T. Belman. Notice that Greenblatt didn’t specify the commitment nor say for how long nor say how much land. Nor did he say, that, the sovereignty stood to be undone, if whatever.
Originally the deal was that Israel could extend sovereignty immediately, so long as they undertook to negotiate a palestinian state on the 70%. Also they were to agree to freeze developement of the rest of Area C for 4 years. After, no freeze.
Former envoy says as per US plan, sovereignty “comes with commitment to set aside a certain area for eventual, potential Palestinian state.”
ARUTZ SHEVA
Jason Greenblatt, former US envoy, told Efi Triger on Galei Tzahal today, Thursday, that Israel declaring sovereignty over parts of Judea and Samaria was tied to “a commitment to set aside a certain area of land for the eventual, potential Palestinian state.”
Greenblatt asserted that the Trump peace plan was unique from previous peace plans in that it placed demands on the Palestinians.
“There’s a lot of criteria before the Palestinians become a state, if it ever happens. I think that’s what differentiates the plan we released from some of the past efforts. There are things that have to be solved before you begin a discussion on what a Palestinian state should look like.
“Will it happen? Can Israel can extend sovereignty? The answer is yes, but under the peace plan that we released, that comes with a commitment to set aside a certain area of land for the eventual, potential Palestinian state.
“But again, it’s important to stress that that Palestinian state is not the one that people vaguely talk about or one that doesn’t come with a responsible leadership. There are a lot of criteria for [the Palestinians] to establish a state, as there should be.”
He hinted that ongoing disputes between Netanyahu and Gantz have pushed off sovereignty, noting that, “The peace plan that we released back in January does contemplate the application of Israeli law, and I’m sure that once the Israeli government decides what it wants to do, it will do it in coordination with the White House, which I think is the right approach.”
Greenblatt added that, “The peace effort during the next couple of months is going to be extremely challenging obviously, with COVID and the economic crisis, and the Palestinian leadership rejecting the Trump peace plan even before it was released. It’s a bumpy road, but nothing has ever been smooth on the peace file, and I think we have to just keep trying. I hope the White House and Israeli government keep trying, and I hope the Palestinian leadership comes to its senses, because I think we presented is a realistic and implementable plan.”
@ Ted Belman:
TED- how about telling us how you are today. We are all your friends,and naturally are concerned. How long are you expected to remain in hospital.??
Also from the staff and observation, you may have picked up an impression as to how the Virus is progressing, their expectations, etc. and if they see a light at the end of the tunnel. Are virus patients arriving in droves…? Any staff muttering about Netanyahu, for instance…?
Israel needs a “Menachem Begin” right now!
Courage and vision!
@ Ted Belman:
I am relieved! Feel better soon.
@ Ted Belman:
SO glad….!!
@ Ted Belman:
My corona test proved negative 14 hours after the test. Then they moved me into the right department just iin time for Shabbat. Meanwhile they were treating for my water retension and I feel much better. I have to wait til Sunday to speak to a doctor.
Thanks for all your well wishes.
@ Ted Belman:
I am just hearing from these comments that you are sick. I am very sorry to hear that and hope you get better soon. All the best.
@ Ted Belman:
I wish you a speedy recovery and that they treat your primary condition properly.
@ Ted Belman:
I’m so sorry to hear this. Had NO idea. Would not have bothered with my picayune questions if I’d had any inkling. I sincerely hope..yes and even pray, that you will come safely out of there and back to us in far better heath. That after 12 hours the major ailment has not been even cursorily attended to seems, at face value, to be utterly negligent. ..
All of us will agree on THAT. !
@ Edgar G.:
Edgar, I am NOT castigating you!
I respect you and your views.
It’s just this is the way I see it – to me it has been very clear from the beginning because I don’t assume that the US or the President would ever do anything which would benefit Jews more than Arabs.
The “Palestinians” are overwhelmingly considered by the world community as deserving of their own state because they are “poor suffering refugees whose land Israel stole for its Zionist state”.
Here is the same opinion as mine by Daniela Weiss, head of the Nachala movement:
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/283880
Anyway, the prime mover of Zionism is aliyah and settling the land, a.k.a “creating facts on the ground”, not sovereignty (which comes next).
It looks like there might be an influx of French Jews soon, and there are almost 450,000 of them.
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/283394
@ Ted Belman:
Godspeed Ted Belman!
Nlow the trump plan. I will not respond to all the different opinions. I will repeat what I have maintained all along.
The plan is not a contract, it is a vision
One that will be abandoned in due course. But the extention of sovereignty will take place very soon.
@ Edgar G.:
After you comment you will see the fives min allowing you to edit.
Yesterday I had an emergency trip to hospital for treatment of congestive heart failure when there they first put me in the Corona department for testing. Twelve hours later I am still here waiting for results. And they haven’t dealt with my primary problem. How’s that for a case in point.
@ Edgar G.:
Sorry Reader, I meant “you’re not interpreting”, and slipped up by using ‘intimating”.
@ Reader:
O.K. you’re not “intimating”….!. You’re saying, that no Arab state, no sovereignty. No one else is that arbitrary. The word intimating can be used instead of “declaring” or etc.
Just a refinement of language that I indulge in sometimes.
The Plan seems to indicate that the 4 year freeze on Israeli building in the 30% is so that the Arabs can feel comfortable whilst deciding how they will comply with the conditions. I haven’t seen anything in the Plan which says unequivocably that if the Arabs don’t comply within 4 years then Israel is free not only to unfreeze their 30% but to spread all over the whole Area C.
(I say “seems to indicate”, because of the ambiguous nature of the Plan which has emerged with so many different interpretations of what the Plan contains-so don’t castigate me about it) .
That’s what I was trying to figure out, Ted didn’t answer me, and Bear …as you MUST have read, did respond, in so many words, that if the Arabs don’t comply in the stated time, then Israel can take over Area C.
Which is exactly the opposite of what you say you clearly see in the Plan.
@ Edgar G.:
I am not interpreting the Plan, I am explaining what Greenblatt said about the Plan.
I think he made his meaning very clear.
@ Edgar G.:
Ted ..how about answering me and clarifying the ambiguosity of the 4 year freeze (I’m feeling a sort of chill also) on the 30%, versus the postulated freedom by Israel to build on the other 70% of Area C if the Arabs are non compliant.
It seems that several here have taken different meanings from the stated terms of the Plan, each having an opposing but convincing interpretation. So CLEAR IT UP for us.
Puleeze…..!!
Also what about my repeated query on the missing “edit” time…?
@ Reader:
Your interpretation of the 70% is contrary to what Bear just clarified for me. You can see that he said that after 4 years -assuming no Arab state has eventuated- Israel is free to build anywhere in Area C. What causes you to see or interpret the Plan differently.??
@ Bear Klein:
O.K. Bear; thank you for the clarification.
Greenblatt has made it very clear that
No Arab state in Judea and Samaria – no sovereignty.
Declaration of sovereignty = agreement to set aside land in Judea and Samaria (at least) for a “Palestinian” state no matter how “eventual”, “potential”, or probable plus non-expansion of the existing Jewish settlements.
Any other interpretation of the plan is wishful thinking – hasn’t the US started the old tune of “Israel’s painful concessions” and “final borders” already?
@ Edgar G.:
Edgar Area C is roughly 60 -62% of all of Judea/Samaria.
Israel according to the “Trump Vision” Israel would keep one of half of area C or ~30% of Judea / Samaria and if it wants apply sovereignty to this part now. Israel would freeze or not build in the other half of Area C for 4 years providing the Pals a chance to meet the requirements of the plan in order to become a state and agree to all its provisions. Since this has less than a zero chance to occur Israel after the 4 four year freeze would be free to start building in the other parts of Area C and if they desire apply sovereignty.
The Trump Vision does not address Area A or B as potentially part of sovereign Israel.
@ Ted Belman:
Your post is ambiguous. Do you mean, the extension of Sovereignty to the Israeli 30%… or to the full Area C…??
My understanding of the Plan was the Sovereignty extension was restricted to 30% with building in the 30% frozen for 4 years, and that 70% was reserved for an Arab state, WHICH WOULD ENSUE …provided… that the Arabs complied with a list of conditions.. But I am not clear as to what Israel has freedom to do with the remaining 70% AFTER the 4 years have elapsed with no Arab compliance. Can the Arabs, ask for and get, an extension…say for another 4 years…???
And, what is Israel’s freedom to do in the 70%, assuming the Arabs remain recalcitrant…?
On another item, you ignore my repeated simple query about the missing “edit time”.
@ Bear Klein:
I understood that the freeze on “building” for 4 years was directed at the 30%, and not at the 70% which was “out of the picture”0, as regards Israel.
Am I wrong…?
Commitment by the Palestinians is the only thing missing to make this nightmare come true. Fortunately they are intransigent and even with world opinion behind Abbas, right now, he won’t move. Time to recognize EU/USA/China/Russia will do nothing if Israel makes a land grab. They are all like deer caught in the headlights of Xtian Biblical prophecy.
@ Ted Belman:
His message is that Israel needs to get Gantz and Bibi on the same page for the US to approve unilateral sovereignty application per the terms of the of the Trump Vision.
“He hinted that ongoing disputes between Netanyahu and Gantz have pushed off sovereignty, noting that, “The peace plan that we released back in January does contemplate the application of Israeli law, and I’m sure that once the Israeli government decides what it wants to do, it will do it in coordination with the White House, which I think is the right approach.”
@ Bear Klein:
His commens are non-sensical unless you look for his agenda for the answer.
@ Ted Belman:
I think you are reading into things. First, Greenblatt is no longer officially involved as he left his White House Special Advisor position. The “Trump Plan” always required a freeze for four years on 70% of Area C and he did not say nor imply this has changed.
Israel’s real problem is the government coalition members are having serious disputes on more urgent issues. There are regular protests outside the PM residence and people are starting to talk about new elections.
Greenblatt is not Israel’s problem. That the coalition is dysfunctional is the issue.
No amount of trying will budge the incalcitrant imposters.
The New Yorker legendary Humorist James Thurber may have concluded, if he had survived until now, that Israel is ..”in the Catbird Seat”.
Israel has options, which it did not have in previous US administrations.
Israel is the “Clifford Brown” of geopolitical improvisation.
[If you want to hear what I mean go to You Tube and listen to The Art Blakey Quintet featuring/Clifford Brown/Lou Donaldson/Horace Silver: Live at Byrdland]
I will leave it at that, because I believe Israel will know how to make use of The Trump Plan to safeguard it’s long term interests.
It has become an increasingly complex situation, with many variables.
I am not worried at all.
Enjoy the Clifford Brown recordings.
Greenblatt’s basic message was that the Trump Team is commited to protecting the Palestinians. When Israel announces the extension of sovereignty, the team can say we tried.
I have just written to Greenblatt at the White House and asked…. .” 1) How long must Israel actually HAVE to wait to ascertain if the Arabs comply with the requirements as laid down in the Plan..? 2) Assuming that the Arabs do not comply within the stated time, does this free Israel to extend sovereignty over far more than the meagre 30%”…..
I then pointed out that “after all, The whole Land is legally owned by The Jewish People”…
I’m sure I’ll get some sort of response, it will be interesting to wait and see. Maybe just political double-talk, make a more concrete answer.
Oh yes, I called down a blessing or two on him, his family and the President. When one is addressing a politician, one must drop a little political oil on the stormy water….
Again…for TED- is it just my computer -or has the “4min.39secs edit time” gone for all.
The lack of any announcement even a delay or cancellation on July 1 is indicative of a government problem. 4th elections are in order.