By Evelyn Gordon, Commentary
Israel marked the 10th anniversary of its unilateral pullout from Gaza this week with a rare consensus: The disengagement was a disaster. Even opposition leader and Labor Party chairman Isaac Herzog admitted that “from a security perspective, the disengagement was a mistake. While he still considers it “essential” demographically, he isn’t sure he would have voted for it had he known then what he knows now. And this is the man who, back in 2005,declared that, thanks to the disengagement, “for the first time in decades there is genuine hope” for “lasting peace.”
Equally remarkable was a poll of Israeli Jews earlier this month asking whether they supported or opposed the pullout at the time. An overwhelming majority of respondents – 59 percent – asserted that they had opposed it, while only 34 percent admitted to having supported it. That, of course, is far from the truth; polls at the time consistently showed solid pluralities or majorities favoring the disengagement, while only about a third of Israelis opposed it. But this revisionist history accurately reflects Israelis’ current view of the withdrawal: Many of those who once backed it are now convinced they must actually have opposed it, because they simply can’t imagine they would have supported any idea as disastrous as this one proved to be. And even among those still willing to admit they once supported it, almost one-fifth now regret doing so.
It’s not just the obvious fact that the Palestinians turned Gaza into a giant launch pad from which some 16,500 rockets and mortars have been fired at Israel over the past decade, whereas exactly zero have been fired from the Israeli-controlled West Bank over the same period. It’s not just that quitting Gaza has resulted in more Israeli soldiers being killed, and also more Palestinians, than occupying Gaza ever did. It’s not just that after Israel withdrew every last settler and soldier from Gaza, the world has sought to deny it the right to defend itself against the ensuing rocket attacks by greeting every military operation with escalating condemnation, accusations of war crimes, and attempts to prosecute it in the International Criminal Court. It’s not just that the withdrawal ended up worsening global anti-Semitism, since every military operation in Gaza has served as an excuse for a massive upsurge in anti-Semitic attacks worldwide. It’s not just that Israel received zero diplomatic credit for the pullout, with most of the world not only still insisting that Gaza is “Israeli-occupied territory,” but excoriating Israel with escalating ferocity, and eventhreatening sanctions, for its reluctance to repeat this disastrous experiment in the West Bank, while assigning Palestinians zero responsibility for the impasse.
All these are certainly reasons enough to consider the pullout a disaster. But there’s one final negative outcome, as reflected in another poll released last week: Due to this Israeli reluctance, born of hard experience, a majority of overseas Jews now deems Israel insufficiently committed to peace. And that, in some ways, is the worst betrayal of all. Most Israelis don’t expect much from the Palestinians or the UN or Europe. But they do expect their fellow Jews to sympathize with their fear that withdrawing from the West Bank would simply replicate the Gaza disaster on a much larger scale.
After all, none of the negative consequences that ensued in Gaza can be blamed on the popular distinction between the “moderate” Fatah, led by Mahmoud Abbas, and the “hardline” Hamas. For Gaza wasn’t handed over to Hamas, but to Abbas. He’s the one who first enabled the escalation by refusing to use his forces to stop it; consequently, there were more than four times as many rocket attacks in 2006, the first year after the disengagement, as in either of the previous two years. And he’s the one who lost Gaza to Hamas in a bloody coup in mid-2007 when the latter decided it no longer needed a fig leaf.
Thus Israel has no reason whatsoever to think giving Abbas the West Bank wouldn’t produce the same result, except with even more disastrous consequences. Hitting major Israeli population centers from Gaza requires long-range rockets; from the West Bank, easily produced short-range rockets suffice. Nor should we forget suicide bombings, which, during the second intifada (2000-2005), caused more Israeli casualties in four years than all the terror attacks of the entire previous 53 years combined. Those attacks were launched almost exclusively from parts of the West Bank controlled by the Palestinian Authority, and they stopped only when the Israeli army retook control of these areas – meaning Israel’s previous experiment with ceding parts of the West Bank was even less encouraging than the Gaza experiment has been.
Most Israelis would still be willing to trade land for peace, but they’ve had enough of trading land for terror. And until overseas Jews can produce a convincing argument for why the next pullout would be any different than all the previous ones, it would be nice if they instead practiced the traditional Jewish value of giving fellow Jews the benefit of the doubt. To interpret caution born of grim experience as disinterest in peace isn’t merely unfair; it’s downright malicious.
Originally published in Commentary on July 29, 2015
how can anyone trust such a person with an honest investigation?
Interestingly the author of the article laments that masses of police did not descend on settlements as they did on arab villages in the murder of the fogel baby. Hear we can see how the leftist media seek to dishonestly compare the two situations as if the same. Do Jews murder their own children as a collective culture, the muslims do. Do Jews use their children as human shields, the muslims do. do Jews carry on 18 year family feuds and vendettas, the muslims do. It would be absurd for the army to descend on jewish towns en masse for the murderer of the fogel baby; but not at all absurd in the case of an arab false flag to blame jews as we have already regularly witnessed their ability and propensity as a culture to lie and create false flag price tags. Their name for it is institutionalized as a religious imperative, taqiyya.
The author of this article is indicative of the disingenuous lynch mob hatred of the left for settlers. They should not be surprised when they encounter the same hatred directed at themselves in the same way the arab muslims who preach blood libels at the mount should not be surprised.
@ Bear Klein:
Hibernating already, way to early.
I am taking a leave of absence.
Bear Klein Said:
the point is that in the absence of NOT knowing the perps of the crime, and with all first indications that the crime has arab characteristics of false flag,….. therei can be no outwardly rational reason for rivlin, yaalon,BB, securty officials IMMEDIATELY targeting settlers. A more rational explanation of their bizarre behavior is either a dishonest exploitation of an “opportunity” to exploit the event to quash settlers and dissent OR a direct involvement in the false flag. Whoever did it is irrelevant to their incompetent or dishonest leadership reaction whose coordination and consistency of targeting is highly suspicious.
MY gut is to lean to dishonesty based on prior experience. I would be a fool to give equal credibility to the mouthings of politicians with alternate rational explanations.
Bear Klein Said:
there is no reasonable evidence to assume that this crime which takes place in the middle of an arab village with an 18 year family feud is a jewish hate crime. All the evidence uncovered by one visit by an unprofessional observer is convincing. Therefore why would the pres. rivlin, BB, yaalon and security officials immediately target settlers. These are the actions of incompetent or dishonest leaders who cannot be then expected to conduct an impartial, unbiased, competent and professional investigation after committing to their target.Bear Klein Said:
and yet the top leadership and kapo left immediately jumped on this lynch mob bandwagon demonstrating at the least their complete failure of leadership
Bear Klein Said:
we cannot expect a competent, unbiased, impartial investigation from security officials and leadership who targeted a group with no evidence and showing indications of a false flag. Any competent leadership would have urged calm, discouraged lynch mob behavior and urged to wait for the outcome of investigations and trial. Pathetic leadership which is no better than a mob.
Bear Klein Said:
😛 😛 😛 his “calm and good sense” is to protect himself from hamas and lynching afterwards.
……
when Rivlin speaks of needs to root out Jewish extremism he must FIRST look here to what his, BB’s and Yaalons gov is allowing in the jewish homeland. The gestopo tactics of the Mount polic,e and yaalons goons, who watch for jews with “murmuring lips”, the allowance of the most vile anti smitism to be preached to enemies in Jerusalem, the knee jerk lynch mob reaction of the trio to an incident with all the objective markings of an arab crime…. only an asinine fool would not expect frustration at these heinous allowances of the GOI to boil over.
The key to avoiding “Jewish extremism” is to protect Jews from their enemies rather than attack jews praying and living in eretz yisroel. Muslim attacks and incitements are what must NOW be given the number one priority to stamp out in the whole of Israel
Felix Quigley Said:
good point
@ Felix Quigley:
thanks for this very relevant post. At th eleast it appears that the least likely perps were Jewish “extremeists” in the middle of an arab village and the most likely a vendetta fued of arab clans typifying their propensity for killing children including their own.
In the light of this post from an unprofessional obserbver one must wonder why the Rivlin, BB, Yaalon and security officials immediatley jump on a lynch mob bandwagon to point fingers at settlers. At the least it is an incompetent failure of leadership which should encourage the outcome of professional inverstigation OR an example of Jew with a knee jerk kapo mentality to sacrifice another of their own to appease the beast OR the behavior of those engaged in a false flag in order to expand their power to incarcerate dissenters without trial. In any case it is no longer feasible to expect a competent and unbiased investigation from those who only look for settlers and ignore the massive evidence of other perps. Some poor settler is in danger of a frame up a la “Breaker Morant”
@ mar55:
before you post copy your post and if it is spammed then send it in an email to Ted and he will post it. another way is that you can click on the back arrow in your browser after it disappears,it usually shows the lost text on the prior page, and then copy and email to Ted.
@ SHmuel HaLevi 2: Shmeuel my friend if you know who did the crime I and many others would like to know who. Please lay out the specifics and not hysterical conspiracy theories.
By the way I am against the over reaction of the government. I am also against the civil war you apparently keep implying you want to conduct (if I am wrong about this kindly tell us).
The stragegic/political nature of the firebombing is shown as more facts emerge.As in all these cases (Srebrenica was the classic) the more you find out about it the more you can see the construction of a lie. The Arabs (The Jihad) have become more and more expert in constructing these kinds of false flag operations against Israel. The Arabs are heavily infiltrated and influenced by US and EU NGOs who themselves are directed and paid by the US and EU, with their spooks also heavily involved. What I said is that this is all linked to the nerw alliance of Obama/Cameron/Iran still stands. That is the only thing makes sense. It is not JUST an insular Israeli issue. It has broader and international ramifications the main one being that Netanyahu in his campaign mainly in America against Obamas Iran deal must be negatived.
Tapuchi at arson site.
Eitan Elhadez
Yonadav Tapuchi, a young man in his 20’s, lives in a Jewish town in Samaria and sports long sidelocks and a large kippah on his head; in short, he looks very much like a “settler extremist.”
He visited the Arab village of Duma on Sunday for a condolence visit to the family whose baby was killed in a fire apparently set by Jewish terrorists.
Yonadav wrote on his Facebook page that his purpose was to express words of condolence, and also to “give a clear message that there are some acts that have no justification, whether they are directed against Jews or against Arabs…I emphasized that though I am of the right-wing and support the expansion of the settlement enterprise, there are some approaches that are simply not legitimate, and that they are not supported by the Jews of Judea and Samaria.”
The trip to Duma was organized by a left-wing group called Tag Meir (Illuminating Tag), which is a Hebrew play on words on Tag Mechir, the nationalist “Price Tag” group that aims to avenge anti-Jewish violence and destruction.
Tapuchi acknowledged in his post that there are many in Judea and Samaria who are disgusted by the one-way nature of condolence trips of this sort, in that the Jews immediately condemn and express remorse over such violence, while the Arabs openly support the murder of Jews.
Hatred-filled talk
“I had difficult feelings after my trip,” Yonadav wrote, “which can be divided into three groups. First, there is no doubt that this was a shocking crime. It is simply terrible to wake up in the middle of the night to find your house and family going up in flames, to escape by the skin of your teeth, and then to find that you have lost a son. …My condolences to the family; may they know no more pain.”
“The second area concerns the anthropological experience I had on the bus filled with veteran left-wing activists from Tel Aviv – a horrific scene of hatred-filled talk: hatred of settlers, hatred of the religious, and especially of haredim; hatred of the State of Israel; and explanations why it was a moral imperative to leave and move to another country.
“When we arrived at the village, we were surrounded by Arab photographers. We were informed that the original plan had been changed, and that before visiting the actual mourning family, we would first see the burnt houses. Thus, a bunch of Jews with their heads held low were photographed near and in the burnt houses and the Hebrew graffiti there. A representative of the family and the village then gave a short speech (‘the settlers should expect the worst!,’ he warned). We were then told that actually, the village is quite up in arms, and that it would not be convenient for us to actually comfort the mourning family, and that we had better leave fast.
“I and others felt that this whole thing was a media trick to get the ‘Yahud’ [Arabic for ‘the Jews’ – ed.] to take part in humiliating set of photos near the buildings, and that they had never planned to allow us to come in actual contact with the family.”
The third set of impressions that Yonadav Tapuchi came away with concerned the suspicious nature of the alleged arson. He did not mention that there have been reports of an ongoing, 18-year feud between two clans in Duma that might be related to the murderous arson. In addition, one of the two graffiti messages – the single word nekamah, meaning “revenge” – has calligraphic elements that raise the suspicion that it was actually sprayed by an Arab.
The more curious aspects of the story
Tapuchi wrote: “Throughout the trip we heard explanations in Arabic, most of which were translated. We heard their story of the incident. It was impossible to ignore some of the more curious aspects of the story. I would start with the fact that the two houses (I had always thought only one house was burnt) are located in the center of the village, and that in order to get there we had to travel a number of minutes from the entrance. Duma is spread out over a gigantic area, and the houses are situated at the end of a winding road, among fences and yards.
“According to the Duma version, the attackers burnt one house, then saw that it was empty, and so they went to set fire to the next house. The second house is enclosed by a fence, and the windows are covered by a dense lattice; a firebomb cannot be hurled through the windows, and in any event it is very hard to reach the windows behind the fence. The arsonists had to go around the house, enter the yard, and place the firebombs through the lattice. According to the Duma version, the attackers entered the house, stood over the parents and did not let them leave until the flames engulfed the house. Only then did the arsonists run away from the village.
“I can only say that when the arsonists are ultimately caught, we will get to hear a fascinating story of why they chose to navigate their way all the way into the middle of the village, and how they had time to set a house on fire, wait to find that it was empty, then walk around and enter another house and set it on fire, wait with the parents, spray graffiti in two places – including with a little design of a crown! – and then run away through the middle of the village with all the townspeople surely already up and on their feet seeing the flames and hearing the family’s cries. Something here is very fishy…”
Yonadav concluded with the hope that next time, “a trip like this must be organized by residents of Judea and Samaria – not to be swallowed up by the apologetics of the left, but to constructively explain why we oppose violence.”
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/198961#.Vb81S5vAIpR
This is what you can say definitively: Obama and the US are right at the centre of these events. They have infiltrated Israeli circles to the highest level. Obama has determined to bring down Netanyahu and is facing serious conflicts, and growing, over his Iran Deal, the centrepiece of all of his political effort over 8 years. It is that serious for him. Without doubt his main enemy here is Netanyahu who HAS got big sway in republican circles in America. The speech to Congress on March 3 was expertly delivered and a serious blow against Obama, but we all recognised that it was not a knock out blow and that Obama would come back. THAT IS WHAT IS HAPPENING.
It is far more likely that Netanyahu is being used, pushed and shoved, by forces which are outside of his control. Many of these forces are paid agents of the US and likely EU Governments.
Those who say that Netanyhau is the main culprit are wrong and overlook the enormous tensión between Netanyahu and Obama over Iran.
(We always said here that Netanyahu should never be a PM but should be an expert spokesman not making policy but articulating policy – very different thing)
It is more likely that the US and EU are pulling other strings here to place Netanyahu in an invidious position. Nor is it ever personal against Netanyahu but towards different ends altjough I notice Antisemites cannot stand Netanyahu.
Netanyahu and Ya’alon think that it is all about the Iran deal and so it is, they are indeed right, that is a far more existentialist issue, but they overlook that the way for Obama to win through on the Iran deal is to send its dark forces into action inside of Israel itself.
if you doubt this is posible then think for a moment on British Imperialism and its role towards Ireland. A history of agents provocateurs (the Littlejohn Brothers as one only one example) and then leading on the accepted reality that British Intelligence captured through blackmail and conviction also the top positions in the IRA and Sinn Fein, which led directly to the “Good Friday Agreement” the basis for many years status quo.
I suspect very strongly that forces are operating outside of the control of Netanyahu and that these latest events are closely tied to Obama selling the Iran Deal to an ever more dubious world.
The Israeli people are split. But I believe the split is on this (which is just written on the MS Facebook Page):
“Everything you have said about Trotsky is false and your sources are questionable and I could argue you under the table on the value of Trotsky today but will desist because you raise it as a diversion from your own politics. I ask you to clarify is the Palestinian Arab movement a true national movement or is it an expression of Muslim Jihadist Antisemitism. THAT is the issue. THAT is the issue that is splitting Jews in Israel and is the issue that needs to be cleared up
..
(cont.)…Felix Quigley The sad reality is that neither the great patriots on the Jewish side Herzl or Jabotinsky in recent history ever understood the meaning of the Jihad and therefore they did not ever for a single second understand the nature of the monster that they were fighting against.
This is the same Jihad that we are all fighting against in every country today on earth. It is beginning to dawn on many of us abroad that there can never be a peace in Israel as long as this reality is not recognized and that the “Palestinians” are indeed another name for Jihad.
We are in fact on the very point of exposing in front of the whole world that the “Palestinians” ARE the Jihad and that the essence of Jihad is Antisemitism, written into the Koran and hardwired into the whole Muslim mentality.
It is from this recognition that I draw my conclusion that Israel must be a Jewish State, ruled by Jews, that only Jews vote to the Knesset, that the Knesset vote is the key vote of power, and that the Supreme Court which is hostile to the Jewish State and its Knesset must be disbanded. Jihadists must be killed/deported and a humanitarian arrangement arrived at for Arabs who are fair towards the Jews, which means recognising that only Jews vote for the Knesset. The latter must be recognised by fair Arabs as a self defence by the Jews.END QUOTE
In other words the great problem is not these agents provocateurs etc. because that goes with the territory, has always been there in every country in every struggle, but the lack of a part to express the above which I have written.
It goes without saying that I believe it is a serious mistake for Jewish Patriots to allow themselves be isolated to fighting in these áreas of Judea and Samaria. Their isolation, in programme and location, is being used against them by these dark forces. But having said that things are as they are and every effort to oppose this witch hunt must be urgently organised.
@ Bear Klein:
You are still spreading hearsay and no evidence,
Has it been established by AN INDEPENDENT commission of investigation “who done it”?
We have very significant representations pointing to a “professional” job.
In particular a calligraphic expert exposing the “writing on the wall” so to speak.
Ted, I wrote about this incident before and, when I put the number 10 it did disappeared. Ii did show only a 0 and told me it was the wrong number.
I was not able to recuperate it. Please see if you can get it back.
I suspect this attack was a false flag attack. Under the circumstances it is the best explanation.
@ bernard ross:
Almost hourly the whole set up led by Netanyahu is methodically involved on assaulting Jewish people, properties, rights and even harming women and children physically. The Nazi like procedure of trial less “administrative detention” is commonly used to torture Jews. The British introduced that monstrous tool and the unJews use it in force.
Oslo served to import in mass Arafat’s murderers to serve Peres as proxies to liquidate Jews. Over 1800 “victims of peace” are buried and over 10000 maimed for life.
Nearly 8000 Jews Pogromed against during “disengagement” and abused after it.
Thousands of homes have been destroyed and never ending lies offered as palliatives.
Netanyahu “gestures” releasing thousands of Islamic beasts back to murder more Jews are in plain view records.
Temple Mount is in fact closed to believing Jews. And more…
For how long do the renegade unJews believed that the mouse would take being tortured before turning around?
In retrospect…
Against what I ever thought possible, many are starting to ask themselves why should any Jew overseas consider settling in the renegades putrid cauldron?
Iran does need to make a bomb. We are allowing the worst elements ever to destroy the state and Jewish Heritage even before Iran is ready.