Mordechai ben Menachem. The first 11 minutes are ‘technical’ and one can take them or not.
But from 11 minutes he discusses the geostrategic view and his discussion is superb. As usual, one may agree or disagree with what he says, but his logical thoughts are some of the best.
Leave a Reply
You must be logged in to post a comment.
I read Bibi’s autobiography, actually, Ilistened to it as an audio book on Audible. In it he says that he set out to free capitalist market forces from Socialist constraints because Israel was too poor to get the armaments she would need.
I was planning on standing on the side lines with Michael and hold you fellows’ coats and jackets like Rabbi Saul did 2000 years ago, but I enjoy all comments and just had to jump in…….
Not disagreeing just another perspective.
Reader said:
“I am convinced that if the Russians don’t win this time, the Jews will face another Holocaust (by different means than in WWII because the technology, psychology, and propaganda have advanced immensely in direct proportion to the “simple man’s” ignorance and stupidity).” I think Reader has a good point. This thing is not over yet, by a long shot! The children of Israel are the Chosen people, chosen for a reason and they have not fulfilled their mission to teach the world how to live with each other and live in peace. The West is fighting for a place in the future, the east is also fighting for a place. Like playing King of the Hill as a child. Whoever wins will create our future world. As far as anyone/nation fighting against Israel those choices will be made just before the bullets and bombs start. Yes, nothing happens overnight it’s a long slow process.
Russia has somewhat of a moral, ethical religious base, The WEST is losing theirs rapidly. Just as Hashem causes enemies to rise up against Israel, they also have allies. I believe it’s in the bible, the enemy of your enemy is my friend. 🙂
Even Mr. Zorn’s point, Israel must walk a fine line to not get scapegoated nor drug into something they are not ready for.
Mr. Felix’s statement: “Their whole argument is that there is nothing AFTER “capitalism”, that “capitalism” is the highest form of development any society can reach.”……. “What if there WAS an alternative.”
There is something higher then Capitalism and yes, there is an alternative. Read the Torah and the Prophets. I think, just as the tears and cries went up from Egypt before Moshe showed up, before the Prophet that Moshe spoke of shows up, there will be many tears and cries that go up to Heaven. And although, I live in USA. I am not convinced at this point that America will not turn against Israel.
Reader
“yet at the same time everyone is using his terminology?
Their whole argument is that there is nothing AFTER “capitalism”, that “capitalism” is the highest form of development any society can reach.”
That is exactly what is engrained on people right down the line and Marx was the only one to break the logjam of thinking.
What if there WAS an alternative.
Now
With virus, nuclear war, global warming it is
There better be a way out for us. Or life on earth is doomed.
I read his Manifesto pretty young and was bowled over. Those guys did provide a story. It explained.
Much later I read Lucy by Don Johanson and I had already read essay by Marx’s friend Engels and this was quite breathtaking
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Part_Played_by_Labour_in_the_Transition_from_Ape_to_Man
Though incomplete, the essay elucidates two aspects of materialist theory which had underpinned Marx and Engels’s thinking since the mid-1840s. First, it argues that humanity’s separation from nature is not inherent to the human condition, but rather that humanity is a part of nature; furthermore, human agency in physically reorganizing nature is part of a long historical process, whereby the physical material of nature is incorporated into human systems of value through labour. Engels uses this framework to suggest that humanity must transcend the ecologically destructive patterns of capitalism, and progress to a mode of production that operates in harmony with nature.”
And so on. Simple but a bombshell to the Heirarchy!!!
@Felix Quigley
Isn’t it interesting that everybody hates Marx like poison, yet at the same time everyone is using his terminology?
Their whole argument is that there is nothing AFTER “capitalism”, that “capitalism” is the highest form of development any society can reach.
@Sebastien Zorn
In case you didn’t notice, I was talking about the goals of THE WEST in WWII, not the goals of the “Allies which included the Soviet Union”.
The goals of the West (including the US and Great Britain) were the same as the goals of the Nazis, you might even say that the Nazi Germany played the same role in WWII as Ukraine (more farcically and tragically) is playing now.
Reader
“The reason the West wants to prolong this war is to accomplish the goals it failed to accomplish in WWII, namely, to exterminate enough (Slavic) “subhumans” (Untermenschen) in order to clear the “living space” (Lebensraum) for the “superhumans” (Uebermenschen), and also in the meanwhile/eventually to exterminate the Jews completely.”
In general terms who could disagree after everything we have experienced since NATO war on Yugoslavia.
The simplest answer is always the best
The capitalist system spirals out of control. The madder and madder ideologies reflect the out of control chaos.
(Alex Jones, Redacted science denial COVID denial vaccine haters, even McGregor is effected, The Irish and their new pin up boy Zelensky and we all face it – a terrible madness is born on our world)
I think that McGregor is tending to think that American capitalism can right itself.
Ritter is more urgent. A little more edgy than McGregor and others.
Ritter fears this. I am more with him. I also fear.
Ritter has said people should pray Russia wins.
But whatever happens Empire will have things it’s way. It will be chaotic but Hitlerism was also mad and chaotic.
Bottom line Russia is a relatively poor land but extensive with very valuable mineral wealth.
Inside that situation lies peril for Jews.
And Jews in an organisational sense are all over the place. Heck they make a total mess of Israel – never even to deliver their propaganda properly.
Israel is great but it’s leadership sucks.
@Reader I just reread what you wrote and I can’t believe you think the Allies which included the Soviet Union had the same war aims as the Nazis. You are way off.
@Reader You don’t have to combine all the issues into one big issue. The only potential Holocaust Jews face is from a nuclear Iran. Iran is allied with Russia but it’s clearly a limited tactical alliance or Russia would have helped them go nuclear.
Israel needs to steer clear of this conflict. Israel has a military alliance with the US and an understanding in Syria with Russia.
Lord Palmerston’s quip applies.
I do think Russia is in the right on the merits in Ukraine but we Jews must not make ourselves anybody ‘s scapegoat or make permanent enemies unnecessarily and should steer clear.
This really has nothing to do with the Holocaust commemoration.
The reason the West wants to prolong this war is to accomplish the goals it failed to accomplish in WWII, namely, to exterminate enough (Slavic) “subhumans” (Untermenschen) in order to clear the “living space” (Lebensraum) for the “superhumans” (Uebermenschen), and also in the meanwhile/eventually to exterminate the Jews completely.
This time, the “subhumans”, i.e., the Russians and Ukrainians are very successfully exterminating each other and clearing the territory of Ukraine all by themselves without the West having to risk the precious lives of those who will (it hopes) eventually benefit from the freed up Lebensraum while the West watches the slaughter on big screen TVs while eating popcorn in “freedom and security”.
I am convinced that if the Russians don’t win this time, the Jews will face another Holocaust (by different means than in WWII because the technology, psychology, and propaganda have advanced immensely in direct proportion to the “simple man’s” ignorance and stupidity).
So why do I support Russia? Not because I think Russia is socialist. I think it is now capitalist and Putin hates socialism. It is often misunderstood – Trotsky did see class yes but not in the real world only class. Not crude or mechanical.
Rather I support Russia because it is fighting a national liberation or freedom struggle against Empire. The Empire being mainly America Britain and EU. And the struggle for a Nation to be free from Imperialism, in this case Empire, is necessary to support.
There are even more reasons to defend Russia today when we consider what NATO did to Yugoslavia , Iraq, Libya etc.
And as John Mearsheimer said he was in a very small minority. So things are very challenging.
When Zelensky came to the Dail, the Irish word for parliament, every member at the end of his speech stood, every member except for 3, clapped. He was not even there. He was on a screen. You would think – unreal for that to happen in the country of the GPO Uprising!
I made the following tweet recently following the tank sending issue
“All roads from the West, even little Portugal, set out on their MISSION to KILL Russians. Racist hatred of the Russian lies behind West Bloodlust https://pic.twitter.com/Kiu8EuUPwN”
To me it is very reminiscent of the Nazi hatred for Jews and his hatred also for the Bolshevism.
But this covers even little Ireland out there in the Atlantic and even Green Progressives flocked and still seem to continue flocking to the banner of a new Empire Fascism.
The Nazis then would treat the Grandparents of Zelensky as Russian nothings, but here for the world and about Russians he struts the same Nazi stuff.
And the ancient and once revolutionary exhilarating Dail clapping for a Fascist puppet.
The biggest thing in one sense that has come out of this experience is that nationalist India did not fall for Zelensky and Empire but stood firm (and proud), so with Trotsky type leadership there can be a way out and forward.
@Felix Nope, Wrong again. It was National SOCIALISM. And both the Soviet Union and the banks, governments and major corporations of the west played along for as long as it served their perceived interests. We Jews had nobody in our corner because the Jewish state of Israel had yet to be reborn.
Sebastien and Peloni
“And for your information, I COULD CARE LESS ABOUT Capitalism and Imperialism vs Socialism and Communism.”
Except that it was capitalism which created the war and the Holocaust
Peloni
I am in no way out of line but you definitely are even to the extent of 1. Either not being able to read what I wrote or 2 deliberately lying as to what I wrote
And I do not forget Peloni is a person who lies about COVID and denied the value of our vaccines which have saved so many millions of lives
So Peloni do not be supercilious towards me. Look at your own bad situation.
@Felix And for your information, I COULD CARE LESS ABOUT Capitalism and Imperialism vs Socialism and Communism. The devil is in the details. Did you know that the US and Belgium are the only two developed capitalist countries that don’t have universal health care and Cuba is the only Communist country that does? 😀
@Felix
You are way out of line, even more than you normally are.
Our faith has nothing to do with your political ideology, and the Holocaust had nothing to do with anyone being capitalists.
So go sell crazy to the crazies who can afford such nonsense.
And as far as your anti-capitalist rants are concerned, it would likely surprise you to learn that the reason why Putin was able to stabilize his nation’s economy in the face of the massive US sanctions was due to his mastery of being such a good capitalist himself.
@Felix Sorry if I’m not Jewish enough for you, whatever that means 😀 All of my ancestors were Jews and 2 generations of one side of my family, 19 people including grandparents and great grandparents on one side were murdered at Auschwitz and my father and his first cousin-in-llaw were slave laborers before they escaped and joined the resistance and saved Jews. That’s Jewish enough for me.
AND I DON’T CARE ABOUT PUTIN’S HONOR. I could give a good’s rats ass for all I care.
But when will the used, betrayed and murdered Jewish Anti-Fascist Committee, when will Solomon Michaels be honored? Wallenberg who disappeared into the gulag at the end of the war. The Jewish dead of Babi Yar who the Soviets pretended weren’t Jewish until Yevtoshenko outed them with his famous poem which I heard with my mother in a packed Madison Square Garden in the 70s. I’m baffled at how I disregarded everything I knew to think like you for 20 years just because of one Marxist high school history teacher with glossy textbooks and a sea of Che teeshirts and Mao buttons everywhere.
@Felix Oh what a crock you Commie crackpot. Why should we care about Putin’s honor? This conflict HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE JEWS!
Stop trying to co-opt us in time-honored lefty fashion.
Sebastien … I am not talking about anything…other than this insult to Putin and Russia
You line up with Michael political reactionary and an enemy of Russia in this struggle.
That makes you also an.enemy of all Jews
Let me explain
Make no mistake about my assertion here – you are really a political enemy and of whom are you an enemy – in the long run of Jews
People like you and especially as you claim Jewishness must be fought and exposed for what you really are.
For what you really are is a deep down defender of capitalism and imperialism.
And it is imperialism which in the final analysis caused the Holocaust of the Jews.
What is needed is for every person of whatever nationality to mobilize with Putin and Russia against the enemies of Russia today.
You have lined up in the opposite camp.
It was me and me alone who saw these hateful slurs against Russia by Michael and took up a struggle against these political slurs.
Instead of being commended for this you attack me
Sebastien Zorn you are not representing the key interests and future of Jews here. Slick talker all right. But beneath the words – rotten.
Pastor Niemoller wasn’t a good man who failed to speak out. He voted for the Nazi party in the Prussian state election of 1924 and the national election of March 1933.
https://encyclopedia.ushmm.org/content/en/article/martin-niemoeller-biography
What a crock. He didn’t speak out because he was a F-ing Nazi, that’s why he didn’t speak out.
“First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.”
—Martin Niemöller
What a crock. That’s not how the Nazis came to power and Niemoller was a Nazi from the beginning who just differed with Hitler on a few details – He didn’t want Hitler telling him how ro run his church or his mouth sand he thought Jews who converted to Christianity should be spared, gee thanks — but he still tried to vounteer to fight on the Eastern Front from prison. But, this is how he faked his way into the celebrity speaking circuit after the war and got out of being a pariah. 😀
https://www.jta.org/2023/01/27/united-states/a-philadelphia-high-school-librarian-was-ordered-to-remove-a-poster-with-an-elie-wiesel-quote
They wound up being forced to put it back up. I think it was right to take it down. The last thing kids need is to be derailed from studying by being politicized and exhorted to save the world now. I never handed out fliers to kids. Ruined my life.
@Michael Ummm, this is all the thanks I get for coming to your defence? He only called me, “spineless”. 😀
PPS. Weird supernova remnant blows scientists’ minds
— https://media.nature.com/w1248/magazine-assets/d41586-023-00202-1/d41586-023-00202-1_23949188.jpg?as=webp
Talk about a blast from the past! This incredibly enormous explosion, in our celestial back yard, occurred in 1181, and we are still seeing the flying debris from it. It makes Abrams tanks look puny by comparison.
cf. https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-023-00202-1
Meanwhile, “The Donald”‘s comments:
“Get this crazy war ended, NOW. So easy to do!”
So easy! Ending a war is sooooo easy! I don’t think so.
Zorn:
cf. Quigley:
This is like watching mud wrestling!
https://imgs.search.brave.com/WkZxYBOcoYpryPK-ZFI1QhSjfXqvg22OmaO4HdyVtJY/rs:fit:720:479:1/g:ce/aHR0cHM6Ly9jZG4u/c2hvcnRwaXhlbC5h/aS9jbGllbnQvcV9n/bG9zc3kscmV0X2lt/Zy9odHRwczovL2xl/dHNmaXhpdC5jby51/ay93cC1jb250ZW50/L3VwbG9hZHMvMjAy/MC8wMi9tdWRkeS5q/cGc
BTW Putin has been making “peace” for almost a year now — and not doing a very good job of it. Ditto for Biden, Zelenskyy and probably a whole host of others. Why waste the opportunity to point fingers? Of course, this is actually “blood wrestling”; but never mind.
Sorry to butt in like this. Carry on…
PS. I agree more with Sebastien.
Peloni
So if you think you are so correct why were you silent on this
“Putin doesn’t seem too interested in peace.”
First statement on this thread
And by the way do not please misquote me. The definite and indefinite article is part of English grammar.
@Felix Silence is not complicity. That’s a crock. There is such a thing as innocent bystanders. People are responsible only for what they donot what they don’t do. First do no harm.Something terrorists and people who misunderstand how the Nazis came to power don’t understand. Most people most of the time go through life minding their own business most of the time and that’s called being normal.
Peloni
You were silent on this issue until I spoke up. Get it straight.
@Felix And speaking of history repeating itself, I see you are repeating your own pattern on Israpundit with the name calling. I realize you are trying to sound like Marx, but, unlike you, Marx had a thick skin when his volleys were returned to him and as he quoted in the preface to one of the editions of Capital, volume I, “If you can’t take the heat, get out of the kitchen.” You just got the first taste of it from Michael who never speaks that way to anybody.
@Felix Conflating WWII and the Shoah with current events is anachronistic even if equally anachronistically, both sides have been clumsily dredging up symbolism from that era. The beginning of the 18th Brumaire still applies.
“The Eighteenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte. Karl Marx 1852
I
Hegel remarks somewhere[*] that all great world-historic facts and personages appear, so to speak, twice. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second time as farce. Caussidière for Danton, Louis Blanc for Robespierre, the Montagne of 1848 to 1851[66] for the Montagne of 1793 to 1795, the nephew for the uncle. And the same caricature occurs in the circumstances of the second edition of the Eighteenth Brumaire.
Men make their own history, but they do not make it as they please; they do not make it under self-selected circumstances, but under circumstances existing already, given and transmitted from the past. The tradition of all dead generations weighs like a nightmare on the brains of the living. And just as they seem to be occupied with revolutionizing themselves and things, creating something that did not exist before, precisely in such epochs of revolutionary crisis they anxiously conjure up the spirits of the past to their service, borrowing from them names, battle slogans, and costumes in order to present this new scene in world history in time-honored disguise and borrowed language. Thus Luther put on the mask of the Apostle Paul, the Revolution of 1789-1814 draped itself alternately in the guise of the Roman Republic and the Roman Empire, and the Revolution of 1848 knew nothing better to do than to parody, now 1789, now the revolutionary tradition of 1793-95. In like manner, the beginner who has learned a new language always translates it back into his mother tongue, but he assimilates the spirit of the new language and expresses himself freely in it only when he moves in it without recalling the old and when he forgets his native tongue.
When we think about this conjuring up of the dead of world history, a salient difference reveals itself. Camille Desmoulins, Danton, Robespierre, St. Just, Napoleon, the heroes as well as the parties and the masses of the old French Revolution, performed the task of their time – that of unchaining and establishing modern bourgeois society – in Roman costumes and with Roman phrases. The first one destroyed the feudal foundation and cut off the feudal heads that had grown on it. The other created inside France the only conditions under which free competition could be developed, parceled-out land properly used, and the unfettered productive power of the nation employed; and beyond the French borders it swept away feudal institutions everywhere, to provide, as far as necessary, bourgeois society in France with an appropriate up-to-date environment on the European continent. Once the new social formation was established, the antediluvian colossi disappeared and with them also the resurrected Romanism – the Brutuses, the Gracchi, the publicolas, the tribunes, the senators, and Caesar himself. Bourgeois society in its sober reality bred its own true interpreters and spokesmen in the Says, Cousins, Royer-Collards, Benjamin Constants, and Guizots; its real military leaders sat behind the office desk and the hog-headed Louis XVIII was its political chief. Entirely absorbed in the production of wealth and in peaceful competitive struggle, it no longer remembered that the ghosts of the Roman period had watched over its cradle.
But unheroic though bourgeois society is, it nevertheless needed heroism, sacrifice, terror, civil war, and national wars to bring it into being. And in the austere classical traditions of the Roman Republic the bourgeois gladiators found the ideals and the art forms, the self-deceptions, that they needed to conceal from themselves the bourgeois-limited content of their struggles and to keep their passion on the high plane of great historic tragedy. Similarly, at another stage of development a century earlier, Cromwell and the English people had borrowed from the Old Testament the speech, emotions, and illusions for their bourgeois revolution. When the real goal had been achieved and the bourgeois transformation of English society had been accomplished, Locke supplanted Habakkuk.
Thus the awakening of the dead in those revolutions served the purpose of glorifying the new struggles, not of parodying the old; of magnifying the given task in the imagination, not recoiling from its solution in reality; of finding once more the spirit of revolution, not making its ghost walk again.
From 1848 to 1851, only the ghost of the old revolution circulated – from Marrast, the républicain en gants jaunes [Republican in yellow gloves], who disguised himself as old Bailly, down to the adventurer who hides his trivial and repulsive features behind the iron death mask of Napoleon. A whole nation, which thought it had acquired an accelerated power of motion by means of a revolution, suddenly finds itself set back into a defunct epoch, and to remove any doubt about the relapse, the old dates arise again – the old chronology, the old names, the old edicts, which had long since become a subject of antiquarian scholarship, and the old minions of the law who had seemed long dead. The nation feels like the mad Englishman in Bedlam [1] who thinks he is living in the time of the old Pharaohs and daily bewails the hard labor he must perform in the Ethiopian gold mines, immured in this subterranean prison, a pale lamp fastened to his head, the overseer of the slaves behind him with a long whip, and at the exits a confused welter of barbarian war slaves who understand neither the forced laborers nor each other, since they speak no common language. “And all this,” sighs the mad Englishman, “is expected of me, a freeborn Briton, in order to make gold for the Pharaohs.” “In order to pay the debts of the Bonaparte family,” sighs the French nation. The Englishman, so long as he was not in his right mind, could not get rid of his idée fixé of mining gold. The French, so long as they were engaged in revolution, could not get rid of the memory of Napoleon, as the election of December 10 [1848, when Louis Bonaparte was elected President of the French Republic by plebiscite.] was proved. They longed to return from the perils of revolution to the fleshpots of Egypt [2], and December 2, 1851 [The date of the coup d’état by Louis Bonaparte], was the answer. Now they have not only a caricature of the old Napoleon, but the old Napoleon himself, caricatured as he would have to be in the middle of the nineteenth century.
The social revolution of the nineteenth century cannot take its poetry from the past but only from the future. It cannot begin with itself before it has stripped away all superstition about the past. The former revolutions required recollections of past world history in order to smother their own content. The revolution of the nineteenth century must let the dead bury their dead in order to arrive at its own content. There the phrase went beyond the content – here the content goes beyond the phrase.”
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1852/18th-brumaire/ch01.htm
@Felix I agree that Putin should have been invited, along with the British Prime Minister, and American President but the statement that it was primarily the Soviet Union that liberated the camps was hyperbole.
“In the east, the camps were liberated by the [Red Army]: it liberated Majdanek in July 1944, Auschwitz on 27 January, 1945, and the concentration camps of Gross-Rosen, Sachsenhausen, Ravensbrück, Stutthoff, and Theresienstadt in the ensuing months.
In the West, American troops liberated Buchenwald, Dachau, Dora-Mittelbau, Flossenbürg, and Mauthausen, among other camps. When British forces entered Bergen-Belsen on 15 April, 1945, they found some 60,000 inmates, many of whom were in critical condition from severe malnutrition and a raging typhus epidemic, surrounded by thousands of unburied corpses. The broadcasts from the liberated camps by BBC correspondent Richard Dimbleby and CBS’s Ed Murrow had huge impact on their listeners, as did film footage in newsreels.
On 12 April, 1945, together with US Generals George S. Patton and Omar Bradley, General Dwight D. Eisenhower, Supreme Commander of the Allied Forces in Europe, visited the site of Ohrdruf concentration camp. Afterward, Eisenhower cabled General George C. Marshall, the head of the Joint Chiefs of Staff in Washington, D.C., writing that “The things I saw beggar description. . . . I made the visit deliberately, in order to be in a position to give first-hand evidence of these things if ever, in the future, there develops a tendency to charge these allegations merely to ‘propaganda.’”
[Red Army: the army and air force of the Soviet Union. Eventually decisive in World War II, the Red Army initially struggled to respond adequately to the German invasion: weakened by the purges of the officer corps in the 1930s and hampered by Stalin’s early refusal to take the advice of his generals. After a bitter struggle in 1942, the Red Army began to have successes following the defeat of German forces at Stalingrad in January 1943. With the help of American aid, Soviet forces pushed the German forces back into the Reich, finally taking Berlin in April-May 1945. Historians estimate that the Red Army lost approximately 8.7 million dead and a further 4.6 million missing during World War II.] ”
https://aboutholocaust.org/en/facts/who-liberated-the-nazi-concentration-camps-and-extermination-centers
And the Jewish Legion embedded within the British Army and the mostly Jewish Tunisian resistance in Operation Torch defeated the Germans in North Africa.
@Felix
Forgive me, but you seem somewhat confused on the details here, or perhaps I am unaware of something, and if so you can enlighten me.
The insults did not come from the Jews in Poland. The insults came first from the the director of the Auschwitz Birkenaw museum and later from the Polish PM, neither of whom are Jews. Furthermore, the insult was intended to abuse Russia and Putin, but the true casualty of these abusive fantasies, which are reminiscent of a bad Polish joke, was the memorial to the victims who were to be reminisced upon, not Russia and not Putin. In truth, Russia and Putin are attacked on a daily basis and with far more effective invectives than those which I have read mentioned by either of these fake news spouting Pole-scentric bureaucrats. In fact, if there is to be a grievance to be noted, it should be noted that the grievance emanated from these Polish propagandists was primarily lodged at the victims of the Holocaust for which the International Holocaust Memorial Day was established – I believe the correct title is “International Day Of Commemoration In Memory Of The Victims Of The Holocaust” – and it was intended to both commemorate the victims of the Holocaust as well as to set aside the denialism of the Holocaust as an historic and factual event. Hence, when PM Morawiecki used this event to lodge the capricious claim that Putin was “building new camps”, he purposefully provided an association between the fact of the Holocaust and the fiction of his own propaganda. Consequently, I would suggest that the primary casualty in all of this, was not the Russians, but the very basis for which this memorial event was established. In any event, it was not the Jews of Poland who made these irrelevant and false references, as you seem to believe is the case.
Sebastien lesson in diversion from you
“It was a combined Allied effort
https://aboutholocaust.org/en/facts/who-liberated-the-nazi-concentration-camps-and-extermination-centers
but nobody bothered to bomb the tracks to the camps, the gas chambers, the crematoria, or the German officers or guards quarters during the war, even when they were carpet bombing nearby targets, They did occasionally bomb industrial sections using Jewish slave labor. Our lives meant nothing to them. We didn’t have a state.”
Well that was a nasty little diversion if ever I saw one
You had a big chance to defend Putin and refused it.
I know my history so the above does not educate
What does educate a lot is that you’re silent on the studied insult to Putin and Russia from Jews in Poland
Sebastien as usual much blabbering from you but you are basically spineless
@Felix It was a combined Allied effort
https://aboutholocaust.org/en/facts/who-liberated-the-nazi-concentration-camps-and-extermination-centers
but nobody bothered to bomb the tracks to the camps, the gas chambers, the crematoria, or the German officers or guards quarters during the war, even when they were carpet bombing nearby targets, They did occasionally bomb industrial sections using Jewish slave labor. Our lives meant nothing to them. We didn’t have a state.
Peloni thank you
“I am aware of the position of the Jewish community of Russia and the position of the State of Israel regarding the role and importance of the Red Army in defeating Nazism and fascism. We highly appreciate this, but to reiterate, this matter is of particular importance for our people.
You are also aware that the investigating authorities and the Prosecutor’s Office of the Russian Federation continue to deploy serious efforts trying to identify crimes of this type committed against any citizens of the former Soviet Union, regardless of their ethnic origin. Without a doubt, this work is a major contribution to the efforts seeking to bring to light the crimes committed by the Nazis against the Jews as well.
We know that Jewish organizations…”
This represents a big change from Stalinism because Stalinism frowned on nation seeing it as a diversion from socialism.
But it really was not.
In these words of Putin he is at a time of great tension and worry for Russia reaching out to Jews as a separate independent nation.
In the 1930s Trotsky was moving to exactly this kind of sensitivity to nation. This is well recorded and in the book by Joseph Nedava.
That is my feeling as well.
Here is a transcript of Putin’s conversation with Chief Rabbi Berel Lazar and President of the Federation of Jewish Communities of Russia Alexander Boroda:
This Content Was Published at https://collive.com/russian-president-putin-summons-chief-rabbi-to-the-kremlin/
@Felix
It was equally wise and appropriate that Putin’s comment ignored the political attack made against Russia and himself by the Polish political activist, Piotr Cywinski, who runs the Auschwitz-Birkenau museum and is suppose to be responsible for the event at the museum commemorating the Russian emancipation of Auschwitz-Birkenau camp. Cywinski refused to invite the Russians to participate in this solemn event, and instead use his position as director of the museum to distort the meaning and purpose of the event which he has been entrusted to oversee by attacking the Russians rather than inviting them.
Instead of focusing upon the petty attempt by Cywinski to distract from the solemnity of the occaision, Putin instead met with the Russia’s Chief Rabbi as well as the leader of the Russian Federation’s Jewish communities. Their words were relevant to the occasion, unlike the injection of Cywinski’s political assault into the very event which should have been his sole focus.
President Vladimir Putin sent a message to the organisers and participants of events held as part of International Holocaust Remembrance Day and the 78th anniversary of the liberation of prisoners at the Auschwitz-Birkenau (Oswiecim) concentration camp by the Red Army.
It was primarily the Soviet nation that put an end to the barbaric Nazi plans in 1945 by standing up for the freedom and independence of its motherland, saving the Jewish people and other ethnic groups from ..
total annihilation and enslavement.
We must clearly understand that any attempts to revise our country’s contribution to achieving the Great Victory de facto means justifying Nazi crimes and paves the way to reviving its deadly ideology. Horrible tragedies can happen again if we
..forget the lessons of history, as demonstrated by the crimes against civilians, ethnic cleansing and punitive operations carried out by neo-Nazis in Ukraine. It is this evil that our warriors are currently fighting courageously, shoulder to shoulder”
Lest we forget.
Sebastien you did have the chance to challenge his hatred to Putin. You were silent.
Your reference to the Maidan Coup is correct. Yes the BBC covered it a little but now hide it.
So how is Michael right. He hides it as.well
Michael SAYS
“Putin doesn’t seem too interested in peace. The only thing his offensive is likely to accomplish, is more Western involvement in Ukraine.”
And noone on Israpundit replies to this hate mongering attack on Russia.
NOONE
Michael
You write
“Felix, get lost!”
Try to control yourself. My points are political and not personal and need answering.
I think you are both right. However, there was no animosity between Moscow and Kiev before the US backed Maidan coups and the ensuing violence against Russian speaking Ukrainians, 14,000 dead in 8 years. The BBC covered it.
Felix, get lost!
“hails back to the time of Genghis Khan”
And in the same breath accused me of red herring
Just tell what you believe happened in the Maidan Coup 2014
If you do not know or do not want to just explain why you refuse to
Simple
Felix, you are as disingenuous as the day is long. You said you were concerned about the current East-West Cold War (very wrongly labeled the “Ukraine” crisis) escalating into a nuclear war. I explained that this current “Cold War” is nothing but a remake of the old “Cold War”; and that its dynamics are the same: This war, like the previous war, is based on the doctrine of “Mutually Assured Destruction” (MAD). None of this has any relationship to the history of the Kiev-Moscow animosity, which hails back to the time of Genghis Khan. You are ignoring this elephant in the living room, and bringing up one red herring after the other.
As I said before, I am not interested in your nonesense!
Michael you are too dismissive because I don’t agree with you. The history is very important.
Putin “invaded” because there was a fascist led genocide in operation against Ukrainian Russians.
Why do you not deal with that?
Hi, Felix.
Give me a hint… “with Cain and Abel?” Ask a silly question, and you get a silly answer. I don’t care much, when it began. You seemed concerned about how it will end. I answered that. Please don’t bother me with this stuff.
Michael writes
‘Putin doesn’t seem too interested in peace. The only thing his offensive is likely to accomplish, is more Western involvement in Ukraine.”
On the contrary Putin has been seeking peace with Imperialism since he took over from Yeltsin, not submission though, submission is not peace.
I ask Michael when did this war begin?
Putin doesn’t seem too interested in peace. The only thing his offensive is likely to accomplish, is more Western involvement in Ukraine.