By Ted Belman
As the voting day draws closer speculation increases and various parties consider their moves. Yacomovich and Livni talk about a united opposition. Lapid prefers to join the government. Netanyahu said he is open to a coalition that includes center-left parties providing they accept his principles. No surprise there.
But now Lieberman has said that the day after the elections he will separate from Likud. This means before the government is formed.
Livni, Yacomovich and Lapid are polling about 37 seats. Netanyahu and Lieberman about 36 seats. If Lieberman splits than Likud is down to 24 seats and Lieberman gets 12 seats. Thus Netanyahu could form a government with the 37. The only thing that could stop him from doing so is if a faction, 8 seats, of Likud splits and joins Leiberman 12 and Bennet 16 and Eldad 4. Total 40, against centre left with remaining, Likud 52. Shas could put Netanyahu slightly over the 60 seats required.
Will the left accept his principles and join or will Bibi yield on his principles?
If the left don’t unite with Bibi and if Lieberman joins Bennett then they will have the largest bloc 28 and could be invited to form the govenrnment. In this case it would join with Netanyahu and Lapid and Shas to form a government.
It’s Devolin, not “Dervolin”. And you don’t sound Irish to me. You sound Serbian.
“I do think he is saying this so he had better explain…”
Or else what, Quigley? You gonna beat me up? As they say in Northern Ireland, “I’ll punch the face off ye!” “I’d hit you so hard, you’d starve to death bouncing,” as my Dad would say.
“Can Dervolin tell us anything he is doing to combat this Antisemitism?”
None of your business, Mr. Universalist.
“Is Dervolin saying that to be Irish is to be Antisemitic?”
Pretty much. A lot like being Polish or Ukrainian or Romanian or Lithuanian or Hungarian, etc. But maybe you’re writing from Ulster? The Prods aren’t as bad as the Cat-lickers as regards anti-Jewish hatred. May G-D heal the Republic. You actually approve of the Protestants to having their own state in the north (which is what they have now)? That’s not very Irish of you. Do you walk with a limp? Keep talking like that and you will have a limp. This is why it’s hard for me to believe you are writing from the Republic of Ireland. Perhaps you’re an informant for the Brits. I cannot understand your twisted views, both about the Jews and the Republic of Ireland. But this blog isn’t about Ireland, save only when the subject is Ireland’s penchant for anti-Jewish hatred and pro-Palestinian maleficence.
“…or somebody here better explain.”
Or what, Quigley? You’re going to report our “communications” to the NKVD? You’re an idiot.
On the issue of the protestant riots, mainly note against the RUC police, I am on the side of the protestants, and I am opposed to Adams and co, the catholics have their state in the south, so let the protestants have theirs, with their flag flying all of the time.
I am opposed to Dervolin and his position on Irish Antisemitism . Can Dervolin tell us anything he is doing to combat this Antisemitism?
Is Dervolin saying that to be Irish is to be Antisemitic? I do think he is saying this so he had better explain, or somebody here better explain.
@ Fnord:
Listen to me good Fnord. That Nazi german owned sabotaging pestilence activites are nothing deserving protection.. The era when Jews have to accept capos and their foreign handlers in our midst is over. That garbage pile is the service branch of EU, US and islamic filth bent on harming our people. Long ago the people here should have forced that stain to be erased.
And the time is nearing.
“And you, sir, seem like a pro-Israeli fascist.”
What is a “pro-Israeli fascist”? This term is new to me. Is this a compliment? If it is, then I’m definitely a pro-Israeli fascist. “No surrender!”
“Seize a legal paper by government force?”
What on earth are you talking about? If the paper is legal, this means the government of the day permits its existence. Why would the government have to “seize” it? Sir.
“In my eyes you’re nothing more than a political transvestite.”
And you, sir, seem like a pro-Israeli fascist. Seize a legal paper by government force? Wich part of democracy did you not understand?
Ireland: the land of my dear ancestors and an eternal well-spring of pro-Palestinian blather.
“Ah Michael you raise so many things there and I am so glad you did. Let’s explore it.”
Don’t talk to me like this is some kind of school outing. I utterly despise your disgusting and twisted views on Israel and the Jewish people. I’d sooner go for a walk with a pet pig than “explore” anything with you. Don’t kid yourself.
And my family has an IRA history (Armagh and Down), we’re related to the Black Donnellys, so you don’t fool me about anything to do with Ireland’s political landscape. It always has been a boiling cess pool of anti-Jewish hatred (a shame before G-D and man). In my eyes you’re nothing more than a political transvestite.
@ Felix Quigley:
May I join?
I believe that at this point wasting time with the “ha’aretz” or “Ynet” is just that. Waste of time. They are being stomped down by reality every day.
It is very clear that a major shift in Israeli political and strategic thinking is taking place.
I am not sure that the whole shift will be completed before elections but certainly the trend will continue.
Mr. Netanyahu never thought he would get caught on his own web. He did.
Within the likud his stock is falling by the hour. What the count will be after election day is hard to forecast but I doubt the Likud under him will endure. He may win for a day, but that is about all.
I forgot to mention Ireland. I understand that they are killing each other again, this time about whose flag flies which days over I do not know which building.
Ireland anti-Semitism is relegated a bit by that vital issue…
“Is my suggestion to close Haaretz and hand it over to the intelligent youth…”
Are you suggesting a civil war within Israel? How else to “close Haaretz and hand it over”??
Ah Michael you raise so many things there and I am so glad you did. Let’s explore it.
I wrote the following:
You leave out the first sentence and so distort the meaning of what I said. Not friendly Michael. But what would YOU do. What SUGGESTIONS do you have?
Is my suggestion to close Haaretz and hand it over to the intelligent youth on Jews News not a good suggestion. Come on Michael let’s discuss…
“we Irish are known everywhere to be pretty stupid people”
Speak for yourself.
“There is a stream of lies coming out of Israel which is polluting the Irish air and these lies are Antisemitism.”
The air in Ireland was polluted with antisemitism long time ago. “Before Joshua and Judges, and before Leviticus committed Deuteronomy.”
“the weapon or party will proceed on day one to close down Haaretz, take over its presses, give the presses to the patriotic youth in Jews News, arrest Abbas for his association in word and deed with Hajj Amin el Husseini, place both on trial the latter in absentia.”
Dream on. You must be writing from David Sternlight’s planet.
What if Likud-Betaenu get less than 30 like 28 minus 12 is 16 In the likud top 20 at least 10…
I know Jews are very smart and we Irish are known everywhere to be pretty stupid people, all those potatoes you know, but heck i just cant follow this stuff…
I know now why Einstein just had to be Jewish…
But i jest and I follow the main outlines which are here I think
All I have learned of Israeli political classes ever since the time of Dir Yassin betrayal of the Lehi fighters, which the ruling elite had used to fight in Dir Yassin, then betrayed so grossly, is that Netanyahu is one of those, an agent of the US essentially, not paid but ideologically an agent, like so many, and that Netanyahu will move in that direction, to close down a good part of Judea and Samaria to Jews, keep the large settlements on about 5 per cent, use extreme force to do this, and use the world media and world elites to insist on this, but this insisting is what people like Netanyahu play into.
I have been watching this new Bennett Party, and also watching a new development Jews News, and i will just say that where you need a hard fighting weapon, here you have a lot of froth and no hard fighting weapon.
This has been thrown about on an Antisemitic site in Ireland called indymedia. and is from an outfit called Wafa, which is located in Israel, part of OSLO, and I ask what is needed in Israel to close down this outfit. I suspect the person posting on this Indymedia site in Ireland is not Irish but is American.
There are dark forces at lay in the world. Israel is being singled out by Obama and Ashton for a purpose.
There is a stream of lies coming out of Israel which is polluting the Irish air and these lies are Antisemitism.
If you answer this question then you answer all questions. you do not need Jews News. You need a party, a weapon.
the weapon or party will proceed on day one to close down Haaretz, take over its presses, give the presses to the patriotic youth in Jews News, arrest Abbas for his association in word and deed with Hajj Amin el Husseini, place both on trial the latter in absentia.
That is totally doable. Also doable is to address the Arabs in all of Israel which includes Gaza and the Judea Samaria region to either be Israel or to have all rights removed, and that means all rights. This includes the right to a job, the right to a vote and so on. THAT is a political position to take up on day one. I have much more but heck after that day one I would stop for an Irish whiskey…
Tomorrow at 14 hours a Meeting will be held including former Likud Central Commiitte Members, other parties reps, a number of activists, military officers, members of the Academy and one carefully selected member of the press.
I participatedwill be there.
The puropse of the Meeting is to review the apparent changes in the Israeli political settings and determine steps we as a group could set in motion to advance a 8 Point Plan and other activities long in preparation.
Internal Likud polls and a poll being run by a group of HS students working with us, indicate that at this time the Likud-Beitenu “union, has 32 mandates and the trend is negative. Mr. Bennett’s NRP plus, remains with 16+ mandates on a positive trend, Labor with 17, Lapid with 9 and Livni with 8.
Should the “union” drop to 30, given that as Yamit reports, Lieberman or his appointee will move on with 12 mandates, then the likud would remain with 18 mandates. Hardly enough to rule the cauldron.
Considering the ruinous state of the military command and the collapsing settings of the Peresites, we assume that the time is approaching to facilitate alternative leadership to emerge. Risks will be high as the Obama operatives and local elites will reeact fast and furious… 🙂
Netanyahu’s hold within the Likud is weakening fast and he will not be able to remain as top there if that is the election outcome.
Two further major subjects will also be made part of our Meeting.
The promotion of the formation of the British model of a “shadow government”.
Advance of legislation to incorporate to the Israel Basic Law of the equivalent of the US Constitution Second Amendment.
We should not count on the demise of super stunt meister Netanyahu just yet. Major money and operational help is proping the fellow up.
MODERATE ABBAS PRAISES NAZI MUFTI
Is the Israeli government doing its best to protect Israel and to denounce Arab Nazis in the PA and Gaza?
Au contraire, the Israeli government rescinds plans for new construction in Israel’s capital, thereby agreeing with the world that Israel has no rights to Jerusalem – at a crucial time when the PA has officially changed its name to the State of Palestine.
Furthermore, the government is eagerly pursuing an arrangement for the surrender of land for their Arab Nazi state.
@ yamit82:
Thank you, Yamit. I always wondered what would happen if Israelis were to wake up one day and a big majority of them voted for a decidedly patriotic political party (Strong Israel, for instance) and such party tried to implement full annexation, electoral and judicial reform, and a hard line against Arab criminality. How would the IDF brass react? Knowing the US track record of meddling in other countries, we can only guess the degree of not just influence but actual control they have over the top brass. That’s what I am concerned about.
~~~~~~
When the Arab Spring was in full swing, with regimes teetering, I read that many top ministers and top military in those countries had substantial bank accounts in US banks. All the US govt had to do was say “If you want to see those dollars again, do as we tell you” – thus the defections.
~~~~~~
So the question is, how can Israelis make sure the IDF won’t become a tool of foreign powers against a democratically elected Israeli government? (I had originally typed “a tool against Israeli Jews” but – sadly – that’s already a fact.)
@ Canadian Otter:
Very simple but multidimensional and multifaceted. Israel keeps a permanent organization and cadre of military and civilian DD, personnel in America for tours up to and sometimes exceeding two years in NYC and Washington DC. Israel has staff assigned to American military contractors Like Boeing and MD. In some cases these Israelis in and out of Uniform but all under the auspices of Israeli Ministry of Defense are paid by the contractors in addition to their government pay in Israel.
Israeli officers train in America in the operational use and maint. of new weapons systems purchased by Israel. Israeli senior officers are frequently seen in the Pentagon. All Israeli senior officers attend the US Army War College but not just.
This is on the professional level.
The other level is the social one wining and dinning our officers, hob nobbling with some of the who’s who in the American military and being on a first name basis. Israel is a small provincial country and our officers are promoted through the ranks and get a university education only when they reach a certain rank which makes them eligible. When they experience the size and wealth of the American military compared to the relatively spartan conditions we have here they are not only impressed they are for lack of a better term mesmerized. They take those impressions back home with them and try to emulate as much as they can of Americanisms. They are addicted to expensive hi-tech military toys along with the accompanied American military doctrines.
Our Senior military officers spend a lot of time in America and are treated in most cases with deference party’s American credit cards with high limits even escorts. Once they are corrupted they belong to America and of course not all are corrupted in the same manner. What ever the poison and what ever works. Many are promised well paying jobs within the American Military Industrial complex when they retire.
In other words different strokes for different folks. When these officers rise to positions of influence in the IDF, America knows them pretty well and what buttons to push.
This is not the whole picture but it should give you some idea. The system does not only apply to Israel but every country having a close military relationship with America like Japan, Korea, Taiwan, Pakistan, Egypt, Jordan, Saudia Arabia and Turkey to name some of the most prominent. Influence peddling through weapons sales is what it amounts to. The difference is that Israel seems to be the only such country to transfer her sovereignty and independence to the Americans. And for Peanuts
yamit82 Said:
And they are???
@ yamit82:
Yamit, would you please elaborate? And about US govt control of the IDF? Thanks!
@ Shy Guy:
Yes but that was part of the personal infighting consequences but not the underlying perfidy which was the stealing of documents and planting a spy with Barak to inform Ashkenazi surrogates as to what was going on and collecting any dirt on Barak. Iran and their motivation to torpedo any decision was the driving motivation all the rest is BS power struggles that always happened between DM’s in the past and the COS IDF.
Insiders say what we know from the Inspector General report is only the tip of the iceberg to this story.
Another innocuous comment blocked by spam filter. c’mon???
yamit82 Said:
That’s not quite what I heard on the report. They said that Barak held up the entire appointment process of 100s of senior officers over a squabble between him and Ashkenazi that should have been smoothed over and resolved by Barak himself.
@ Canadian Otter:
Deri can’t play the race card anymore with the Jews so he is looking to buy Arab votes. The end of Shas as as many Arabs that might flock to Shas more Jews will flee. I live in Shas Heaven and the people I know are not exactly fans of the Arabs. 🙂 Shows Deri is out of touch and Shas is due to lose many votes to Ben Ari and Marzel. Desperate politicians do stupid and desperate acts.
comment in moderation again!!!
@ Shy Guy:
Under inflated as it was an attempt of near Putsch by trying to subvert the political map and decisions of the political decision makers by members of the general staff. In the background was the IDF opposition to Israel attacking Iran. They stooped short of an actual coup but tried to subvert. That’s about as serious as you can get and until there is a real criminal investigation or one slated by Uri Ariel’s committee to garner and bring to light ll of the culprits and their pats we still don’t know all of the facts. BB was blamed because he knew about the relationship and did nothing to stop it.
@ Eric R.:
The President of Israel nominates the party most likely to form the required coalition. Usually the party garnering the most votes but also how many other parties and their numerical votes support the leading party 61 votes are required for a simple majority. Last election Livni and Kadima had one more vote than BB and Likud but didn’t have enough support from other parties so BB and likud formed the government.
Peres is against BB and will do what he can to block the likud. Till now now no coalition, ever considered including the Arab parties in a coalition either right or left, that’s about 10-11 mandates should be discounted from the electoral strength of the left. which is about 43-44 mandates according to polls last week. Theoretically there are several different scenarios but for them to actualize there needs to be a wider swing in votes away from the Likud than we see in any of the recent polls.
I wonder if INN will release the talkbacks on OJ and his party which I posted earlier today.
SHAS WARMLY RECEIVED AT ARAB VILLAGE –
SHAS on the side of Arabs – and Shas minister did nothing to stop African infiltration until forced to do so.
@ yamit82:
I listened to the report’s findings on the radio. The one that really comes out bad here is Barak, not BB nor Ashkenazi. But overall, this whole affair was an inflated balloon.
Likud and BB could lose another couple mandates over this criminal scandal
Watchdog finds hostility, mistrust and paralysis at top of Israel’s security establishment
Investigation, which could now prompt criminal charges, shows utter breakdown of relations between former IDF chief and defense minister in 2009-11, faults Barak but lays principal blame with Ashkenazi and his top aide; Netanyahu rapped for not intervening
By Mitch Ginsburg
Eric R. Said:
No. Unless the earth swallows up Netanyahu and the left.
Working on it!
yamit82 Said:
Yep.
Eric R. Said:
This is a possibility. Feiglin has said so. Well, not necessarily BY but leaving the Likud. This would especially hold true if the loyal nationalists within the Likud themselves abandoned the party.
As I am not in Israel, is there any chance that the religious parties/rightist parties led by Bennett could win enough seats that they form the coalition, and Bennett becomes PM?
@ Shy Guy:
Look at some of the possibilities;
We don’t know where Leiberman will wind up in or out of Jail.
We don’t know that even if he avoids jail whether he will be eligible to sit in the Knesset not to mention the government?
We don’t know how long it will take for his situation to become clear.
But if Lieberman bolts from the Likud he takes 12 mandates with him. Leaves hi with a net loss of only 3seats from current strength.
That would leave the likud depending on final count with between 20-24 seats.
At least half the Likud list would fit smoothly into Bayit Hayudi
If BB in-order to keep Bayit HaYudi and Shas out of the coalition in favor of all three parties to the left which is a possibility and at least 7
Likud MK’s form a separate faction supporting Bayit Hayudi they would become the strongest faction in the Knesset, that Lieberman Shas and Degel Hatorah would join.
That would be the strongest national configuration possible with Eldad they could reach 70 or more seats. without the Likud and the parties to the left.
Your fears make no sense because BB potentially could have had it all including one or more parties on the left. The only reason I can fathom that he would risk political suicide is that he is planning to implement policies that would be opposed not only by some of the Likud lemmings but some of those to the right. Shas revolves around budgets more than any other considerations as does Degel.. They can always be bought with money and a couple of ministries. Shas is also bleeding votes to Bennett and Eldad especially to Eldad as is Aguda. Young Haredi are becoming more Israeli and more independent.
Feiglin whether he wants to or not will need to come over to Bayit HaYehudi one way or another. I am not convinced the Likud will survive BB.
I have a feeling Prof Degani’s poll is close to the truth than all the others, not because they favor the parties I support but because of the wide variance with all the other polls and the Hysteria of BB and Lieberman.
In the end the ground game and organization will determine the spreads. Whose camp is most motivated to get out the vote and what % stay home.
Soldiers votes can also be worth a couple of seats. I wold be surprised if the Likud garners a majority, especially after Gaza Rockets only two months ago.
yamit82 Said:
Could be spin but I’ve personally assumed until now that Bennet is not much different than Hershkowitz was.
Mafdal version 37.
I also have a fear for some time – but no proof – that Bennet is (still) BB’s stealth assistant, that he’s a plant in the Mafdal and that the super-clumsy smear campaign by the Likud against the right in general and Bennet in particular was to intentionally draw off nationalists from the Likud to BY.
BB SPIN??
A Labor-Habayit Hayehudi alliance?
PM: Left will ‘stop at nothing’ to bring down my government Duh!!!!!
Key goal of next term will be overcoming the Iranian nuclear threat, says Netanyahu, dismissing ex-intelligence chief’s assault on him
Here it is in print:
Avigdor Liberman: Next government will continue to seek two-state solution
Yisrael Beytenu head says Israel does not have ‘imperialistic ambitions’; comments rejected as disingenuous by left-wing leaders
In my article I said center-right when I intended center-left. I just changed it.
For all Feiglin Fans: Feiglin is now 24 on the joint list of Likud-Betanu. If Leiberman does split after the elections with a guaranteed 12 MK, how many will be left to the Likud? Feiglin was 15 on the Likud List.
What if Likud-Betaenu get less than 30 like 28 minus 12 is 16 In the likud top 20 at least 10 potentially could eiter force a break or a move to replace internally BB with another head of Party and replacement for BB as PM if he in fact becomes PM. The worse BB and the Likud does at the polls the anger among Likudniks and those shut off the list might push BB even to resign.
Comment in moderation
I think BB and Liebermans statement and pathetically transparent maneuvering mean that their internal polling is much worse for their prospects than the commercial mainstream polling we see daily. We are close to putting the so called right wing Likud MK’s to the test. All they need are 7 MK’s to break with the Likud and form a separate political faction. That’s what Sharon did when he broke with the Likud.
Who will Lead the Palace Revolt in the Likud? Budget still needs to be approved and as it stands it won’t pass which also could bring down a BB led government. BB called elections because Shas refused to back it. Nothing has changed except BB is now weaker than before he called new elections a year ahead of his end of term.
Lieberman is reported to have said that the Liked-Betaneu will have as a basis for forming the next coalition BB’s Bar Ilan speech, 2 states.
That will negate Bennett and open the way for the parties to the left.
Question is will those Likud MK’s who oppose this form a separate faction and join Bennett to block them. According to the Rules they would need 7 MK’s. That would certainy put Feiglin to the Test and Hotovely and Elkin among others.
Apparently BB has given up on expecting to wooo Likud voters from Bennett and is maneuvering to form a center left if not outright leftist coalition. How many more likud voters will now switch to parties to the right of BB?
Likud might wind up with 30 or less based on BB/Leiberman maneuvers. Leiberman may never return to politics if he is not exonerated and that could take up to a year to find out. Leiberman is wedded to Bar Ilan speech as much as BB, so even if he splits from the Likud he will support BB and the Likud as an Independent Party Unless he is convicted and Shamir as #2 becomes effective head of the party, He like his father have an innate dislike of BB and trust him not a bit. even if BB takes in all three Jewish parties to the left of the Likud, he will need either Shas or Degel ha Torah. I see him dumping Shas if he can and keeping he smaller Degel. All depends on the final tally.
I think Bayit ha Yehudi and Shas should support Labor to form the next government. That would give them first shot at forming the next government. BB could be shut out of forming the next government. If Bennett and Shas are out of a coalition, why should they support BB and the Likud to form the next government?
Of he last two polls I read about one showed Eldad with 6 seats, the other not reaching the minimum threshold. I think I’ll just ignore the polls and wait for the election.