By MEMBERS OF THE FRIENDS OF ISRAEL INITIATIVE
Now is the moment of truth for the Palestinians. They must choose negotiations, with all that such negotiations entail.
The unilateral declaration of a Palestinian state, and its international recognition, would be a huge mistake.
A peace agreement between Israelis and Palestinians is essential, but can be achieved only through honest negotiations – not by one party imposing a unilateral decision.
Over the past two years, the Palestinian Authority has refused to sit at the negotiating table with the Israeli government, hiding behind the excuse of construction work on a few West Bank settlements. At the same time, it has been negotiating the creation of a national unity government with Hamas – a terrorist group whose stated aim is the elimination of Israel. A Palestinian “government” of a unilaterally established, self-declared “Palestinian state” in which Hamas is a member will make negotiations, to say nothing of a peace agreement, impossible.
US President Barack H. Obama has recently advocated a return to talks based on the pre-1967 lines with mutual landswaps.
But even those lines, as delineated in the 1949 Armistice Agreements, were subject to negotiations in accordance with UN Security Council Resolutions 242 and 338, which both sides agreed at the time would form the basis for a future peace agreement. Any future border, according to these resolutions, must be the outcome of a negotiated agreement.
The unilateral declaration of Palestinian statehood is also a clumsily concealed delegitimization device. Serious Palestinians know very well that they do not meet the internal and external requirements to become a viable state, much less a new UN member with all its attendant obligations.
Their objective is different; the unilateral declaration is in reality simply another tactic in a broader strategy of embarrassing and then delegitimizing the State of Israel.
There is no historical, institutional or legal basis for recognizing a Palestinian state today, except as a kind of “virtual state” which exists in the imaginations of various parties but which has no tether to reality. In the West Bank, Palestinians depend on Israeli cooperation to function. Other modern aspects of statehood, such as respect for human rights, freedom and a functioning democracy – all of which are required of other countries seeking recognition – are sadly lacking in the Palestinian case. Indeed, this rush to a unilateral declaration of statehood, including the intra-Palestinian negotiations with Hamas, is impeding the formation of civil society in the West Bank, which has made progress in recent years and which is essential to any enduring peace.
A declaration of Palestinian statehood by the UN General Assembly will only make it even more difficult to find a solution.
Unilateral action will have unforeseeable consequences; the only true way forward is through a bilateral agreement.
This is not the time for destructive gestures: it is time to encourage everyone to sit down and negotiate face to face, with no preconditions other than mutual and unequivocal recognition.
There cannot be two states living in peace side by side unless Palestinians accept that Israel is the nation-state of the Jewish people and the Israelis accept that the Palestinian state will be the state of the Palestinian people. Without that basis, no genuine progress will be made.
The government in Jerusalem has said on numerous occasions that it is ready to talk. Now is the moment of truth for the Palestinians. They must choose negotiations, with all that such negotiations entail, including concessions by both parties.
The alternative is for representatives of the Palestinian people to continue demonizing their only possible negotiating partner while expecting the international community to tilt the scales in their favor. But blackmail will lead to disaster.
Negotiations must be conducted in good faith, not as a means of exerting international pressure.
It’s time for the international community, starting with the UN, to say the time for game-playing and wishful thinking is past.
Serious negotiations can only be conducted by the Israelis and Palestinians themselves, no matter how much help or goodwill is provided from the outside. A unilaterally declared Palestinian state which is not the product of a bilateral negotiation is a demand that Israel accept the unacceptable.
Diplomacy demands, above all, negotiation and agreement, not unilateral demands imposed with contempt.
The undersigned all have a sincere desire to see a Palestinian state alongside Israel, living in a lasting and stable peace. We therefore call on all leaders of the European Union and the Western world to reject the PA’s current position. We urge the Palestinians to see that the only way they can have their own state is through an agreement with the Israelis. No other options should be supported. Only sincere dialogue and the unconditional recognition of each side by the other can form the basis for renewed negotiations. Only sincere dialogue and the unconditional recognition of each side by the other can set the foundations of a viable Palestinian state.
This piece was co-written by members of the Friends of Israel Initiative (): Jose Maria Aznar, David Trimble, Alejandro Toledo, George Weidenfeld, Marcello Pera, Andrew Roberts, Fiamma Nirenstein, George Weigel, Robert Agostinelli, Carlos Bustelo and William Shawcross.
Because a real student of history would know that it were mostly-Christian Goyim that rescued Jews from the Nazis and for giving Israel a tiny slice of their ancestral homeland as a safe have after they had lost this allegedly “promised land” to Muslim occupiers and for helping Israel survive since its inception.
Unfortunately, that’s not what you said. You were responding to a well know bigot on this forum who does not make such a distinction and you agreed with him.
I think you just described yourself. It takes a morally bankrupt piece of shit to agree with a well known bigot by writing, “….., I agree with you, any Jew who trusts in the Goyim is a fool.” and then, when called out, whining that what you were trying to say was different.
@AmericanEagle –
‘No student of history would write to a fellow-bigot, “That being said, I agree with you, any Jew who trusts in the Goyim is a fool.”’ Really! Why?
Do you understand Goyim is plural? Of course there was Darius, Lord Balfour, A danish Lutheran pastor who preached from the pulpit during the occupation: “I’d rather die with the Jews than live with the nazis”. Tricky dicky Nixon and many other others.
What I was trying to say is that Jews should never expect Goyim collectively to ride to their rescue.
“This unfortunate decision was more than offset by all that was done for Jews and Israel subsequently and continues to this day to the tune of billions of dollars a year and guarantees of survival.” Millions dying has been offset by cash. You are either stupid or a morally bankrupt piece of shit.
No student of history would write to a fellow-bigot, “That being said, I agree with you, any Jew who trusts in the Goyim is a fool.”
You will eventually discover that I am only obstinate and intolerant of bigots and terrorists, regardless of which religious text they claim as their inspiration.
Bigot – “obstinate and intolerant adherent of a creed or view” Hang on. That sounds just like you!
Me, I’m just a student of history.
Apparently you use evidence selectively. This unfortunate decision was more than offset by all that was done for Jews and Israel subsequently and continues to this day to the tune of billions of dollars a year and guarantees of survival.
Why would I care about an exchange between two bigots who both use evidence selectively? I was reacting to your comment to the other bigot, “That being said, I agree with you, any Jew who trusts in the Goyim is a fool.”
AE says “whereas Jews like you and Andrew are bigoted against everyone else.”
You have just lightened my day. Did you fail reading comprehension in school?
If you followed the discussion between Yamit and me, you would have noted his scepticism about my (evangelical) support of Israel.
I do like wearing around my blue and white kippa my mother brought back from Israel though.
AmericanEagle says:
Scientific proof the Torah is true!!
Genesis & The Big Bang Theory – Dr.Gerald Schroeder
Scientific Proof of God
If G-d exists and the Torah is G-ds truth and instructions for living then all claims politically is within the framework of Torah.
Sorry, get the facts right before you shoot from the hip:
Christian scholar Rt. Rev. George Arthur Butterick, in The Interpreter?s Dictionary of the Bible, a book written by to prove the validity of the New Testament, states:
“A study of 150 Greek [manuscripts] of the Gospel of Luke has revealed more than 30,000 different readings…. It is safe to say that there is not one sentence in the New Testament in which the [manuscript] is wholly uniform.”
There are 304,805 letters (approximately 79,000 words) in the Torah. In the over 3,000 years since Moses received the original Scripture from Mt. Sinai and wrote the 13 copies (twelve of which were distributed among the Tribes), spelling variants have emerged on a total of nine words — with absolutely no effect on their meaning. The Christian Bible, in comparison, has over 200,000 variants and in 400 instances, the variants change the meaning of the text; 50 of these are of great significance.
The NT meets your understanding The NT may have been written by well-meaning men based on their faith beliefs. The claims of NT being divine or that Jesus ever existed cannot be proven by science. There is no scientific or historical evidence that your Jesus ever existed.
Archeological evidence found in Egypt substantiates the exodus. No Historical evidence of jesus and there are so many inconsistencies in the NT to make it a joke in so far as it relates to divinity. This is what Christians did to our bible. You Christians have no intellectual ethics when it comes to your efforts to usurp Judaism.
What scientic proof do you have proving obama is worse than Bush or Carter even your IDOL (god) Reagan The antisemite?
If you were not so ignorant you would have written Hindus, not Indians. The difference is that Hindus are only bigoted against other Hindus, whereas Jews like you and Andrew are bigoted against everyone else.
The Torah is no more credible than the NT – they were both written by well-meaning men based on their faith beliefs. The claims of both cannot be proven by science. Thus, to make political claims on behalf of Israel based on the Torah, is bogus.
The last paragraph in No. 8 above details why you are a bigot when you write, “any Jew who trusts in the Goyim is a fool”.
Thanks for confirming AGAIN that you are a bigot. Jews and Israel would be toast without the mostly-Christians who saved millions of Jews, gave the Jews a slice of their original homeland that they had lost for centuries back to them as a safe haven and have since underwritten their security and their survival.
AE, why am I a bigot? I was just thinking back to the late 1930’s when the Jews in Germany were trying to get out of the country. My country, your country and every other civilised nation closed its door to Jews.
When someone gets married a second time, they don’t expect any emotional support from their new spouse. Any they get is a bonus. Jews who know history at all would feel the same about support from the goyim. It might be nice, but you can’t rely or depend on it.
@ AmericanEagle:
AmericanEagle Said:
There is no nation or people on the planet more bigoted than Indians. Caste system …Sudras and those with no caste.. Untouchables, between them are hundreds of millions of poor mostly impoverished Indians.
As for you calling the G-d of Israel the author of bigoted crap, then you would also agree that the whole of the NT is a rehash of most of the pagan myths in the ancient world and the man-god invention called Jesus is pure pagan non historical myth …………………….Any reference in Jewish scripture that Christians believe foretells of Jesus coming and or substantiates him was by your description also the author of bigoted crap.
Looks like we have a closet bigot here who, ironically, lives among Goyim in Australia.
Get a clue about what Goyim have done for Israel from the last part of No. 8 above.
On the other hand 56% of American Jews still support the most anti-Semitic president in US history.
Just because someone wrote this bigoted crap does not make it sensible or valid.
@ Andrew:
Nope, but I don’t just take someones verbal declaration of support at face value either. 🙂
My arguments were not directed towards you personally or anyone else but as a statement of general principles.
You should know better than me, but tell that to other stupid Jews who cling to every supposed kind or supportive word from the gentiles. They need those words to feel uplifted into believing they are not alone. They fear being alone and I Welcome it because that’s how it was meant to be as a natural state of the Jewish people.
Read here: “A nation that dwells alone”
(Numbers 23:9)
Tammuz 6, 5771/July 8, 2011
@yamit82 –
Do you have a series of hoops for us to jump through or a checklist for us to complete to prove our bona fides?
Actually I do post on Al Jazeera, the Guardian etc.
The thing I’m most proud of doing is, when my daughter, was on the student council at La Trobe University (the most leftist university in Melbourne) giving her answers to say to the council when they brought up (regularly) the “free Palestine” issue.
That being said, I agree with you, any Jew who trusts in the Goyim is a fool.
To Yamit82,
I respect what you have to say and what the Torah says. Hopefully, Jews in other countries will realize they should go to Israel and serve in the IDF. After serving in the IDF, hopefully, they will decide they want to stay in Israel.
I am not a Jew and I have no idea who these guys are, but, as an American who supports Israel more than many Jews – definitely more than the 56% of American Jews who still support Imam Obama for reasons that astound me – my nose is as good as anyone elses where Israel is concerned. If I were Bibi I would simply make talking to anyone about the Palestinians for any reason contingent on three things:
a) The Palis accepting in public and in writing Israel’s right to exist as a Jewish state
b) The Palis renouncing violence publicly and in writing
c) The Palis formally amending the charters of all their Palestinian organizations to reflect these conditions.
Case closed. No talks. Any Pali leader who accepts these conditions, which anyone who really wants peace cannot reject, will sleep with Allah that night.
Absolutely right. As a Christian I do not want the physical origins of my religion in the hands of Islamic barbarians ever again.
Have you heard of the Khilafah Movement? It will curl your hair without going to the hairdresser:
http://alkhilafah.net/
This is the organization behind this movement:
http://english.hizbuttahrir.org/index.php/about-us
Quote:
Hizb ut-Tahrir is a political party whose ideology is Islam. Its objective is to resume the Islamic way of life by establishing an Islamic State that executes the systems of Islam and carries its call to the world.
Unquote.
That may be YOUR final analysis but I consider it to be gratuitous and ungrateful poppycock.
European Jews were rescued from extinction by WW-II fought by mostly non-Jewish Allies. Israel was formed with the assistance of mostly-Christian Brits who had taken the Levant away from the Ottoman occupiers, after Jews had been essentially driven out of their ancestral homeland several centuries earlier. For decades now, mostly Christian Americans have helped Israel with BILLIONS a year in loans, grants, UNSC vetoes and mutually beneficial technological and arms deals, as well as the public George W. Bush pledge to stand with Israel against any nuclear threats from Iran. Israel would be toast without its non-Jewish supporters – especially since there are so many Jews – mostly in America – who are indifferent to the security of Israel.
@ Linda Rivera:
I disagree!
Jews who refuse to join in our struggle or are indifferent to our sacrifices have lost any rights to the Land of Israel and that includes any demands or rights to have a say in our national project.
The Torah makes clear that serving to protect and defend the people of Israel is equated with loyalty to G-d. For example, when the tribes of Gad, Reuven and half of Menashe wanted to settle east of the Jordan river, Moshe (Moses) rebukes them because he thinks they are trying to avoid military service:
Moshe (Moses) answered the descendants of Gad and Reuven saying: shall your brothers go to war while you remain here? (Numbers 32:6).
He goes on to equate the possible avoidance of military service with turning against G-d. He accuses them of being no better than the spies who forced the people to wander for 40 years in the desert:
Now behold you have risen up in the place of your fathers, a brood of transgressors, to bring even more of God’s wrath upon Israel. If you turn away from Him, He will leave us in the wilderness and you will have destroyed this whole people (Numbers 32: 15)
Moshe (Moses) is not satisfied until he extracts a promise from the tribes of Gad, Reuven and half of Menashe that they will serve in war against Israel’s enemies.
@ Andrew:
Fact: most countries with sizable pro Israel support (mostly based on polling) seem to have, judging by results no influence on their governments policies when it pertains to Israel. Most give no financial support to Israel by purchasing Israeli products, most do not travel to Israel in lieu of other destinations, industrialists do not open factories or businesses in Israel, nor do they turn out in numbers when Jewish /Israel issues are taken to the streets in protest: like when Mahmoud Ahmadinejad appeared at Columbia U. and when he addresses each year the UN GA.
How much support do pro Israel academics receive in the Wests institutions of higher learning? How much support do Jewish students attacked by Muslims and their leftist supporters receive from non Jewish students and faculties How many voices are raised by non Jews on blogs not noted for their pro Israel support? I could add to my list many many other things pro Israel supporters could do to really prove their support.
Being just the enemy of my enemy in my book is a specious argument when speaking of pro Israel support. There may be a confluence of interests temporarily but in the end they change faster than not, like France before 67.
Saying one is pro Israel may or may not be sincere but unless there are some positive actions in demonstrating that support, however pleasing to some Jews ears (not mine) remains what it is … Of little practical significance or consequence for us in a practical sense.
One thing is for sure; I would not bet my life on such support, in Israel the danger is some might and that might be suicidal especially if our leaders believe and depend on such support. In the final analysis the best we can expect from the non Jew is indifference.
“The undersigned all have a sincere desire to see a Palestinian state alongside Israel, living in a lasting and stable peace.”
The above statement disgusts me. I do NOT consider people who seek a Palestinian state to be friends of Israel. Claiming there will be a lasting and stable peace is an extremely WICKED deception and I am bitterly disappointed with the so called “Friends of Israel.”
G-D help Israel if these are supposed to be Israel’s friends. I had actually thought before, that they were friends of Israel. Their statement proves I was wrong.
One third of Palestinian Authority Muslims APPROVED of the barbaric murders of the Fogel family including the little children. What inhuman monsters. A majority of PA Muslims approved of the cruel murders of the yeshiva students in Jerusalem some time ago. Monsters.
What kind of people want to give such utterly inhuman people-PA Muslims, their own terror state carved out of little Israel?
To Ed Katz:
Whether Jews are in New York or anywhere else, it does NOT alter the fact that the nation of Israel was given to EVERY Jew who ever lived and will ever live. Regardless of the geographical location of Jews.
Jews everywhere have the right to speak up for the defense of Israel. It’s also called FREEDOM of speech.
For those who are not Jews, it is also a huge concern. Israel, America and other Free World countries are attacked by global jihad. The goal: Islamic conquest of the entire world.
Hindus are also concerned over the fate of Israel. Huge numbers of Hindus are extremely pro-Israel. India’s Hindus suffer from daily jihad.
@Ed Katz –
Have you heard of the sayings: “My enemy’s enemy is my friend”. Or, “you don’t look a gift horse in the mouth”?
Wrong Ed. Google them. They are very important advocates for Israel.
Who the hell are the “friends of Israel Initiative”? If they are not Jews, tell them to keep their noses out of our business. If they are Jews, tell them to stay in New York and keep their noses out of Israel’s business.