Mordechai ben Menachem. The first 11 minutes are ‘technical’ and one can take them or not.
But from 11 minutes he discusses the geostrategic view and his discussion is superb. As usual, one may agree or disagree with what he says, but his logical thoughts are some of the best.
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Agreed Mr. Zorn the Holocaust word is overused and as you said. “Labeling every genocide, a Holocaust is the Left’s favorite form of Holocaust. ”
Although the threat of nuke’s being used on Israel is real. I do not believe God will ever let it happen. As far as dismissing the Tanak (bible), one should not be so hasty.
@Reader Not the early Bibi. It began when he was finance minister under Sharon. Early 2000s. We’ve only seen the fruits of it in recent years.
@Tanna The only potential Holocaust on the horizon is the annhilation of 7 million Israel Jews by a nuclear Iran.
Labeling every genocide a Holocaust is the Left’s favorite form of Holocaust denial.
The New York Times buried it in the back pages, Liberal Jewish leaders tried to deflect attention away from it. The Soviet Union covered up the uniquely anti-semitic nature of the genocide.
These biblical passages are nicely cathartic but they are too vague and were written too long ago to be considered prophetic.
Christians try to insert themselves in our history to coopt it, choosing which stories to embrace.
Jews didn’t run with the original sin and the serpent in the garden thing. Maybe the flood made a tabula rasa?But Christians, who also don’t accept the Noachide Laws made it a central part of their narrative.
Trying to transfer shock value to the conflict oft the moment always backfires.
@Sebastien Zorn
Correlation is not causation.
There was also a huge wave of olim from the FSU, in the late 70s and in the 80s and early 90s, among them were many scientists, medical doctors, engineers, etc.
This is a much more probable cause of Israel’s advancement.
Right now Israel is facing a shortage of doctors because the ones from the FSU are retiring.
When was that?
In the US in the early 1980s $17,000 a year was a very good salary, now someone with this annual salary would be considered a pauper.
It is from NefeshB’Nefesh, however, I suspect there may be some nuances in the way the bureaucracy applies.
The role of private medical insurance is increasing in Israel since the public insurance (there is a monthly payment) no longer covers all the services.
I don’t like this because, as we can see in the US, the insurers tend to tie the doctors’ hands by starting to dictate to them how to treat the patients (depending on what treatments they happen to cover).
@Reader It’s a conundrum. I agree with you that free universal healthcare is a right not a frill or perk. But, it’s a fact that before Bibi, Israel was not a major power on the world stage. He writes that the average income of Israelis was $17,000 a year.
What is your source for the healthcare payment situation?
@Sebastien Zorn
“Capitalist market forces” don’t work for a country under siege.
Both Israel and China made the same mistake as the FSU by assuming that going “capitalist” to conform to the economic and political system and the wishes of the “civilized world” and establishing broad and intensive economic ties with it would guarantee peaceful relations with it, and thus would practically become a guarantee of world peace.
If Israel was too poor then, why is the cost of living in Israel now so high, why does one fifth of the population live below the poverty level, and why is the whole country, allegedly, now owned by several super rich families?
And why, in order to have full medical coverage in Israel, does one now have to purchase – if they can afford it – (in addition to the public insurance) private medical insurance which excludes preexisting conditions and adults over a certain age (the elderly) (this is what NBN says, anyway)?
It looks to me like certain politicians were not rich enough then but they are doing very well now, after helping to impoverish the rest of the population and to enrich the few.
Michael, I agree in one point – But our disagreement is in how we think of /define Holocaust. What happen to the Jewish people in WW2 never happened before and I do not think it will ever happen again. I am not thinking of a literal holocaust when I use the word in this context.
No literal holocaust maybe as what was experience in WW2, but if one places what is going on in Ukraine on Israel then you have another holocaust (of sorts) just – not the literal definition of the word. (Burnt sacrifice with fire) but terrible lost, suffering human misery, stuff a hundred years of living will not wipe from ones memory.
[2] For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
As far as nuclear war in Israel- I’m not reading v12 as what we know of a nuclear explosion. Unless – it’s not referring to Israel’s land, but the attacking nations.
Zech.14.
The verse 14 is better understood as taking up again the battle scene of verses 2–3, and explaining the means by which the Lord will defeat those nations who are attacking Jerusalem.
And this shall be the plague: This refers to something that is to follow, namely the description of medical symptoms in the second half of the verse. The term plague (“a terrible disease”) is used in the sense of an epidemic though the details that follow do not match any condition identifiable to modern medicine. It is used elsewhere for instance in Num 14:37; 16:46–50; 2 Sam 24:21, 25. In the context of the defeat of the enemies of God’s people, the prophet probably also has in mind such passages as 2 Kgs 19:35 (where Sennacherib’s army was miraculously destroyed) and Ezek 38:21–22 (where the forces of Gog are overcome), though the same word does not occur in them.
With which the Lord will smite all the peoples that wage war against Jerusalem: The word smite is an old-fashioned term in English, which NRSV replaces with the modern word “strike.” other translations avoid the rather awkward relative clause in RSV here, and says, “The Lord will bring a terrible disease on.…” All the peoples that wage war against Jerusalem refers to the same type of groups as those mentioned in verses 2 and 3. The present verse gives a detailed picture of how the Lord will “fight against” them (verse 3). It is not made clear until verse 16 that although every nation among the enemy forces will be affected by the plague, not every individual person will be.
Their flesh shall rot while they are still on their feet: In Hebrew their is actually a singular possessive suffix, referring to individuals. Most English versions translate it as plural since this is the more natural way to express the meaning in English. The disease that the Lord sends will be so terrible that people will be like living corpses (NLT “walking corpses”). In this context flesh is literal and refers to the softer parts of the human body as opposed to the harder parts like bones. This material will rot or decay while the enemy are still on their feet. In contrast to the course of a normal illness, in which people feel unwell but have time to go and lie down, the plague that is the Lord’s punishment will afflict the enemy suddenly in the midst of their normal duties. some translations fail to capture this element of suddenness. Another way to express the meaning is “while they are still standing upright,” or as CEV “While they are standing there.” The mention of feet in Hebrew is perhaps a contrasting echo of the mention of the Lord’s feet in verse 4.
Their eyes shall rot in their sockets: The first occurrence of their refers to the enemy, whereas the second refers to the eyes. In Hebrew the distinction is quite clear because the possessive suffixes are of different genders.
Their tongues shall rot in their mouths: The enemy will be deprived not only of sight but also of speech. Some translations combine the last two clauses into one: “their eyes and their tongues will rot away.” This does not omit any of the elements of the meaning, but it does lose some of the cumulative effect of having three parallel clauses. CEV translation has “he will make their flesh rot and their eyes fall from their sockets and their tongues drop out.”
14:13
A great panic from the Lord shall fall on them: Panic is an emotional reaction that causes great fear and confusion (1 Sam 14:20). In some translations it is more natural to restructure this clause to say “the Lord will send a great panic on them,” “the Lord will throw them into a great panic” or “the Lord will make them so confused and afraid”. The “them” refers to the enemies attacking Jerusalem, as in verse 12.
So that each will lay hold on the hand of his fellow: The expression lay hold on the hand of is in itself neutral, and does not indicate whether the action is friendly (compare 8:23) or hostile. However, in the present context, and especially in the light of the next clause, most translators have understood that the action is hostile, and have translated it so.
And the hand of the one will be raised against the hand of the other: This rendering is unnaturally literal. The meaning is expressed simply and clearly as “they will attack each other” (NIV). Other effective renderings are “they will hit out at each other” (JB), “they will fall to fighting among themselves” (NJB), and “They will fight against each other in hand-to-hand combat”
So, I agree a great battle is coming to Jerusalem /Israel, but I disagree it will be nuclear. Then the eyeballs, tongues and flesh consumed away would be the nations and not Israel. I would agree, that would indeed be a miracle for all the world to see.
Hi, Tanna. You said,
“Reader said:
“I am convinced that if the Russians don’t win this time, the Jews will face another Holocaust…”
I don’t think Israel faces another “holocaust”, as it did in WWII, because the Jewish people now have their own state and can defend themselves. This was the whole point of Zionists like Herzl and Jabotinsky. Israel is a nuclear power, willing and able to execute the “Samson” option if its existence is threatened.
Zechariah 14 covers the matter:
Zech.14
[1] Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, and thy spoil shall be divided in the midst of thee.
[2] For I will gather all nations against Jerusalem to battle; and the city shall be taken, and the houses rifled, and the women ravished; and half of the city shall go forth into captivity, and the residue of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
[3] Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle….
[12] And this shall be the plague wherewith the LORD will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.
[13] And it shall come to pass in that day, that a great tumult from the LORD shall be among them; and they shall lay hold every one on the hand of his neighbour, and his hand shall rise up against the hand of his neighbour.
[14] And Judah also shall fight at Jerusalem; and the wealth of all the heathen round about shall be gathered together, gold, and silver, and apparel, in great abundance.
[15] And so shall be the plague of the horse, of the mule, of the camel, and of the ass, and of all the beasts that shall be in these tents, as this plague.
[16] And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.