Andrew G. Bostom, New English Review
Melanie Phillips attended what she termed a “riveting” debate between the much ballyhooed former Hizbut Tahrir enthusiast Ed Husain and the Somali secularist and former Dutch Parliamentarian Ayaan Hirsi Ali and commented in The Anti-jihadi Debate. Two years ago I discussed at some length Ayaan Hirsi Ali’s lucid argumentation and moral and physical courage. She remains the same noble, eloquent, and committed person.
Phillips somehow found Husain’s arguments more “persuasive.” But in essence he simply repeats the same ahistorical, apologetic prattle about rediscovering factitious golden eras of Islam’s “own religious traditions of peaceful co-existence”—ignoring that this false construction is merely a euphemism for jihad-imposed dhimmitude, or for those societies not vanquished by jihad, what the great Belgian scholar of Islam Armand Arbel described as follows:
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…perpetual war should be their lot, waged in the course of the winter and summer ghazu. [razzias] If the sovereign of the country thus attacked desired peace, it was possible for him, just like for any other tributary or community, to pay the tribute for himself and for his subjects. Thus the [Byzantine] Empress Irene [d. 803] “purchased peace at the price of her humiliation”, according to the formula stated in the dhimma contract itself, by paying 70,000 pounds in gold annually to the Caliph of Baghdad. Many other princes agreed in this way to become tributaries – often after long struggles – and to see their dominions pass from the status of dar al Harb to that of dar al Sulh.
We get some hint at Phillips curious reasoning, or rather reductio ad absurdum argumentation, with this comment which ostensibly demonstrates how she “understands” Islam’s own depredations: “…not to mention the violence and oppression it [Islam] practised towards other faiths (although not as bad as Christian upon Jew) [emphasis added].” Not only is this tu quoque “reasoning” (which trivializes the historical treatment of Jews in Muslim societies—chronic oppression, punctuated by outbursts of mass anti-Jewish violence, forced conversion to Islam, or expulsion—while ignoring the fact that there are no Jewish communities left in the Arab world, other than persecuted vestigial remnants of cemetery watchers, while here in a 90% rather devoutly Christian America we Jews do quite well, and haven’t ever experienced a pogrom in 250 years of inhabiting this blessed country), it is a reductio ad absurdum that negates the hundreds of millions of non-Jews (estimated here) slaughtered and enslaved and mutilated by jihad—Hindus, Buddhists, Christians, Animists—through the present era.
Phillips’ “conclusion” is lamentable (and shallow) enough. Worse still, she blithely ignores Husain’s malicious, immoral equivalence between Zionism and jihadism, most notably the modern incarnations of this permanent, and genocidal Islamic institution. The “brave reformer” she champions, Husain made these nauseating proclamations in his June 2007 diatribe:
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Zionism and Islamism are both political perversions of ancient Abrahamic faiths of Judaism and Islam…. Disregard for the sanctity of human life is a hallmark of both Zionism and Islamism…Just as Israel is an expansionist state which remains in occupation of the Golan Heights, Islamists plan for a state that would have an occupying army to support ever-expanding borders Just as Zionists claim territory based on notions of “Jewish land” and God-given rights, Islamists wish to reconquer India and Spain as “Muslim land”, once ruled by Muslim monarchs…Zionists have achieved their state; Islamists are busy trying out every conceivable option to bring their dream Zion to fruition. For centuries, Jewish people said “Next year in Jerusalem”, and for decades for now, Islamists have been repeating “Caliphate by next Ramadan.”Behind every single world event, from the Holocaust to 9/11, Arab Islamists blamed a global Zionist conspiracy. Similarly, in Jewish circles, Zionists from Binyamin Netanyahu to Daniel Pipes have made careers out of lambasting Islamists. But are Islamists and Zionists really all that different, despite their blatant enmity? I think not
Both the rather uninformed Ms. Phillips, and the unreformed Antisemitic Muslim bigot Ed Husain would do well to heed the words of Bat Ye’or—our greatest living scholar of dhimmitude, herself victimized by this oppressive, living Islamic institution—on Zionism:
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The word “Zion”, which designates the land of Israel and its capital Jerusalem, exists in texts dating back almost three millennia. It was the Emperor Hadrian who called this country Palestine in 135 C.E. In this Palestine, Arabic was not the spoken language, the Bible and not the Koran was taught, and the population was mainly Jewish. Palestine was colonized five centuries later by the Arab armies of the Islamic jihad. Many Jews were massacred at that time, others deported to Arabia as slaves, the whole population expropriated and reduced to the condition of dhimmis, as were all indigenous Jews and Christians in the south Mediterranean countries conquered by jihad, as well as those in many European countries. Are these countries conquered by Islam – Portugal, Spain, Sardinia, Sicily, Crete, and the southern regions of France and Italy, for example – Arab lands?
If the liberation movement of the Jews in their ancestral homeland is interpreted as racism, then all the movements of liberation from expropriation and servitude imposed by jihad are racist. Such a stance reinstates the imperialism of the Islamic jihad, which has claimed millions of victims in three continents over more than a millennium, deported an incalculable number of slaves, annihilated entire peoples, destroying their history, their monuments and their culture.
…the conference against racism in Durban [August 2001} did not condemn this culture of hate; they rehabilitated it. When some of their propositions condemn Zionism, this conference is encouraging jihad, the culture of the war against infidels, it is scourging the principles of freedom and human rights. It is demonstrating negationist racism.
Ed Husain has merely exchanged his turban for the more acceptable Islamic Antisemitism/Anti-Zionism expressed at Durban. And Ms. Phillips just as desperately needs to become far better informed, shed her Spiritual Turban, and realize that she too, “…cannot stop the inquiring mind at the gates of any religion—let alone Islam.” Phillips must begin to realize the perversity of her willful ignorance about the contents of books such as Why I am Not a Muslim. In the words of that book’s author, Ibn Warraq, “How do they [those like Phillips] think reformation will come about if not with [such] criticism?”
Go to New English Review for more links.
Actually Churchill had praise for Jews and held them in high esteem.
Mr. Belman I do not take you for an idiot. Whether you ban me or not is up to your sole discretion and I shall be pleased with which ever way you decide. I am not a propagandist for anyone or anything. You are right I have never written anything attacking Islam but I have written posts against the actions of some Muslims.
Thats very interesting that you refer to yourself as a democrat and a liberal when all of the comments both by yourself and others in response to my question have neither been democratic nor liberal. I would really like to know how you think Islam will be eradicated from the face of the earth, that is why I asked my question in the first place. In response to this question I received a barrage of abuse including a call for me to murdered from the respondents here.
As I said to Jeff it seems that the view of the world here and I might me wrong is one that involves Muslims either becoming apostates from their religion or being murder. If I am wrong in this understanding please forgive me but I think that you cannot label yourselves as democrats nor liberals.
Mr. Nomad,
I would like to ask you why you entrust your soul to a god that sanctifies:
-genocidal murder and ethnic cleansing
-rape
-pedophilia
-kidnapping
-slave trading
-thievery
-misogyny
-lying
-torture
-antiSemistism and Christophobia?
The sole ‘prophet’ of Islam, Muhammad, engaged in all of the aforementioned activites.
This is not my opinion. This is documented in Islamic scripture – Qur’an, Sunnah and Sira.
The Qur’an consists of 114 suras (87 suras that were revealed to Muhammad while he resided in Mecca and 27 suras that were revealed to him following his migration to Yahrib,aka Medina).
As you well know, the early more benign Meccan suras have been abrogated in favor of the more belligerent, hostile and vile Medinan suras.
I did not make up the rules of Islamic scriptural exegesis.
Since you are a peaceful Muslim, aka as a “hypocrite” according to Islamic scripture, how does it make you feel that Allah and Muhammad despise you?
How would Muhammad deal with Muslims with your beliefs?
To answer you questions about halacha, I do not adhere to rabbinical halachic beliefs and rules.
I accept Scripture (Torah/Tanach) as the inspired Word of Elohim. I also accept The Renewed Covenant Scriptures when they line up with the Torah and Tanach.
Jeff
k_nomad
Any Muslim who thinks Islam is a religion of peace is either deaf dumb or a propagandist.
Do you take us for idiots.
I intend to ban you because you are propagandist. Show me something that you have written that attacks Islam. Any person who revers Mohammed is not a friend of ddemocrats or liberals.
O.K. Let me try to answer Laura first then Jeff.
Laura said :k_nomad, why don’t you get lost, your kind is not wanted here
Thats funny Laura because if you look carefully I am listed on the blogroll at Israpundit.
Laura said:I have nothing but hatred for the likes of you
I am happy that you hate me please feel free to do so, you will hear no complaint from me.
Laura said: Ayaan Hirsi Ali exposes to the world the unvarnished truth about the horrors of islam, so you wish to silence her voice.
I do not want to silence her as far as I am concerned she can say and do whatever she likes. In fact if you go to my blog so can see a copy of Submission the film she made with Theo Van Gough. Hardly the act of person trying to silence her message.
Laura: the mass extermination of muslims would be a perfectly justifiable response to the global jihad and for the sake of saving the world from this deadly disease
Oh dear Laura its not very lady like to advocate mass murder of innocents even if they are brown skinned smelly camel jockeys.
Laura: islamic “men” are the lowest form of life in the universe, they are sub-human genetic mutations
Please let all your pent up venom out. Use this as some type of cathartic process after all I am personally responsible for all the ills of the world.
Laura said: In the words of Winston Churchill: Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog. That is when the west had real leaders who were not afraid to speak the truth.
Winston Churchill a charming fellow indeed. Since you are partial to quoting him about Muslims I wonder what he had to say about “Hebrews”?
Now onto Jeff….
Jeff said : I would like to ask you, Mr. Nomad, if you are a peaceful Muslim (regarded as a “hypocrite” in the Qur’an)
If you are not a peaceful Muslim or a ‘hypocrite’ according to the Qur’an and Sunnah, are you a pious Muslim?
Do you adhere to Qur’anic principles and follow Islamic scripture?
Do you view Muhammad as the “perfect man?”
Yes Jeff I am a peaceful Muslim. Yes I try my best to be a pious Muslim. Yes I do follow Quranic principles and follow Islamic scripture. Yes I do view Mohammad as the perfect man. Having said that I think that your interpretation of the Qur’an and Islamic scripture is different to mine. You read the Quran and see incitement to hate, murder and rape while I read the same Qur’an and dont see those things. I think that says more about you than me.
Jeff said : Allah is not the same Elohim (Most Mighty One, sometimes referred to as The Almighty or God) as the Elohim of Avraham, Yitzchak and Ya’acov. Allah is Satan and Muhammad was a demon.
Your hatred for Allah is you own choice but seems to be rather misplaced as according to Halachic authorities Muslims worship the one-and-only G-d who they call Allah.
So I am confused now , do I follow your statement that Allah is Satan or do I follow Jewish Halachic authorities who say that Allah is the one-and-only G-d, Elohim?
K_Nomad,
After reading my initial post above (#1), why did you ask me the question you did in post #2?
I have never advocated for or supported the annihilation of Muslims.
I do not behave like Muhammad did, nor as jihadists or pious Muslims do.
I would like to ask you, Mr. Nomad, if you are a peaceful Muslim (regarded as a “hypocrite” in the Qur’an)?
If you are a peaceful Muslim, perhaps you should read this:
http://prophetofdoom.net/Islamic_Quotes_Peaceful_Muslims.Islam
If you are not a peaceful Muslim or a ‘hypocrite’ according to the Qur’an and Sunnah, are you a pious Muslim?
Do you adhere to Qur’anic principles and follow Islamic scripture?
Do you view Muhammad as the “perfect man?”
Only by knowing the truth about Muhammad, the history and legacy of jihad, Islamic imperialism, Islamic antisemitism/christophobia and the institution of dhimmitude, will you be able to shed the yolk of Islam.
Allah is not the same Elohim (Most Mighty One, sometimes referred to as The Almighty or God) as the Elohim of Avraham, Yitzchak and Ya’acov. Allah is Satan and Muhammad was a demon.
Jeff
k_nomad, why don’t you get lost, your kind is not wanted here. I have nothing but hatred for the likes of you. Ayaan Hirsi Ali exposes to the world the unvarnished truth about the horrors of islam, so you wish to silence her voice. BTW the mass extermination of muslims would be a perfectly justifiable response to the global jihad and for the sake of saving the world from this deadly disease. muslims have waged war on us, and we have every right to fight back. islamic “men” are the lowest form of life in the universe, they are sub-human genetic mutations. islam is the religion of rape and murder. In the words of Winston Churchill: Islam is as dangerous in a man as rabies in a dog. That is when the west had real leaders who were not afraid to speak the truth. Now we have cowardly leaders who pretend islam is something that it’s most definitely not, “a religion of peace”.
BTW, why do we suddenly have this influx of muslims here? This is the second one today.
Jeff I am not in any way putting words in your mouth. I asked a question which I noticed you quite conveniently did not answer in your reply.
As for your intricate knowledge of Islam do you not think that your representation is rather stark ? There seems to be no room to a Muslim without being a terrorist. As a Muslim what would you suggest I do to remove the yoke of Islam from my neck ?
Mr. k_nomad,
Don’t put words in my mouth.
I am not one for the straw-man argument.
Read what I wrote.
As I stated above and as you may or may not know, the greatest number of Islam’s victims are Muslims themselves.
According to the Qur’an a Muslim can either be pious (follow the Qur’an and Sunnah and aspire to be a disciple of Muhammad) or a hypocrite (not follow the Qur’an, Sunnah and aspire to be a disciple of Muhammad). Pious Muslims are jihadists and terrorists. Peaceful Muslims are hypocrites.
Only by knowing the unvarnished truth about Islam and Muhammad can Muslims escape from the yoke of Islam.
Bombs and bullets alone will never defeat the global jihad being waged against dar al Harb (the house of war, i.e. the infidel nations).Perhaps you should familiarize yourself with the websites listed below in order to begin learning about:
Islam, Jihad and Dhimmitude:
http://www.jihadwatch.org
http://www.andrewbostom.org
http://www.prophetofdoom.net
http://www.religionofpeace.com
http://www.faithfreedom.org
http://www.islamanazi.com
Jeff(sanderzack@yahoo.com)
Jeff so would you advocate mass annihilation of Muslims in order to save western civilisation ?
By the way there is a Dutch television expose of Ayaan Hirsi Ali on Youtube.
Andrew Bostom’s latest book, “The Legacy Of Islamic Antisemitism” will be released early next year (Gregorian Calendar). It is a work that is a MUST READ.
In my opinion Islam can never be reformed (what is meant by reform anyway?) or changed
The truth about Islam and Muhammad must understood, internalized and taught to the masses if we are to survive as a civilization.
I make the above statement knowing that the greatest number of victims of Islam have been and continue to be Muslims themselves.
Jeff (sanderzack@yahoo.com)