortable by their ethics, not strive for otherworldly aims.
So you admit I am correct …that you hate Jews and Judaism.
CuriousAmerican Said:
Hooey or honey???????????
CuriousAmerican Said:
Darlin,Yamit may alot of things,but he ain’t nobdies fool. Well maybe he is mine,but cause of his good taste in ladies.
You are a fool!
I recommend what Moshe Feiglin recommends. A separation of religion and state.
I said Israel should be defined as a homeland of the Jewish people (which is how San Remo defined it)
It was Ben Gurion who set up the Rabbinate State connection.
Are you in favor of clergy with state power? Telling you who you can marry?! Even within Judaism. For ex: A Cohen cannot marry a Jewish woman with a divorced ancestor.
If you admit that your foolish posts are nauseating, I agree.
Do you make this up as go along; or were you fed this line of hooey?
Steal souls? Are you insane?
yamit82 Said:
I don’t believe this guy is a Christian.
CuriousAmerican Said:
Why do you think Israel should be from the Jordan to the Meditteranean? What is your interest in this?
@ CuriousAmerican:
I can give a further explanation of women Mr Doh Doh. As a woman who is neither a doormat or feminist obviously you do not understand. Of the 55 prophets 7 were women. Men generally did the praying to free up the women from this daunting task – however there were some women prayer warriors in Torah. And L-rd help you when that happens!!
CuriousAmerican Said:
Judaism has no separation of synagogue and state.. if you are so concerned with accretions picked up by the Jews in the last 2000 years of exile then why are you against the form of governments established in Judea for over 1000 years: (Theocracy and Monarchy)? Judaism is not democratic a Greek Pagan concept and today a christian Pagan system. Nothing Jewish there!!! Judaism is not a tolerant religion. We believe we hold the only truth around. You want biblical standards and norms fine we will first burn down every church and mosque in Israel and boot your sorry asses out of our Jewish country although according to Jewish biblical law you would be executed were you here.
Of course you are against religious Jews. You can’t convert them and they can take every argument you can make in support of your pagan beliefs and shove up you rear ends. While I am not personally enamored with dress codes of some Jews and some customs I respect them. Those funny looking Jews stood tall and went to the christian stake and gallows rather than convert to your paganist god on a stick man-god. The secular Jews mostly succumbed to christian pressures. Nobody dies or sacrifices oneself for ethnicity or culture. If Jews still exist it is because of the ancestors of those funny looking Jews and their strange habits. There is logic in your disdain for them. They are your main impediment and threat, they will never assimilate and you will never convert them, they are the holders and the guardians of Jewish Truth and knowledge. For that reason alone I support them and because they are an ANATHEMA to you christian fundamentalists and evangelicals.
Kippa? What the hell do you care what Jews wear or don’t wear on their heads? What do you care whether there is separation on men and women in our synagogues? It’s our business not yours. According to the Torah violation of the prohibitions of Shabbat would carry a sentence of death.
Show me where in the Torah what work is, How does one marry according to the Torah? How does one divorce according to the text of the Torah? How does one convert to Judaism according to the Text of the Torah? The torah leaves a lot up to us to interpret. How does one read Hebrew scripture without vowels? Many words are spelled the same but with different meanings like chelev or chalav. Fat or milk? For the Laws of Kashrut the meaning is critical for observance. These are a few among thousands of other examples.
Stupid christians who don’t know Hebrew don’t understand our traditions, and reject the validity of our oral laws and Rabbinic authority have Nothing to say to us or to teach us. Butt out of our business, fool.
yamit82 Said:
Kerry is doing to Israel.what the democrates wish to do in Texas and have done California, that is flood the area with illegal immigrants and change the demographics.
@ CuriousAmerican:
The hyper gender segregation seen in some Orthodox community (forbidding men to listen to women singing) is not in the Torah.
I support a homeland for the Jewish people, based on Jewish ethnicity; with a separation of state and religion. Similar to what Moshe Feiglin advocates.
I think Jews should remain a majority.
I think the Palestinian Arab young should be paid to leave by Jews, by Arab states (if you can get them to pay).
I am Christian, and I think Israel should be from the Jordan to the Mediterreanean.
I do not support the TSS
I think Israel should pay young Palestinians to leave.
The Judaism of the Bible did not include black hatted Hasidim. (Who are personally nice people ) A lot of tradition was added in the diaspora which is not found in the bible. A lot of rules now enforced stem from recent innovations. The Metzizah p’buh is not in the bible but was added around 600 AD.
The kippot is not in the bible but was added later.
The hyper gender segregation seen in some Orthodox community (forbidding men to listen to women singing) is not in the Torah.
The Israeli gov’t has empowered Orthodox interpretations to the exclusion of Reformed and Conservative Judaism.
This is theocratic.
The Judaism which gave light to the world was different than the Judaism of today in some ways.
Agree. But I was wondering what Curious American’s plan is and why? As I said, I want to hear what shapes his/her vision as he is obviously not a Christian Zionist. Christian supporters who are not Zionists usually support the two state solution.
@ loonwatchexposed:
20% minority is too large for a small country like Israel.
35-40% Arabs along with our radical anti Jewish left and some 400,000 non Jewish Slavs imported into Israel to counter the growing religious and Nationalist secular right could form an anti Jewish coalition in the future thereby by democratic means wrest the country away from the Jewish Zionist majority, especially if they are not politically united.
Since The North (Galilee) already has an Arab majority, they can be expected to demand autonomy. The most radical elements from the West Bank and Gaza will radicalize the Young of Israeli Arabs even more than they are today. Annexation means we will be responsible for the whole population of Arabs already with 40% unemployment. They will break us economically and milk our already overtaxed welfare system and overtaxed productive Israeli taxpayer. We will never be able to assimilate them and the free movement of those Arabs will add to influx of Arabs into our mostly Jewish communities and neighborhoods with all the obvious negativity besides the expected rise in urban crime. Those who propose such idiocy don’t know what they are unleashing and I advise them to think it through beyond raw political demographics and think about the social and economic disaster that would be unleashed.
Ted Belman Said:
If you support negotiations, you must have an idea as to what you would like to see as a consequence of them. Realizing that negotiations are over the heritage of the Jewish people and not just some pieces of nondescript real estate, what can the Arabs offer us that is worth the ceding of our patrimony to not only gentiles but gentile enemies?
A solid principle I might suggest to any Jew and Israeli who might be open to such a “Deal” is this: If you believe the Arabs then be flexible and find a formula they can agree to even if it costs us more than what we have been willing to give up till now.
But if you do not believe them Give them nothing and even retrieve what has been given away to them till now.
Ted Belman Said:
Thanks Ted, coming from you that makes sense, as you do support a Jewish state? I don’t mean a theocracy. I mean a state where Jews are not a minority so that they can be elbowed out, or there is civil war. An Arab majority would try to oust us out by democratic means. If annexation takes place the world will expect us to give equal rights to the refugees.
In any case, my question was addressed to Curious American, cuz if he is not a Zionist nor supports a Jewish Israel then why does he want annexation?
However, the right to ‘say no’ should be agreed to beforehand. You don’t want a situation where we annex, and then the world expects us to take in the refugees, because a non Jewish majority in a democracy would be the end of Israel.
CuriousAmerican Said:
A Jewish state doesn’t mean a theocracy. It means Israel as it is now, with a Jewish majority in demographics.
If you’re not a Christian Zionist then I am curious to know what your interest is in Israel annexing J and S, since you do not support a Jewish state. The Chrisitan supporters who are not Zionist don’t like the idea of a greater Israel with a non Jewish majority. They support the two state solution with the refugees going to the new state of Palestine.
But you support anexation, but no Jewish state. May I ask why?
@ CuriousAmerican:
Now you have done it! Finally blurted out what I have always known and voiced ad-nausea. You are a classical Jew hater who hates Judaism and Jews but support Israel in some sense due to your cockamamie eschatology and hopes Jews are as stupid as you believe them to be, and to help you earn some easy money and steal some souls as a bonus.
You do realize that demographically in 15-20 years according to current trends and without a massive influx of immigration to Israel those orthodox religious Jews will be in the majority. Not sure those like you will be allowed into our Jewish country. 😉
Comments blocked by spammer pls retrieve and post!!!
CuriousAmerican Said:
Since the establishment of limited Palis self-rule in the West Bank and Gaza Strip in the mid-1990s, the U.S. government has committed over $4 billion in bilateral assistance to the Palis, who are among the world’s largest per capita recipients of international foreign aid. From FY2008 to the present, annual U.S. bilateral assistance to the West Bank and Gaza Strip has averaged over $600 million, including annual averages of over $200 million in direct budgetary assistance and over $100 million in non-lethal security assistance for the PA in the West Bank. Additionally, the United States is the largest single-state donor to the U.N. Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees in the Near East (UNRWA). However, whether UNRWA’s role is beneficial remains a polarizing question, particularly with respect to its presence in Hamascontrolled Gaza.
During the final year of President George W. Bush’s Administration, President Bush issued waivers providing $300 million in direct budgetary assistance to the PA. President Barack Obama has followed the precedent Bush established by authorizing a total of $550 million in direct budgetary assistance during his first two years in office, as follows:
In July 2009, $200 million in ESF money were transferred to the PA in the wake of a presidential waiver issued by President Obama.
In November 2009, $75 million in budgetary assistance were provided to the PA under the July presidential waiver as an advance on FY2010 ESF funds, pursuant to a continuing resolution (later appropriated pursuant to P.L. 111-117).
In April 2010, another $75 million in budgetary assistance from the ESF account were provided to the PA via presidential waiver.
In November 2010, $150 million in budgetary assistance were provided to the PA via presidential waiver as an advance on FY2011 ESF funds, pursuant to the Continuing Appropriations Act, 2011 (P.L. 111-242).
In August 2011, $50 million in budgetary assistance from the ESF account were provided via presidential waiver.
READ FULL REPORT: CRS Report for Congress
Prepared for Members and Committees of Congress
U.S. Foreign Aid to the Palestinians
Jim Zanotti
Specialist in Middle Eastern Affairs
April 4, 2012
Seems to me America could well divert her annual payment to support your project. Lobby for it if your are serious???? 🙂
CuriousAmerican Said:
Since the establishment of limited Palis self-rule in the West Bank and Gaza Strip in the mid-1990s, the U.S. government has committed over $4 billion in bilateral assistance to the Palis, who are among the world’s largest per capita recipients of international foreign aid. From FY2008 to the present, annual U.S. bilateral assistance to the West Bank and Gaza Strip has averaged over $600 million, including annual averages of over $200 million in direct budgetary assistance and over $100 million in non-lethal security assistance for the PA in the West Bank. Additionally, the United States is the largest single-state donor to the U.N. Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees in the Near East (UNRWA). However, whether UNRWA’s role is beneficial remains a polarizing question, particularly with respect to its presence in Hamascontrolled Gaza.
During the final year of President George W. Bush’s Administration, President Bush issued waivers providing $300 million in direct budgetary assistance to the PA. President Barack Obama has followed the precedent Bush established by authorizing a total of $550 million in direct budgetary assistance during his first two years in office, as follows:
In July 2009, $200 million in ESF money were transferred to the PA in the wake of a presidential waiver issued by President Obama.
In November 2009, $75 million in budgetary assistance were provided to the PA under the July presidential waiver as an advance on FY2010 ESF funds, pursuant to a continuing resolution (later appropriated pursuant to P.L. 111-117).
In April 2010, another $75 million in budgetary assistance from the ESF account were provided to the PA via presidential waiver.
In November 2010, $150 million in budgetary assistance were provided to the PA via presidential waiver as an advance on FY2011 ESF funds, pursuant to the Continuing Appropriations Act, 2011 (P.L. 111-242).
In August 2011, $50 million in budgetary assistance from the ESF account were provided via presidential waiver.
READ FULL REPORT: CRS Report for Congress
Prepared for Members and Committees of Congress
U.S. Foreign Aid to the Palestinians
Jim Zanotti
Specialist in Middle Eastern Affairs
April 4, 2012
Seems to me America could well divert her annual payment to support your project. Lobby for it if your are serious???? 🙂
The other possibility is already taking shape: Obama Invites 80,000 Muslim Immigrants Into the United States – Promises 100,000/Per Year for Next 5 Years
In addition the the above amt linked above now this: Importing Jihad: US will allow thousands of Syrian Refugees into the United States
CA said : “A Jewish state sounds like a theocratic rabbinic authoritarian structure.”
“ Yes, I am a Jew, and when your ancestors were brutal savages in an unknown island, mine were priests in the temple of Solomon” (Disraeli)
Indeed, while 4000 years ago, your ancestors were struggling with murders, thefts, adultery and slavery, mine had already a sovereign land and a kingdom governed by the most advanced and avant-gardist laws, including weekly rest.
The “theocratic structure” you are referring to is the one which brought the light to your world and which laid the cornerstone to the society you are living in by providing the stem laws and commandments for a rule of law.
@ CuriousAmerican:
further clarification please. What is a homeland for the Jewish people to you? Is it a mix of secular, conservative and orthodox Jews etc who’s religion is Judaism? I say religion as that is the only way gentiles can define Judaism – to us it is just a way of life with commandments and an outline from Hashem as how we are to live our lives.
CuriousAmerican Said:
Please go back and check on your own the facts that all along Israel has been serious in its negotiations with PA. You can find numerous facts that the PA has not been serious and has violated the terms of the agreements with Israel.Compared to PA what makes you to believe that Israel is not serious about the so called negotiations for peace?
loonwatchexposed Said:
Just say “no”.
CuriousAmerican Said:
Wrong. Just as sanctions against Iran can produce negotiations, building in J&S can induce the PA to cut a deal. If we stopped building they could wait 100 years. Only building will bring them to the table, that is if they want a deal.
I am sure everyone is tired of me saying the same old thing. Having said that I will say it again.
Continue to build communities and push those out who do not belong.
The Holy Land is yours.
Forget world opinion.
World opinion doesn’t have to fight terrorism every day.
Think about it, right now as disaster has struck the world Israelis and the IDF are out there providing aid and assistance as usual, the very best. As for the Arab world they are working on their next terrorist attack against Israel.
This the liberal left anti-Semite media won’t tell you.
I mean the WOMEN should be preferentially paid to leave.
A shortage of men will mean nothing since the Arabs practice polygamy. Shortage of women will slow down reproduction.
Dr. Martin Sherman, a conservative right-Wing Zionist has shown that 44% of young Palestinians in Judea and Samaria are willing to leave if assisted.
In you want J&S with as few Palestinians as possible then pay the willing to leave. Start with the women first. With no marriageable mates, a lot of the men may leave with smaller amounts of cash.
Israel’s chief problem is Judea and Samaria. Sadly, the Palestinians in Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, etc. are the problem of the Arab states.
I support a homeland of the Jewish people.
A Jewish state sounds like a theocratic rabbinic authoritarian structure. Balfour and San Remo said HOMELAND of the Jewish people. They did not set up a bureacratic rabbinical authority. Ben Gurion did that; and it is now being rolled back by the Knesset.
Those are my answers. They should be sufficient to your liking.
CuriousAmerican Said:
They can’t ‘cede’ Jerusalem, because they don’t have it. Why do you talk as if they do?
CuriousAmerican Said:
The women should be paid to leave and not the men? Or you mean both should be paid to leave I presume? What about if they refuse to leave?
I also presume that you mean if J and S is annexed that they should be paid to leave. What is your solution for the ‘right of return’ then? They would want to return too, so what is your solution for that problem? If they were all to return to a greater Israel it would mean the end of the Jewish state. Do you support a Jewish state?
You’re a Christian Zionist?
To make it clear what I said.
If I said, Israel is sticking to her guns and will not surrender Judea and Samaria, then you would all applaud.
But if Israel is sticking to her guns then she is not negotiating seriously. THAT IS ALL.
I am observing. NOT criticizing.
I did NOT say that Israel should NEGOTIATE seriously. I just said Israel is NOT negotiating seriously. THAT IS ALL.
I said that the money would be better spent paying Palestinian Women to leave.
Paying Palestinian women to leave IS NOT anti-Israel.
Having said that Palestinian Women SHOULD LEAVE, it is still obvious that building Jewish settlements indicates that Israel is NOT serious about negotiating.
THAT IS ALL I SAID.
I KNOW THE ARABS ARE WORSE, but Israel is still not serious about negotiating.
I did not say she should be serious. I just said Israel is NOT serious.
@ CuriousAmerican:
You can’t reason with an unreasoning animal. How MANY TIMES do you have to be told? After WWII it was the UN that decided that the Jews needed their homeland. Now, what they should have done is gone in there and got rid of the occupiers – either relocate or FINISH WWII so that we don’t ALL have to deal with it AGAIN in WWIII. They didn’t do that and instead threw the newborn Jewish nation to the wolves – you KNOW the history. We already KNOW that even if they were paid it would not solve the problem. We are gearing up for war – with Hashem being the guide.
I said pay the Palestinian women to leave, so obviously I hold to some categorical difference.
THAT BEING SAID: Israel cannot be serious about negotiating if it issues housing tenders.
I am NOT saying Israel is wrong. I am just saying Israel is not seriously negotiating.
But in the end, I suggested Palestinian, NOT Jewish, women be paid to leave using the money which is spent on these fruitless negotiations.
You are the one not getting it.
@ CuriousAmerican:
You still don’t get it CA. Don’t put us in the same category as the Muslims. that’s like comparing us to Hitlers children. What’s the matter with those Jews? Why can’t they just give a little more? We will stand up and fight….that’ the ONLY solution.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=XP40Bl24PE0
There is no peace process.
Neither side will give one inch.
If the Arabs were serious, they would talk about ceding Jerusalem.
If the Israelis were serious, they would not issue housing tenders while the negotiations are going on.
If the money spent on these ridiculous talks had been used to pay 40,000 Palestinian women – $100,000 each – for a move to Latin America, that would have lowered the Palestinian population – and lowered its ability to reproduce itself; and that would have been a REAL move to peace.