Trump says 500,000 refugees. I say, no way, no how.

18 Comments / 18 Comments

1. EXECUTIVE SUMMARY: The next few weeks could be remembered in the annals of the Israeli-Palestinian conflict as historic. The US administration is due to decide at the beginning of September whether to stop its funding for the United Nations Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees in the Near East (UNRWA). Such a decision could be as significant as Harry Truman’s decision to recognize the State of Israel just 11 minutes after the Jewish State declared its independence in May 1948.

   By withdrawing from UNRWA, the Trump administration is trying to take the refugee problem off the table – a sensible move, since it has always been a non-starter. There is wide consensus in Israeli society not to allow Palestinian “registered refugees” to “return” to Israel, so the Palestinian demand for a “right of return” – their standard code word for Israel’s destruction through demographic subversion – has blocked every attempt at peace negotiations in the past.

   An American decision to stop supporting UNRWA would be an announcement that the US understands that the “refugee problem” is a political disguise for the Palestinians’ real aim, which is to dismantle the State of Israel entirely. Removing this disguise would do a huge service not only to the cause of peace but also to the security and future of the Jewish State.

   https://besacenter.org/perspectives-papers/unrwa-historic-decision/

2. @ Edgar G.:

   The UNHRC, which again deals with all other refugees outside the Palestinian arena, has a fairly sensible definition of a refugee: “A refugee is someone who has been forced to flee his or her country because of persecution, war or violence. A refugee has a well-founded fear of persecution for reasons of race, religion, nationality, political opinion or membership in a particular social group.”

   https://www.breitbart.com/jerusalem/2018/08/29/klein-trump-advancing-real-mideast-peace-by-exposing-palestinian-refugee-myth/

3. Email received.

   On the number of refugees if you have read “From Time Immemorial” by Joan Peters she says the number is around 300,000. This book is the ultimate guide to the Arab-Jewish conflict and should be read by everyone. It has 200 pages of references. All of her facts are backed up by research. She says that when the Arabs found out that the UN and other agencies would be giving aid to the “refugees”, thousand came in from all the surrounding countries to stake a claim for aid and “reparations”.

4. I posted today an old article by Ettinger in which he explains the discrepancy between the 700,000 figure and the 350,000 one.

   To these numbers must be added the refugees from the Six Day war

5. @ Ted Belman:

   Thank you for your kind appreciation, but what I dredged up was something I’m pretty certain you had already known. My concern is that Trump specifically named Abdullah. And as we’ve seen he’s been giving him the “royal treatment'”. Of course if as you say, he’s already on his way out, and can’t hold his position, then Zahran is the perfect recipient. Wanting the very best of amicable relations with Israel he certainly would not make the slightest claim to YESHA.

6. Ted Belman Said:

   Trump intends to pressure Lebanon, Syria and Iraq to give citizenship to the Palestinian refugees living in those countries. This was stated publicly.

   Can you post that article?

7. Thank you Bear and Edgar for your excellent research.

   I am not overly concerned with Trump’s statements that Israel will have to pay a price. I was quite surprised by Freidman’s remark and do not believe that Israel’s options are so limited. What I hope is going to happen is that Jordan will replace the PA in the administration of many area A communities like Ramallah. Others will be annexed by Israel. That is not to say that Israel will have to provide a path to citizenship for Arabs in those areas. They will all have Jordanian citizenship. Israel will have no obligation to give Israel citizenship to citizens of another country..

   Whenever Trump refers to Jordan, assume he is referring to Jordan led by Zahran and not Abdullah.

   Trump intends to pressure Lebanon, Syria and Iraq to give citizenship to the Palestinian refugees living in those countries. This was stated publicly.

   The Plan B to killing UNRWA is that Jordan will provide the same services in Jordan to all former refugees should they opt to emigrate there.

8. WASHINGTON — US ambassador to Israel David Friedman does not feel a sense of urgency to launch the Trump administration’s Israeli-Palestinian peace initiative anytime soon, and questions the extent to which Gaza can be resuscitated after twelve years under Hamas rule, according to a participant on an off-record call the envoy recently granted to an American Jewish organization.

   Journalists were on the call unbeknownst to the ambassador and published its contents on Wednesday. As first reported in Jewish Insider, the envoy said that no “timetable” exists for the release of their peace plan and clarified that President Donald Trump does not seek a reciprocal move by Israel after the US moved its embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem in May.

   https://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Friedman-in-call-set-low-expectations-for-peace-process-and-Gaza-566100

9. @ Edgar G.:
   I am waiting for Trump and his team to formally come out and say what their plan actually is. Then I will react to it. Until then everything is rumor or conjecture in my view.

10. @ Bear Klein:

    I didn’t say that Trump was “giving” anything to anyone. I am only repeating what I have read, that Trump is encouraging Abdullah to reclaim Jordan’s illegal and abandoned 19 year occupation in YESHA, and of course the people living there. That, coupled with Friedman’s ignorant statement that Israel will have to either allow the YESHA Arabs to have their own state or take them into Israel , basically a bi-national state, causes me considerable alarm. It seems that formerly divergent threads are slowing coming together towards a focal point , which bodes no good for Israel.

    Trump said, in documented words, that Israel would have to pay a lot for the Embassy move, and Friedman has been downplaying it saying he didn’t mean that, that there is no quid pro quo, and he only meant that maybe Israel, in consideration of what the US did for them could “lean a little” towards the Arab side…..

    All ominous to me. I sincerely hope that TED is correct in saying that Trump’s plan is basically the same as what he has been advocating, “The Jordan Option.”..

11. @ Edgar G.:
    I have seen nothing concrete that Trump is giving parts of YESHA to Jordan. It is not his to give in any case. There are sorts of rumors some wildly different. This has been the case for years rumors about potential peace proposals and people write articles about the rumors.

12. @ Bear Klein:

    I also read yesterday FOR THE VERY FIRST TIME, a brand new definition of “refugee” which stated that the UN Refugee Agency regarded the refugees themselves “AND the FIRST GENERATION as bone fide refugees.

    The original number of refugees has always been grossly inflated, an old Arab trick to get more freebies. I saw some tears ago that when UNWRA was trying to register genuine refugees, there would be those who’d come a second time with a switched backwards name , and even a third time with another name.

    Joan Peters “From Time Immemorial” deeply researched her data, and whilst there were those who criticised her writing style, and qualifications as a historian, there were no criticisms of the number of refugees she indicated. It was between 320,000 and 360,000. There are others, whose names elude me who did more detailed investigation and came up with 230,000 to 275,000.

    Trump’s 500,000 may be just a “come-on” for the Arabs who know they’vebeen getting away with the biggest scam in history for far too long. but what worries me is that the Trump about bolstering Jordan,included that Abdullah should reclaim his rights to YESHA. … This is a definite NO as far as I and any true Jew is concerned. They were illegal belligerent occupiers for less than 20 years and they scurried away giving up any claim they had which was zero anyway.

13. In July, the American Center for Law and Justice obtained a version of the report via a Freedom of Information Act request and a subsequent lawsuit. Unfortunately, it was heavily redacted and omitted the most crucial information: the true number of refugees.

    Recent media reports citing State Department sources pin the total at just 20,000 refugees, nowhere near the 5.3 million that UNRWA claims the State Department has adopted.

    But the public will not know for sure unless the Trump administration releases an unredacted version of the report.

    http://www.israelhayom.com/opinions/unrwa-fiction-may-soon-be-exposed/

14. Trump Will Demand UN Revoke 90% of Palestinians’ Refugee Status
    Seeks to dramatically curb refugee aid into West Bank – Jason Ditz

    According to media reports in Israel, President Trump is poised to demand that the UN Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA), which handles aid to 5.3 million Palestinian refugees across the Middle East, formally revoke refugee status from over 90% of them.

    President Trump had been reported to want to undercut the UNRWA in the past, pressuring Jordan to revoke the refugee status of the millions of Palestinians there. He now wants a global cap of Palestinian refugees of 500,000, irrespective of circumstances.

    Trump is said in particular to object to the idea that the children of refugees are also refugees. In practice, however, the refugees are stateless, and with the US opposing the right of return, the refugees are in a practical multi-generational refugee status with no end in sight.

    Previous reports suggested Trump wanted to “handle” the problem of the large number of refugees by redefining it down to a more manageable number. It seems, however, this will be done by simple diktat, and that there is no plan for what happens to the other 4.8 million refugees once they’re off the books.

    https://news.antiwar.com/2018/08/05/kushner-pushes-for-millions-of-palestinians-in-jordan-to-lose-refugee-status/

15. The news reports say Trump wants to slash the numbers from 5 million to 500,000.

    As for Jordan, as I keep saying that with Zahran at the helm of Jordan all things are possible. In all my conversations with Zahran I insisted that he open up Jordan’s borders to unlimited Palestinian immigration. He is in full agreement.. I believe that the US peace plan is essentially my plan.

16. JERUSALEM, Israel – The Trump administration’s support of Israel got another potential boost with reports it’s planning to remove the so-called “right of return” from the negotiating table, Israel’s Channel 2 news reported over the weekend.

    According to the report, the US administration will present the new plan in stages, beginning in early September. The plan details the Trump administration’s rejection of the United Nation’s definition of Palestinian refugee status.

    The news follows the US State Department announcement to Congress that it will cut more than $200 million in bilateral aid to the Palestinian Authority and redirect the funds to “high priority projects elsewhere.”

    http://www1.cbn.com/cbnnews/israel/2018/august/trump-admin-slashes-200m-in-palestinian-aid-may-drop-right-of-return-from-negotiating-table

17. Ted, I believe this is more of a cap and USA will be trying to have refugees in UNRWA defined as a refugee normally is by a person who has actual a particular place and not all his descendants also, as UNRWA does.

    “The American administration stops recognizing the approximately 5 million Palestinian refugees listed by the United Nations Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA), which is charged with aiding them. From now on, only those who were de facto refugees in 1948 will be considered refugees today.”

    Read more: http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/originals/2018/08/israel-us-palestinians-unrwa-donald-trump-refugees-prosor.html#ixzz5PaMIwLG0

18. Are they actual saying that are that many refugees or this is the most people UNRWA should be handling? Very confusing. Trump’s team looks like it wants to try to close UNRWA and this is part of their attempt to do that.

    Also is Jordan willing to take the UNRWA participants from the “camps” in Samaria?